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Recommendation? Edge Pro Conversion Stones

Discussion in 'Maintenance, Tinkering & Embellishment' started by Aquaholicc, May 19, 2017.

  1. Aquaholicc

    Aquaholicc Basic Member Basic Member

    592
    Oct 17, 2016
    Alright guys..I currently have the Edge Pro system with 120,220,400,600 and 1000 grit stones
    My question to you is ..where do I go next? I'm thinking "2 steps" above my current 1000 grit stone would suffice my needs/wants.

    With that being said I've already done some research and it seems that Shapton is the way to go..so please only recommend shapton stones (unless you make a convincing argument about chosera)

    Naturally I thought to myself "okay ..I'll just buy the 2000 and 4000 grit shapton stone" and be on my way. But once I referred to the conversion chart on the edge Pro website it told me ..my current 1000 grit edge Pro stone is equal to a 8000 shapton?!? This can't be right please clear this up for me ...

    Ps..
    Yes I know about the scratch patterns not working well when you mix stones but I feel like at such a high grit it shouldn't matter.

    Thanks in advanced BF community!
     
  2. jbarsquat

    jbarsquat Gold Member Gold Member

    519
    Feb 22, 2017
    1. What are you trying to accomplish as an end result? The Edge Pro 1000 grit stone gives an extremely well refined edge.
    2. Have you looked at the new(ish) EP stones? They have a 2300, and 4000 grit polishing stone on their website.
     
  3. miso2

    miso2 Gold Member Gold Member

    Nov 19, 2014
    Also, what are the steels you are trying to sharpen?

    Miso
     
  4. Aquaholicc

    Aquaholicc Basic Member Basic Member

    592
    Oct 17, 2016
    "Trying" lol. I sharpen anything from Vg-10 all the way to s110V and M390. I have no problems working with steel just need guidance as to what my next stone should be.
    I have no problems with achieving a mirror polish, I'll agree with you on that. But I feel like I want to take it maybe a step or two above the 1000 grit is why I ask lol. I've got a sickness called "it's never good enough" lol.
     
  5. Diemaker

    Diemaker

    38
    Apr 28, 2017
    Full disclosure- I make the EP polishing stones and a few other things for them so obviously I may be biased.

    The polishing stones are designed to be the next two steps above their 1000 grit stone, something worth saying since you have EP stones up to 1000 grit. Whatever your knives are that you are wanting to sharpen they will work and they will last a long time. The prototypes wore in the center .001" for the 2300 and .0005" for the 4000 over the 7 month trial period where they were totally abused and dressed far more often than needed, I expect the production stones to be more wear resistant since the process used for production is much better than what I used when I made the prototypes. The first year is about up on the production stones they have been using so I will measure them then to see how much they wear during normal usage. I engraved where to measure, the date, and measurement on the back before giving them their shop polishing stones so I could track wear. When you send a knife to them for their trial sharpening they finish with the polishing stones instead of the tapes, at least this is what Cody said the last time we talked about it which has been awhile. They also do some local sharpening so the polishing stones they use get a lot of use, they only use one each of each grit. They prefer them over the tapes because they are so much easier to use. If you still want to go one step farther then the 6k tapes would be the next step, or stropping.

    By the way, the tape holders are now machined on every surface which greatly improves accuracy and cosmetics.

    I am not just trying to peddle my wares but add to the conversation since this is a topic I have some direct knowledge of. To be honest I don't have any knowledge of other stones for sharpening knives beyond what EP sells, something I will try to improve upon.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2017
  6. Aquaholicc

    Aquaholicc Basic Member Basic Member

    592
    Oct 17, 2016
    Hey man, that's awesome you decided to chime in on the thread, I really appreciate it.

    I'm glad to know that I could just buy the 2300 stone or 2000 (whatever the grit is) and call it a day. Not trying to shame your product but I've heard nothing good about the "tapes" i.e. they just tear too easily and simply don't last.

    So my last question to you is..can I be a "tester" on one of the prototype 2k stones hahah. If so..I'll more than gladly share my experience on it!

    All in all thanks for the info Diemaker
     
  7. Bladegunner

    Bladegunner Gold Member Gold Member

    378
    Jul 28, 2016
    I have a profile sharpening system and went with the Shapton's made for the Edge pro I got the 1,2,4 and 8K stones and couldn't be happier got fantastic polished edges that really cut!!
     
    Aquaholicc likes this.
  8. Diemaker

    Diemaker

    38
    Apr 28, 2017
    Yeah, the tapes are not the most robust which is why I came up with the polishing stones, the tapes do cut much faster though. I only used a few to compare with all the stones I made to see which ones were best and how they compared with the tapes. Once you get the hang of the tapes they are not too bad and they sure are free cutting.

    Just to be clear I only make a few parts for EP, other than that I have no affiliation with them or represent them in any way. I have a machine shop and do most, if not all, of their cnc milling.

    Sorry, but I have zero say on "testers" so I can't help you there. I have noticed that EP has 2 reviews on the polishing stones that are both positive, and they have sold quite a few in the last year. They don't have the same feel as other stones or the tapes. They don't feel like they are doing anything but the microscope shows that they are doing what is wanted, and your knife with shave much better. Also if you get the polishing stones don't let it bother you when they turn dark from the steel looking like they are loaded up, it doesn't seem to slow them down any. They don't absorb water so just put a few drops on the stone before using it.
     
  9. Aquaholicc

    Aquaholicc Basic Member Basic Member

    592
    Oct 17, 2016
    Yeah my 1000 grit even the 600 is pretty dark from all the material, but like you said..it really doesn't slow it down at all.

    Well it seems as I should purchase the 2k and see what results I get on my M390. Thanks again for all the wisdom you've shared man!
     
  10. Aquaholicc

    Aquaholicc Basic Member Basic Member

    592
    Oct 17, 2016
    @Diemaker

    Hey man hate to resurrect the dead but you mention you crafted stones for EP. Any idea why there are no micron lvs advertised with the stones? Do you perhaps have this info? I'm about to purchase a 2k and 4K stone but I wanted to see how the microns stack up against the Shapton glass stones ..

    Thanks for the reply in advanced my man!
     
  11. Diemaker

    Diemaker

    38
    Apr 28, 2017
    Not that this tells you anything useful, just to satisfy your curiosity. The 2300 is 8 micron, the 4k is 5 micron. What the abrasive is, what bond and the concentration have too much to do with how it works to really get too hung up on what micron it is. The next time I am at EP, maybe tomorrow, I hope to pick up a set of Shapton stones they have to try out. If you wait long enough I can let you know what I think of them.
     
  12. Aquaholicc

    Aquaholicc Basic Member Basic Member

    592
    Oct 17, 2016
    Awesome thank you. But on the "micron lv" it seems shapton is the way to go. Although some believe you shouldn't mix stones..so the slight difference in micron may not be noticeable if I just use all EP stones...I'll try to wait as long as I can to hear from yah.

    Now that I have a large21 I feel like she deserves at least 4K lol. I want the liquid edge to show off to my co workers. :cool:
     
  13. miso2

    miso2 Gold Member Gold Member

    Nov 19, 2014
    @Diemaker
    Can you elaborate on the grit of your polishing stones? Some assume that EP's #1,000 is <10 micron or even <5 micron. Also, 8 micron is only #1,000 with the ANSI rating (#2,000 with JIS). Since EP's grit system is very confusing, I would appreciate inputs from you.
    Sorry to OP to derail a bit.
     
    Aquaholicc likes this.
  14. Aquaholicc

    Aquaholicc Basic Member Basic Member

    592
    Oct 17, 2016
    No derailing at all my friend. You simply took what I was trying to convey and put it into better words lol. Nothing wrong with that.
    It would make sense that the 1k EP stone is greater than 10 micron though seeing as the Shapton 1k is 14 micron..

    Early today I did wonder why the EP stones are 50 each but the Shapton glass (which ever seems to deem better)
    Are 35 and 40 bucks?

    Idk about you but I'm sort of a man of ministry value..if something cost more it MUST be better (at least in my sick sick head) lol
     
  15. miso2

    miso2 Gold Member Gold Member

    Nov 19, 2014
    Thank you, @Aquaholicc.

    My guess on the prices is that Shapton is a larger company and sells a lot of stones worldwide, which would reduce their price.
     
  16. Diemaker

    Diemaker

    38
    Apr 28, 2017
    My understanding is that "grit" is only good up to around 320. The best measurement of abrasive size is micron IMO, nice thing about micron is there are no variations, other than the quality of sizing. All I know about EP stones is who their source is, sorry. Remember I am just a machine shop that has made parts for them ever since I made the Apex mold.

    The reason not to mix stones is just what we are all discussing here, what to use and at what progression. Since abrasive size is such a small part of determining how it will cut, when you start mixing manufacturers or types you are on your own when determining what to use and at what progression. Just because a stone says 600 or 1000 doesn't mean it will work the same as other stones saying the same thing, even if the abrasives are identical in size. Look up the different aluminum oxide abrasives for sandblasting. It is interesting to see just variables are available. This information does apply directly to what is used in sharpening stones. Same for diamond powder, there are many grades to choose from.

    As for the price of the EP polishing stones that has to do with how much it costs to make them, both in materials and labor.
     
  17. Aquaholicc

    Aquaholicc Basic Member Basic Member

    592
    Oct 17, 2016
    Hmm okay so it seems like as long as I don't jump "micron levels" too drastically then I should be fine whether I mix manufacturers or not ..


    So without you giving a biased opinion would you say the Shapton stones aren't made as well? Or they just have competitive pricing up their sleeve ?
     
  18. miso2

    miso2 Gold Member Gold Member

    Nov 19, 2014
  19. Diemaker

    Diemaker

    38
    Apr 28, 2017
    No opinion on Shapton glass stones since I have never seen one, yet, which is why I want to borrow EP's set to try out.

    Miso2, the 2300 and 1000 stones are totally different so you can't make any assumptions on abrasive size from one to the other. When I call Cody tomorrow to ask him to set out the Shaptons I will ask about the 1000 stone to see what he knows.
     
    miso2 likes this.
  20. halden.doerge

    halden.doerge Gold Member Gold Member

    Aug 17, 2014
    @Aquaholicc Have you consulted the grand unified grit chart?
     

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