escalator - opinions?

I think part of what's being missed here is that the Escalator is designed as a force continuum tool primarily.

It's just as useful closed as it is open, and shows that you don't have to use lethal force to end a fight. Make no mistake, using an open knife is considered lethal force and you'd better be justified in doing so before you use it.

This is definately not a ready to go, out of the box, no training needed knife. If you don't have a martial arts background, you aren't going to be as well served by it. But, if you do have the correct training, this knife *enhances* your capabilities, giving you more options in the force continuum whereas before you may have had two choices: hand to hand, or lethal force.

Get some training, and see what happens. Snick, I strongly recommend you check it out, I've got a healthy respect for what it can do in the right hands, and apparrently, so do a lot of other people, including some agencies.

Spark

------------------
Kevin Jon Schlossberg
SysOp and Administrator for BladeForums.com

Insert witty quip here
 
This thread is not relevant any longer. We have discontinued production of the Escalator and the Trainer as of this date and have no immediate plans to resume production.

Bob Taylor

------------------
Some days it's not worth chewing through the restraints and escaping.
 
Say it isn't so!

I can't carry a knife if I can't replace it (fear of loss, etc.). This is as devastating as the Escalator itself.

I understand that this is a specialty and not probably a big seller, bit can't you just make me a few more?

Chuck
 
Wow, what happened? I was planning on getting one along with the trainer to go along with my Sifu. I'm bummed to hear they're no longer in prduction.

------------------
Ciao

Mike Melone
memelone@yahoo.com
"One loves to possess arms, though they hope never to have occasion for them." --Thomas Jefferson to George Washington, 1796

 
No matter what Mr Taylor chooses to say its not a moot point. The knife as designed does what its supposed to.
As with George Dillman who with his students knock man people out with various touch points. or like any chiro doctor or "orthopod" one can turn on muscles or shut them off. One can short out flow in someone..thats why accupuncture and accupressure work. Chin-Na i=the fmother art of JuJitsu and aki-jitsu works very well with pressure point striking and control.
Pain is secondary for function ceases. Pain, radiating and varying pain can make anyone compliant. Thats the secrect of small circle jujitsu. Limb "destructions"? Try gabbing a punch to joint lock it..It won't happen.. destroy the limb and anything goes.. Thats the basis for what Datu Kelly has aptly coined as DTL...based on Filipino and JKD concepts..
Again..the concept is valid and works.. just takes someone who wants to use it..not someone who tries to power it through 'cause they have no understanding of what they are doing.
Don't think it works? check out Dillmans tapes, Grody's, Presas, Jay, Inosanto, Lam, Richardson, Worden, Keating,...et al.
Production or lack of it doesn't invalidate the concept that drives the design.

 
Lack of production doesn't invalidate the concept of the escalator, but it sure does moot the question of "should I buy one?"
frown.gif


I'm not a martial artist of any sort, but I've followed some of the escalator threads with interest because I find the concept fascinating. I doubt that I would ever be in a position to really use one, but I like the idea of a tool specifically designed for "escalating" levels of conflict. It's an admirable enterprise. I'm sorry to hear it's out of production.


------------------
Paul Neubauer
prn@bsu.edu

 
I disagree with Bob Taylor's opinion of this thread, there are many of us who own an escalator and believe in Bram's design to warrant further discussion. Lack of production doesn't cause lack of function in the existing knives.

David

[This message has been edited by Driscoll (edited 16 September 1999).]
 
So maybe I'm dense but what's the deal with the escalator? Is it available or not? If not, why not? I really want one but I'm not in a financial position right now to buy one having just shelled out for my Sifu. I'm hoping maybe in a few months (Santa, are you listening?
wink.gif
).

If, indeed, REKAT will no longer be producing these will someone else? Is something similiar in the works? Please, Bob or Bram or Spark or somebody, let us know what's going on.

------------------
Ciao

Mike Melone
memelone@yahoo.com
"One loves to possess arms, though they hope never to have occasion for them." --Thomas Jefferson to George Washington, 1796

 
RE: Guntings/Nerve Destructions

The concepts and theories behind nerve destructions and guntings (from LaCoste, Cadena de Mano, ets.) do work. However, they are low probability in terms of execution.

Sifu Bustillo, Sifu Inosanto, Guro Damon Caro, Seiyu Taika Oyata (Okinawan Ryuykyu Kenpo- the real deal), people of unbelievable skill, experience, and timing, can pull them off with ease.

Mere mortals, such as myself, have attempted it and have not had as good results.

I have done sparring in the boxing format, and tried to employ the various traps and destructions/guntings. The move I get with consistency is elbowing the punch (some will recognize it as a LaCoste entry).

SIDENOTE: I think that the gunting/pass to the bicep commonly taught works really well to get into the "split entry" (For puter kepala either Bukti Negarta or Mande Muda). A lot of people I have seen pass through that gunting as if cutting with a knife when doing empty hand. However, if you miss, the bicep hit, you will get hit. END SIDENOTE

As far as sparring aginst a trained kickboxer and boxer, many of the destructions and guntings are low percentage moves IMHO. Timing is critical and you have to have good follow up moves. It is not only a high skill maneuver, but also requires a great amount a accuracy.

In principle, it is like a Patriot Missle, trying to shoot SCUDS out of the air.

Against a grappler, I know some pressure points are used, but in my limited experience, unless it is around the face or neck (sometimes even around that area), some people can work through the pain and submit you. e.g. there is a common basic technique for passing the guard (closed) where you can use your elbows and press down on 2 points on the inner thigh to get the person to open up their guard. Most of the BJJ players I know are not affected by that move. Rick Clark, a Kyshu Jitsu stylist, explained to me that it is a bell curve. Some people are unaffected, some are hyper sensitive, some are affected.

Practicing those nerve strikes all the time can also take its toll on your system. I talked to a Ryukyu kenpo guy who was permaanent nerve damage from doing all the nervbe strikes.

Pain affects people differently in the adrenal state. At Dog Brother's Gathering a year or two ago, one fighter got hit very hard in the beginning of his match. This was a shot to the wrist of his weapons hand. He fought the rest of the match.

The significance of this was lost upon me as well, until I ran into this person at a seminar shortly after the Gathering, and found that he had a wrist brace on. Some of the bones in his wrist had been chipped.

YMMV, but in the sparring context, keeping it simple is beter IMO. Unless you can pull off the timing and accuracy, why not use something simple like a jab or cross?

Dave




[This message has been edited by Eskrimador1 (edited 16 September 1999).]
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top