Discuss: Ebay Mistakes vs Quality Budget Knives, Batoning

dirc said:
it's wonderful they gave you a better replacement S SmoothLikePowerSteering ...

however, if it's d2 it's not really going to be tough for hard use bush crafting (imho)

just get & try a mora companion or heavy duty companion
extremely tough & low cost, you will never regret getting one ; )

share pics & update when you can
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This here, I am sure some fantastic blades may exist in D2 for heavy wildlife use, but the Mora HD just keeps on, very reliable, cheap, does the job.
If you wanna spend less but want 7in of indestructable 1075 survival clip point, Ontario SP-1, thick but easy to sharpen. Spend some more, Cold Steel 3V SRK feels amazing to me, 5mm at the spine, but slices like a Buck 119 and tougher than the SP-1!

I feel like this is like having M390 survival kniives
 
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killgar said:
This post isn't directed at you Smooth..., it's just some thoughts I've had on the subject for some time.

For some people, "batonning" with a knife means lightly tapping a blade through a thick stick in order to expose the dry interior for use in fire starting. I've seen people do this with folding knives without the slightest issue.

And for other people, "batonning" with a knife means trying to split seasoned logs by pounding the blade of a knife with another log.

I've always found it strange how some people will judge the value of a knife, and the quality of it's steel, by whether or not it can survive being hammered through seasoned logs with another log.

But to each their own. We each judge the value of a knife in our own way. :)
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You deserve a knife that can tickle a car's engine block when you stab the hood You are worth it. You are a human being, just like me.
 
D Deino It would seem that they exclusively sell D2 knives. Thank you for the excuses on my behalf 🤪 and the details you provided comparing common uses for D2 vs 80crV2 helped a ton.
Hashishiin said:
Mora HD just keeps on, very reliable, cheap, does the job.
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I'm getting a Mora HD carbon... I'm not yet aware what my specific needs are, but that knife has a reputation, I'm sure I can find a suitable use for it 😉
 
SmoothLikePowerSteering said:
D Deino It would seem that they exclusively sell D2 knives. Thank you for the excuses on my behalf 🤪 and the details you provided comparing common uses for D2 vs 80crV2 helped a ton.

I'm getting a Mora HD carbon... I'm not yet aware what my specific needs are, but that knife has a reputation, I'm sure I can find a suitable use for it 😉
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Good call! It'll separate a lot of material, be easy to sharpen, carve wood... not a huge batonner, maybe, but a super reliable tool. :)
 
I didn't read the whole thread but that's cool that they hooked you up with a new knife. It's also impressive and good to see that they're keeping up to date and searching the internet for problems with their knives. In fact, their company name isn't in the title, so it wouldn't come up in a google search. That means that the owner, or whoever you talked to, is a Bladeforums member. That's a good sign. I personally know nothing of the company though.
 
SmoothLikePowerSteering said:
D Deino It would seem that they exclusively sell D2 knives. Thank you for the excuses on my behalf 🤪 and the details you provided comparing common uses for D2 vs 80crV2 helped a ton.

I'm getting a Mora HD carbon... I'm not yet aware what my specific needs are, but that knife has a reputation, I'm sure I can find a suitable use for it 😉
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Mora Companions are known because they are good starting point, inexpensive yet serious. Medium size, medium blade length, medium blade thickness, medium tang, medium weight, low grind with slight hollow (more spine strength while hollow keeping the edge slicy), both stainless and carbon version have about the same edge retention and strength, very hard to go wrong.

My first fixed blade is the regular Companion stainless for gardening. HD version will suit you better for wood chopping and multi purpose.

Another inexpensive option, but more on the choppy side, is the BPS Knives from Ukraine. Their steel options are tougher, most are made with full length and width tang for even more strength, excellent for heavier works. It often comes up as mora alternative in the bushcraft forums. Come with nice leather sheath.
 
SmoothLikePowerSteering said:
Hey Y'all,
Firstly, post #1 for me so thank you for letting me join your community. My name is Ian and I've loved knives all my live, currently I'm exploring bushcraft and so that kind of emvironment is what my sharpies need to handle.

I bought some knives off ebay... The seller makes the knives and has 100% seller rating with long history, I believed them to be good knives until I used one to split a round of oak in a technique called batoning. It broke so quick I was shocked. Three waps and it was done, blade beoke right in half. It's D2 steel, did I buy the wrong knife for the job or is this knife a lemon? My technique may have been off as well, I struck the blade on the inside of the cut instead of the side where the blade protuded past the round, due to the shape of the blade (chamfered on top for the last 3", thinner surface). Blade is 2" wide, ~8" long full tang with 5" handle. I can't seem to post a picture from my camera roll- tia
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I tend to do my batoning with an axe and oak isn't the easiest stuff to crack through, but for a knife D2 wouldn't be my first or fifth choice of steel for that kind of activity. There are a lot of D2 entry level fixed blades that are advertised for the great outdoors, but other than a few smaller knives or skinners it's not something that would interest me.

I've never used an IPAK knife, but they tend to get a pretty bad rap for copying other company's popular designs (something they're not alone in) and are a bit suspect on the country of origin. I'd probably think of them same way I did something made by Wild Turkey. I think it's perfectly fine to want to buy a cheap knife until you have to rely on it far from home. When you're far from a good axe, you want a knife that's a bit more reliable of which there are a ton of good options that won't cost an arm and a leg, by brands like: Kellam, Terava, Joker, Cudeman, Grohmann, Condor, Ka-Bar, Buck, Cold Steel, Morakniv, and Woox (they seem to be on sale a lot these days).
 
Batoning any knife is a sure way to bust it. I've hiked/backpacked for weeks with a 35 lb. pack in mountains/flatlands over the last 60+ years and never found the need to baton anything. I carried a SAK tethered in my pocket and a 3.5/4 inch puukko in my pack and made out quite well.
 
Batonning is a fickle thing. I've batonned through reasonable sized (and hardness) limbs with a standard (fairly thin) Mora Companion hundreds of times with no issues. But with all the various torque and forces involved, I can see breaking a knife doing it as well. A blade with high hardness and some knotty oak for instance is asking for trouble. Also as stated above, while it is a cool thing to be able to do, it is rarely actually needed.
 
SmoothLikePowerSteering said:
I may get rid of the knife in favor of something more trustworthy... I guess I'm uncertain as to what kind of knife I need and what benefits a larger knife has compared to a morakniv companion... Any advice?
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I just Googled “Hill and Creek Custom Knives”. Only listing was for an Ebay add.

That’s a huge red flag.

I’d sell that knife off immediately and carefully research all future outdoor knife purchases.

If you’re getting out into the woods, your hiking knife could become your survival knife, so it’s worth serious consideration in my opinion.

One thing a larger knife can do that smaller ones struggle with is chop wood.

I suggest carrying a chopping knife/machete/hatchet, and/or a wood saw, in addition to a small knife whenever you are walking in the woods without a shelter in your pack.
 
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scdub said:
I’d sell that knife off immediately and carefully research all future outdoor knife purchases.
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I'd say put it on a plaque, put it on the wall, and leave it there as a reminder to do some looking around before buying on eBay regardless of the seller's rating.
 
Found this link on Amazon... the primary blade grind geometry looks like it might be a little obtuse?

Kind of hard to really know about overall quality and fit and finish without having the knife in hand.

View attachment 1989388
 
The subject of batoning is forked between subjective and diluted knife-use politics
Most manufacturers will either not stand behind batoning with a voiced opinion or simply say don't do it.

Other considerations is where is the steel sourced? how thick is the spine? and the blade behind the edge?
Did you baton right?

There are lots of eBay sellers who are authorized sellers I'd trust to buy from wholeheartedly, just do your research and don't buy from the first seller who has the knife you want. I had to say (no) to knives on ebay before because I didn't like any of the sellers, and they weren't available anywhere else

Other things out of your control is if there is a knot inside the wood, some old nail, etc
Just things to ask yourself.

One more thing, if you want to baton with D2, check out Wander Tactical

[End rant]
 
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Thank you all, lots of good information has come out of the mistakes I've made. I have learned my lesson, and sadly I did do a bunch of research before I spontaneously made these 'too good to be true' cheaper purchases... I've also learned that batoning is not something I need to focus on. I may change the title if I can to something less provoking, as I see some of you are triggered; D2 steel is the smallest factor of the problem here, most of which stems from inexperience and cheap ebay knife
 
Rich S said:
Batoning any knife is a sure way to bust it. I've hiked/backpacked for weeks with a 35 lb. pack in mountains/flatlands over the last 60+ years and never found the need to baton anything. I carried a SAK tethered in my pocket and a 3.5/4 inch puukko in my pack and made out quite well.
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This! In my oft stated and never to be humble opinion batoning has everything to do with machismo and little to do with actual wilderness needs.
 
I get to know some knives/tools makers through Ebay or Etsy, there are many legit people. Of course these open market are full of deceiving profitors, therefore I want to know if they have an actual workshop by asking for picture of the place then compare to google satellite map, and ask some question their method and philosophy.
For me, just honouring the guarantee means little, if these are cheap blade outsourced from elsewhere and they get big margin after each sale, replacing is easy, much like hardware cheap store brand tools.

Whitemountainknives is a legit retailer for factory knives, people on this forums know the shop, and I found their Ebay, and it is easier to buy from their ebay store since since I live outside of the US.
 
Deino said:
Whitemountainknives is a legit retailer for factory knives, people on this forums know the shop, and I found their Ebay, and it is easier to buy from their ebay store since since I live outside of the US.
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I wouldn't consider that an 'ebay knife,' although I can't articulate exactly what the criteria are... It would seem something like: a random startup who buys blanks and grinds and sharpens them then fits a handle and sells them, with lack of worksmanship and little effort put in, but makes it look (to the untrained eye) like a bespoke item and sells it for 'I'm just scraping by' prices. No forging, no attention to detail, cheap materials, etc. All of that Together, is what makes the cliché 'Ebay knife' IMO.
 
SmoothLikePowerSteering said:
Hey Y'all,
Firstly, post #1 for me so thank you for letting me join your community. My name is Ian and I've loved knives all my live, currently I'm exploring bushcraft and so that kind of emvironment is what my sharpies need to handle.

I bought some knives off ebay... The seller makes the knives and has 100% seller rating with long history, I believed them to be good knives until I used one to split a round of oak in a technique called batoning. It broke so quick I was shocked. Three waps and it was done, blade beoke right in half. It's D2 steel, did I buy the wrong knife for the job or is this knife a lemon? My technique may have been off as well, I struck the blade on the inside of the cut instead of the side where the blade protuded past the round, due to the shape of the blade (chamfered on top for the last 3", thinner surface). Blade is 2" wide, ~8" long full tang with 5" handle. I can't seem to post a picture from my camera roll- tia
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Ian - I think you have a knife confused with an axe. Beating on a knife trying to split wood is not the best way to split wood. Also, you can buy an axe for much less than you would pay for a knife.

 
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