Endura-zdp-189 or vg-10

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dave2945

Joined
Aug 7, 2007
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Which one should I buy for general purpose use/edc carry? I have no experience with either. BTW, I can sharpen pretty well and have diamond stones. Also, I really like carbon steel like 1095 or CV if that helps.
 
Dave---Both are great steels. I'd lean towards the ZDP but wait for the Spyder experts to chime in.
 
If you have the skill and stones I don't see any reason not to get the ZDP-189 version.
ZDP-189 takes a finely polished edge very nicely, and once you are used to sharpening it you'll appreciate how easy everything else is.

One of the great things about this stuff is that it can take a very thin edge compared to softer steel. I usually thin down the edge bevel to five degrees per side (it'll be fifteen degrees from the factory). While it can be done with stones, a belt sander will take a fraction of the time. Just be careful to keep the blade cool, and don't grind on one spot for too long, especially when it starts getting thin.
The benefits of a thinned edge are a potential increase in sharpness, and the knife will cut much nicer overall (due to the lack of metal behind the edge). The downside is also due to the lack of metal behind the edge, it is much more susceptible to damage, and when it is damaged it is much worse.

ZDP-189 will still work great sharpened at fifteen degrees per side, and will still get very sharp and hold it'd edge for a long time, though if these things don't concern you too much VG-10 is also a very good steel.

For the benefits of VG-10, it is the most balanced steel I have used so far.
It holds an edge well, takes a razor edge better than anything else I've tried, while still being relatively easy to sharpen, and in general is quite tough (usually doesn't chip when you hit something hard).

It's hard to go wrong with either.
 
Wow, 5 degrees per side is very extreme. Do you use your knife hard with this edge? If so, does it chip very often?
 
I would always go with VG10 if there is any possibility that the edge may occasionally come in contact with other hard surfaces. In my work this occurs often enough...nails/bolts/screws, metal, concrete reinforcing bar, glass...lots of pretty nasty stuff. The edge on my ZDP-189 Endura could not handle this well without chipping out. Glancing blows were especially not good. The same treatment would blunt the edge of my VG10 Endura, but I would just go to the truck and quickly bring the edge right back up on an Arkansas stone. Taking the chips out of the ZDP-189 was much more laborious, and in the end I decided it was a better knife for less hazardous environments.

I think ZDP-189 is nice steel though, the edge is nice and smooth, and it does seem to hold well...but I think it would be best suited for cutting materials where accidental contact with hard surfaces is unlikely.

I agree with Joshua...VG10 seems to be a really nicely balanced steel, very good damage tolerance, damages fairly gracefully when you do touch something hard, and the edge is easy to restore and maintain. Really, it's my favorite steel besides boring old 1095.
 
I'll admit that I would love the edge retainment of the zdp. However, there may be times that I could hit something hard. Plus, I do like a steel that I can get sharp.
 
'Nuther VG10 fan here. It's the best I've found for an EDC-type knife that has to be able to do a lot of different things. It's tough, but pretty easily sharpened and polished to a very high level. Shaving and push cutting / fileting paper should be no problem.
 
ZDP no question. Yes it is more abrasion resistant, but with a diamond stone even reprofiling is no problem and it takes an edge very similar to a carbon steel.
 
Thanks to all those who helped me with the decision. I ended up ordering the zdp-189 endura from new graham.

I have a knife in s60v, so I figure that I am able to sharpen the zdp. Plus, I am intrigued at the reports of the great edge retention while still being pretty tough. I will probably end up getting something in vg-10 though. It was a really tough decision.
 
I'd go with VG10 on an Endura. As has been said, it doesn't chip as easily and sharpens up nicely. I don't think the different in edge retention on a knife like the Endura is all that significant, at least not in my experience. ZDP is great for a very thin knife like a Caly3. For a knife for utility, VG10 gets my vote.
 
dave2945 said:
Wow, 5 degrees per side is very extreme. Do you use your knife hard with this edge?
Click to expand...

To answer your question, no.
I carry several knives daily, the ones that are sharpend like that are used only for tasks I know they can handle.
And I forgot to mention, I usually use a ten degree micro bevel, which allows most of the performance gains without having the incredibly fragile edge.
Sharpening at five degrees the whole way takes incredible amounts of time, and you have to be extreemly careful not to twist the edge or anything like that.
Hope that helps.
 
Lycosa, I will definitely let you know what I think about it.

Joshua J, that is really amazing to get a steel at an edge like that. That is one of the reasons I settled on the zdp. I normally run my edges at about 12 degrees with a 17 degree microbevel (per side). If it is holding up for you at such an acute angle without chipping, I figure it will work fine for me too.

Thanks again all.
 
I have both. At first, I was really jazzed about the ZDP, but I find the VG-10 in my pocket more because I don't have to watch it like a hawk in terms of corrosion.

The VG-10 is excellent in its own right and certainly "good enough."
 
vg-10 , ive own both, and zdp is a pain to sharpen even with diamonds. plus its too brittle for my tastes, and will start to rust faster then i would like.
 
My ZDP Endura led me to look for a VG-10 offering. It chipped way to easy for my edc use, although I didn't find it too hard to sharpen. I also made the mistake of taking mine wade fishing in salt water. It was speckled with rust spots before I got back in the truck after only about three hours. I like it when I know it won't get hard use, but that is only around the house.
 
If you want a good steel go for VG10, if you are a high tech obsessed steel junkie then go the ZDP one :) Aside from that they are completely the same. I got my ZDP and love it.
 
Hello all. Just got my Endura ZDP PE yesterday. Haven't had a chance to use it, buy I am initially very impressed. Lock-up is solid with an audible click and absolutely no play. The blade is very sharp, although I cannot say it is sharper than my Native I was out of the box. I have to say that I love the texture and color of the ZDP. It kind of resembles Case CV, which is my favorite steel. I did notice that fingerprints were left easily. I guess I was expecting that after reading about other's accounts in these forums. However, I am expecting to care for ZDP the same as carbon steel and am also expecting a patina of some sort. Would I be correct in this assumption?

I have to say that I am 100% satisfied at the moment. I cannot wait to use the knife.
 
No, not quite. ZDP's corrosion resistance is not as high as other stainless steels, but it is still considered stainless. I have not had any signs from corrosion even though I have never wiped it down will oil. I understand that some people have very corrosive sweat though, but there is still a significant difference between ZDP and a tool or HC steel.
 
I am definately not an expert, and may be completely backwards in my thinking, but wouldn't a serrated edge be best in a Z and go VG10 for plain? Or would the serrated edge just chip off the edge quicker even if accidentally? Examples of plastic string/twine, paper/cardboard, fabric???
 
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