Elmax

As the other poster stated earlier it depends on the source. I have three zt knives including the early 551 and they were disappointing given the hype. On the other hand I have two Alan Davis folders in elmax and they perform and Sharpen like a different steel altogether. I have no doubt it is the HT. Russ
 
The elmax blades I've used (Scrapmax) stood up to some kitchen duties very, very well. No chipping even when hitting a pork shoulder bone. Really stainless, not hard to sharpen and holds an edge. I'd buy another one someday.
 
I have has really bad experiences with Kershaw's Elmax. I have owned three ZT 0560s and their edge retention was terrible. They would become significantly dull after very light use.
 
I haven't had any issues with my ZT Elmax blades (0560 & 0561). I've used them to shave/cut notches in wood, cut garden hose, and almost daily I slice up double walled cardboard at my office with no problems whatsoever and certainly no chipping. Some cardboard will have those very large/thick staples that may have the ability to damage an edge, but I've never tried to cut through one nor accidentally hit one with my blade (knock on wood).

To be perfectly honest I can't think of a blade steel that I currently own that I have had ANY issues with...some require sharpening more often then others but usually (not always) those blades touch up easier than the ones that hold their edges longer so it all evens out.
 
When I received my 0560, I inspected it and found no issuse with the edge. The next day, I clipped it to my pocket and carried for about 4 hours without using it. It was when I took it out, that I found a deep chip in the blade. The only use it saw, was me flipping it about 20 times. I thought about sending it back, but I was going to reprofile the edge anyway. If I had known it was going to take me 2 weeks, 2 hours a day on a Lansky to get rid of that chip, I would have sent it back. However, once I got the chip out of the blade, it has been a great knife with excelent edge retention. I liked it so much, that I bought 3 more, including, a 0560 cbcf.
 
Cool thread..I was just about to post a thread to ask some Q's on same subject :thumbup:..
Only experience with Elmax I have is with the Busse Steak Knife, but just got it the other day and my uses have been intentionally limited to meat house applications; I'll try some work today on some cardboard, wood, etc and get some info posted here..so far it has been extremely impressive, and blows away any other knife I've used in the meat shop, but I have more plans for it than that..;)..time will tell, and so will I once I get it in action on other mediums.

Here's some perspective on the uses/performance so far (page 4 has my initial experiences): http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/1126203-Deer-Season-Update-Elmax-Steak-Knife-Review

Hope you all are doing great,

B
 
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SirGeod said:
Out of curiosity what is the textile "feel" of a roll as opposed to a chip in a blade?
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I don't know much about textiles, but the tactile feel of a roll will be just as you would imagine for the edge bending over to one side. If you feel it from that side, it will catch and bite. If you feel it from the other side, it will feel smooth all the way past the apex. For a chip, it will feel rough from both sides. You should be able to tell just by looking at the edge if it is chipped or rolled, but using a loupe or microscope might make it easier.
 
Houndstooth said:
When I received my 0560, I inspected it and found no issuse with the edge. The next day, I clipped it to my pocket and carried for about 4 hours without using it. It was when I took it out, that I found a deep chip in the blade. The only use it saw, was me flipping it about 20 times. I thought about sending it back, but I was going to reprofile the edge anyway. If I had known it was going to take me 2 weeks, 2 hours a day on a Lansky to get rid of that chip, I would have sent it back. However, once I got the chip out of the blade, it has been a great knife with excelent edge retention. I liked it so much, that I bought 3 more, including, a 0560 cbcf.
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Its a shame that you didn't just contact ZT and send it end to have the edge touched up (I've made the same mistake in the past with other knives)...reprofiling an edge can take forever if your stones/rods aren't very aggressive.

I've always heard that ZT has great Customer Service but even with 8 ZT's I'd never needed help until recently. Simply put, the Customer Service people at ZT were terrific! They were easy to get in contact with via phone or email and especially Jim MacNair and Jeremy Vanroyce, those guys went WAY above and beyond what I would have expected. Great company, wonderful CS and incredible knives.
 
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SirGeod,

One way to test is if you take your fingernail, and pull opposite the blade edge; a "roll" will often catch your fingernail, meaning that the edge just rolled over under pressure/impact, but did not actually break off from the knife, and chip, leaving a little chunk missing.
with a roll, you can focus your maintenance on that one area, to address the roll.

That being said, a roll will sharpen out with a lot less effort than a chip, because sharpening will fold that roll back into the center where it oughta' be.
A chip unfortunately will mean that in order to address it completely and remove any sign of it, will normally require grinding the entire knife edge down to where the base of the chip was..that's my experience anyway.

Hope that helps a little,

B
 
SirGeod said:
Out of curiosity what is the textile "feel" of a roll as opposed to a chip in a blade?
Click to expand...

Chipping is is not often a problem but is often the "claimed issue" when it comes to edge damage. Most simply don't understand what they are looking at.

A chip is a fracture in the metal where metal separation has occurred. A roll is where the metal has encountered a much harder object and has deformed from the pressure.

The difference between the two in feel will be huge. If you actually have chipping the first thing is it will be obvious and your knife will look like a serrated blade. A Roll will be more like a burr and the edge will feel flat and blunt.





As for Elmax steel, its not some super high wear steel that going to hold a edge forever. It's a good balance of what you want in a steel while being stainless and very tough. As for Elmax chipping I say.... Pics or it didn't happen.
 
I wish I had sent it back, just so ZT could examine it to find the reason it chipped. Once I got the edge reprofiled, I have used it nearly daily. About a month ago, I picked up a ZT 0600 and let my wife carry the 0560.
 
As for Elmax steel, its not some super high wear steel that going to hold a edge forever.
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Forever is a long time, so I'll give you that, but here are some pics of 100 slices into a large flat rate USPS box...many in excess of 1ft each..This btw, is after using this blade to help process over 200 pounds of deer meat the other day..


Wind kept blowing the hair off the blade, and since time is taking a lot from me, I wasn't sacrificing any more than what you see lol.



Next it tried it out on some seasoned oak & fatwood..at least 100 cuts..(I like my wood curls small and tight for a firesteel.)


One pass on the firesteel got us this..

One more patch of hair gone..I'm about out!!!


So far, from the slicing perspective, It is the definition of Super as far as I'm concerned. :)
From what I'm hearing on other maker's blade performance in Elmax, I think Busse Cryo has raised the bar..significantly..
Between the deer, the cardboard, and the whittling..and all the hair I've lost..I am simply amazed..
I have NEVER had another blade that would still shave after all that..never..
 
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I have to say I love it.
The only Elmax I have used is on my 0561. Serial # 3,3-- I have sharpened it once since I got her being, yesterday morning for a few minutes. I carved a full turkey yesterday, Cut through bone. And did so on a Bamboo Board. Not to mention chopping up a few bags of veggies. Followed by playing around outside making a fire and mallow sticks. This steel has proven to be tough. No micro chips , it will still easily shave and I have yet to even strop it.

That said I have a very keen eye when I sharpen and do so free hand and finish up on the sharpmaker.
Id say how a blade is sharpened by an individual will impact the performance.
Mine has 30-32 degree edge from the factory with a 40 degree final micro edge , more or less a slightly convex edge. Finest finish being the corners of my white stones with a strop.
I have to say I love the steel. It just takes a bit of time to figure out how to finish it once you get a final burr. The burr is probably the reason some people claim it dulls quickly, perhaps the burr folding over if not removed. Either way I give it a positive vote.
 
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SirGeod said:
Out of curiosity what is the textile "feel" of a roll as opposed to a chip in a blade?
Click to expand...

I can see, by your registry date and desire for knife-nut knowledge, that you could easily be frustrated with a higher-end purchase that didn't meet your expectations. It's normal and I've been there myself. My first was another extremely popular brand and my criticism was not well received.

Inversely, if you feel a bit of frustration from the replies you've gotten, you'll understand that a lot of newer hobbyists have had similar complaints. It's understandable that the latest steel, used in multiple models from a proven, popular tactical brand would be met with high expectations; however, in many cases the disappointment has come from sources who cannot disassemble/re-assemble a knife, let alone properly sharpen a blade...or whom take issue with any (perceived) flaw they might find(contrive)...typically with little proof documenting their experience. Much like reporters without sources, the public grows weary.

Forgive me if I don't give much credit to anyone who uses assorted metal as a testing medium for a pocket knife. File and Wire is one thing, but cutting horribly abrasive materials and "known blade chippers" is rather asinine. It's like sticking your hand in a fire and whining about the burn.

I'm really encouraged that you're up to speed on sharpening and willing to "give it a go". Thumbs up, and an attitude that will serve well in this hobby with EVERY brand. I doubt you'll be disappointed in the end, if so, use KAI's awesome customer service.

Elmax is not a light saber nor supernaturally tough steel; it is rather easy to sharpen with proper tools and will wear similarly to how difficult it is to sharpen. A tactical knife, expected to not critically fail under hard use, will rarely have a super tough edge (it should roll). Under hard use a blade/edge bends (rolls) or breaks (chips). Bending/rolling is preferred, as the knife is less likely to fail. That said, I have owned dozens of knives that chip a bit before I sharpen the factory grind away. S30V had major issues with this when it was new, from multiple major manufacturers.

I don't have a science degree, so I won't claim to know why this "factory sharpened chipping" happens...but if ZT has had this issue, I haven't experienced it with their Elmax. Moreover, they would not be alone if this has happened. It does happen, more so with a customer base always wanting new materials.

Feel free to email me if you need any help or advice.

P.S. - Sorry for the long post - I wanted to be more constructive and less frustrated.
 
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Sadly I didn't have the patience to re profile the blade so I sent it in to have warranty work done due to other issues (off center blade out of the box) and I asked them to sharpen it. I'll update again when I get it back from them.
 
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