Destroyed a ColdSteel Longhunter-Part Deux

Given the metaphor, that's actually a good example. Presented with a mile-wide, raging forest fire, throwing a can of gas or a similarly sized can of water makes no appreciable difference either way. Neither have any affect on the cultural trend moving inexorably forward (this is what the forest fire represents), but certainly the person throwing the gas and the person throwing the water have different feelings about what they are doing, and will go home and sleep well (or not) based on their actions.
 
Or I could say that given the circumstance all you are saying is you would rather give the politicians and those who fear objects more ammo.

I am saying less ammo is better for the cause we both agree on.

Take your pick, but logic tells me that fueling a fire that you wish to stop is not the answer to the problem of the fire and there is no way I can realistcaly defend anyone who does that.
 
Plus if enough people are throwing water on that raging fire, it will not burn as long.

If enough people are throwing cans of gasoline on that fire, it will burn longer and cause more damage.

I'll chose water every time.
 
I say let Lynn Thompson and everyone else have their freedom and that we all stand together firm and strong for our Constitutional rights and not allow them to be modified and amended and to be interpretted and followed to the letter as originally intended and written.
 
I wonder if Ron Popeil markets knives? Pocketfisherman, pocketknife. I see a possible connection here.
 
Bastid said:
Or I could say that given the circumstance all you are saying is you would rather give the politicians and those who fear objects more ammo.

I am saying less ammo is better for the cause we both agree on.

Take your pick, but logic tells me that fueling a fire that you wish to stop is not the answer to the problem of the fire and there is no way I can realistcaly defend anyone who does that.
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I'm saying that they're going to do what they do regardless of whether we try to hide or not. I also think there is real benefit in refusing to hide; I think standing up for one's rights includes acknowedging that weapons are not illegitimate or otherwise politically incorrect.
 
Please understand that I have a legal CCW.
Please understand that with that comes the legal requirement to be discreet. To me that is a common sense legal requirement that is quite valid. It also contributes to an obvious advantage along with legitimate training for me should I ever be placed in the position that I use my weapon.

Waving a weapon around and beating my chest about it is foolish on many levels and does little but to add fuel to a raging fire.

Go ahead and add fuel. I choose water. Logic should be considered rather than rhetoric as to which stance gives more ammo to the folks who would rather see us disarmed. One shows responsibility, the other shows reckless behavior.

Your own example of putting gasoline on a raging fire proves that beyond a shadow of a doubt.
 
Believing that one should stand up for one's rights in the face of a society determine to marginalize and render culturally illegitimate the validity of weapons (be they knives, guns, or whatever) is not quite the same as "beating your chest" and "waving around" a weapon.

I don't believe there's any benefit in hiding. Certainly it hasn't stemmed the cultural tide. Sheeple and hoplophobes cannot be appeased. Too many people operate under the mistaken notion that if we're just quiet enough, if we just hide enough, we'll somehow get by without making them upset, and everything will be okay. The lessons of history to this point illustrate that, quite to the contrary, it doesn't matter what we do; they'll march inexorably forward regardless.
 
So how can you honestly defend a market style that is quite equivalent to "beating your chest" and "waving around" a weapon.

I am not talking about standing up for ones rights I am not talking about hiding, you are in defense of a market style that fans the flames.

I am talking about your defense of a marketing style that gives more ammo to the people who want to take away our rights and appeals mainly to the type that does in fact beat chests and wave weapons around and you defend that style by saying that adding more fuel to the fire makes no difference.

I prefer to spend my money on business that conduct themselves with more wisdom. That is all I am saying.

Logic vs rhetoric. Take your pick. I chose logic.
 
Well that's just it, Gus; I don't consider it the equivalent of behaving in a reckless manner. It's bombastic, yes. It's brash. But I think it has its place, because I think the legitimacy of knives as weapons of self-defense should be maintained in the public conscience. No amount of hiding or pretending has made any difference up to now.
 
I think the marketing style is reckless and that it appeals to the type who does beat their chest and wave weapons around and that the only reason it has its place is that it appeals to some and that it is successful for the profits of a company.

It does not appeal to me and that has nothing to do with hiding or burying my head in the sand when it comes to the right to carrying a weapon as has been have suggested.

You have all the rights to add fuel to the fire that has been set and all the rights to hand the opponents of those rights more ammo.

Just as I have the right to act in a more logical manner that might just improve the situation rather than make it worse if enough people actually use logic.

Don't tell me I am doing the community a harm by pointing out that those market practices are doing harm. Yes they are successful for the company but at what price to our future. Why do you want to give them more ammo by defending these practices. Does not make any sense at all, unless there are stock options pending. As a matter of fact, it makes as much sense as pouring gasoline on a raging fire.
 
I don't recall saying you were harming anything -- only that I don't believing hiding accomplishes what it is intended to accomplish. I also said I don't fault anyone for voting with their wallet if they don't like the company's advertising. I'm just saying I believe it does have a place, and I don't think it's a bad thing, even though some do. I'm also saying that you can't "give ammo" to someone who already has a full magazine, who is going to hate and fear knives and other tools regardless.
 
Sharp Phil said:
The fact is, Cold Steel manufactures quite a few very decent knives at acceptable prices (as well as a few knives that are overpriced and a few knives that are wanting, in terms of design). The people who forget that in their haste to strangle themselves with their own underwear in outrage over Cold Steel's marketing or the fact that Lynn Thompson is short and fat (news flash!) are doing everyone, including themselves and the company, a huge disservice.
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Bottom line
Lynn's physical shape makes no difference to me.

The marketing practices of Cold Steel, Dark Ops, Mantis and the like makes a huge difference to me and there is no way that I can buy that I am doing myself, and anyone else "disservice" or harm by refusing to accept it. I chose not to spend my money or support those marketing practices.

It is obvious that you feel otherwise that that is OK with me although it makes no sense to me at all, but please do not insist that those practices are not doing harm by comparing them to throwing gasoline on a raging fire and that if I do not agree with you then I am doing myself and others a huge disservice. There is no logic in that stance of discounting the market practices.

As I understand it you live in an area where certain knives are not legal to carry. I am not sure, but to use an example. If a concealed weapon is illegal also, should you be searched, not that they would have a legit reason, and if you are asked are you carrying a weapon or a tool, would you say a weapon or a tool, or would you leave the answer up to a lawyer to prove it was a tool. That is not hiding, it is using common sense and logic. Answering that you are carrying a weapon seems to be the stance you would take.

Me, I would say I used a tool to make sure that an attacker would do as little harm as possible. (In my particular case that tool would not be a knife.)
 
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I don't believe Cold Steel's marketing practices do any measurable or appreciable harm, no, because I don't believe you can further outrage someone who is already completely irrational when it comes to his or her fear of tools and weapons. Furthermore, I don't think trying to cater to such people by attempting to pretend or hide (to the effect that knives are only ever tools and never weapons, etc.) accomplishes anything because such people cannot be and never have been successfully appeased.

To me, it's like the argument that was advanced when the Somali pirate news stories hit the media cycle a bit ago. We shouldn't arm the ships the pirates are attacking, we were told, because if they encountered resistance they might really get angry. Well, by the same token, I understand the logic behind trying not to upset sheeple and hoplophobes. I just don't think that attempt accomplishes anything, and I think the result is that the ownership and carry of weapons is further marginalized and the concept rendered illegitimate in popular culture.

Acting like we have something to hide is, to me, the bigger problem. I think Lynn can stab as many car hoods and slice up as many sides of beef as he likes; I don't believe he's truly doing any damage because I don't believe the people we'd rather he not upset can ever truly be placated.

Logic is the science of non-contradictory identification. It is, in fact, possible for two people to disagree while employing logic to reach different conclusions, depending on the premises they accept and reject. We disagree on the premises. This does not mean that one of us must necessarily be uniquely logical while the other is employing only rhetoric.
 
hmmm SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO many better choices than the longhunter......at that price from cold steel that would have done more than what you needed it for. as far as CS i bought products from them at consistently[sometimes outrageously] reasonable prices and was MORE than impressed with the PERFORMANCE. i know LT is fat and likes to destroy frozen meat but its fine with me. their products do everything i asked them too if not more. i like the way they put extra consideration in beefing up their cheaper line of products as they know they are going to be abused and sell people on their line. which it has totally done to me. before i thought CS was fucking joke. not anymore.
 
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Sharp Phil said:
The fact is, Cold Steel manufactures quite a few very decent knives at acceptable prices....
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Amen. I have purchased dozens of their knives and have yet to find a defective one. That doesn't mean that there's not an occasional "bad apple," but I've been impressed by the grinds and sharpness of the blades out of the box. Also the fact that many of their blades are polished, and not bead blasted. Finally, the company hasn't dumped the consumers by choosing junk steel to replace better steel. The company actually has pride in its products and I've found that the steels I've used have had excellent heat treatment.

The people who forget that in their haste to strangle themselves with their own underwear in outrage over Cold Steel's marketing....
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Some of the marketing is ludicrous; some misleading. Cutting a cut-resistant glove by putting it against a hard surface is meaningless. Those gloves are meant to deflect glancing blows. Other cutting chores are mundane and prove nothing except that the knives are sharp. But their lock tests and blade bending tests are things I'd like to know and are helpful. I wish other knife companies would subject their knives to those types of tests.

The models that aren't very well designed or that are overpriced are fairly evident to most knife aficionados.

I like their knives, overall. CS is the only knife company that offers large quality folders that are strong and practical. I like that, too.
 
Glad to hear customer service has improved. If I had gotten the same kind of treatment years back, they'd not of lost my business. I could care less about L.T., but I do believe their marketing style is a bit over the top. Cold Steel does sell a decent product in the lower price ranges.
 
Confederate said:
I like their knives, overall. CS is the only knife company that offers large quality folders that are strong and practical. I like that, too.
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They're also the only knife company that's willing to branch out into swords, clubs, axes, and other bizarre impliments. :D
 
I will say the main thing that bothers me about cold steel, their product demo videos sometimes express blatantly dangerous and improper use or testing a knife. A lot of the people that look for cheaper knives (general public who aren't sheeple) tend to think if they see the manufacture do it, they can do. That get's dangerous. Most brands I know of recommend people NOT do dangerous or stupid things with their product, AND use the product as it was intended with a warranty that strictly covers knife related damage.

That being said it is good customer service, I am weary about a company that replaces stuff you broke on purpose, I also find it a little dishonest that people would do something that would damage the knife beyond use and then try to get warranty service. Not towards the OP, he was honest and didn't even expect or ask for a new knife.
 
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