Esee 3 sheath retention is ridiculous.

[B.F.U]

He more than likely shared your exchange on their own forums, as he customarily does with any customer he deems to be stupid. I think I am going to go read them and try to guess which one is you.

I have seen others with lesser issues get them resolved by contacting them. Just don't BS them and they will more than likely try to help you. Don't even try to spin it as some safety issue that they have an obligation to fix, just say you think yours is too tight and there might be something wrong with it, they care a lot about customer satisfaction.

Good for him, he has lost a lot of business out of it. Probably doesn't hurt them overall, but that's alright. Be a big guy and send me a link once you find it, that'll be a hoot.

I'm not new to this. For about the 3rd time, my issue had nothing to do with the sheath. My handle tubes/screws stripped and popped off and the handle actually split.

Your elitism is misplaced.

would that be about a retired military discount?

No, I'm not retired military. Certainly hope they're not going back on that...

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[craytab]

Good for him, he has lost a lot of business out of it. Probably doesn't hurt them overall, but that's alright. Be a big guy and send me a link once you find it, that'll be a hoot.

I'm not new to this. For about the 3rd time, my issue had nothing to do with the sheath. My handle tubes/screws stripped and popped off and the handle actually split.

Your elitism is misplaced.

No, I'm not retired military. Certainly hope they're not going back on that...

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Just so we are all clear on why you are interjecting your opinion of esee into this thread completely off topic, the explanation can be found in this thread you started:

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...SEE-Warranty-Does-Not-Cover-Handles-or-Sheath

Your knife was broken doing exactly what Esee said not to do: throwing it. They even call it idiotic in their warranty and they call people who do it idiots. I agree with them. The reason you got poor service is because the knife was broken in a manner they deem idiotic. That is very clear in the warranty. They still covered it, no?

 

[B.F.U]

Just so we are all clear on why you are interjecting your opinion of esee into this thread completely off topic, the explanation can be found in this thread you started:

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...-the-AXIS-lock-expire?p=12581057#post12581057

Your knife was broken doing exactly what Esee said not to do: throwing it. They even call it idiotic in their warranty and they call people who do it idiots. I agree with them. The reason you got poor service is because the knife was broken in a manner they deem idiotic. That is very clear in the warranty. They still covered it, no?

Yep, you're right. But their warranty wording is clear: no questions asked. I was honest with them, they were not helpful to me.

It was not resolved by that issue. It was only resolved when the blade snapped.

Also, it comes back to the image they project versus reality. They are not the same. Throwing =/= Shooting the blade.

You can think what you like of me, or of how I dealt with that knife. I was honest and upfront, they are not. I have the emails if you want to pm about it.

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[ursamajor]

Good for him, he has lost a lot of business out of it. Probably doesn't hurt them overall, but that's alright. Be a big guy and send me a link once you find it, that'll be a hoot.

I'm not new to this. For about the 3rd time, my issue had nothing to do with the sheath. My handle tubes/screws stripped and popped off and the handle actually split.

Your elitism is misplaced.

No, I'm not retired military. Certainly hope they're not going back on that...

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No, they aren't. The discount was always for active military.

 

[craytab]

Yep, you're right. But their warranty wording is clear: no questions asked. I was honest with them, they were not helpful to me.

It was not resolved by that issue. It was only resolved when the blade snapped.

Also, it comes back to the image they project versus reality. They are not the same. Throwing =/= Shooting the blade.

You can think what you like of me, or of how I dealt with that knife. I was honest and upfront, they are not. I have the emails if you want to pm about it.

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The link I put up that you quoted isn't correct. Still a good read though! Here is the correct one: http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...SEE-Warranty-Does-Not-Cover-Handles-or-Sheath

So how were they not upfront and honest? Putting aside that the scales are not covered. I agree with you in that they should be or it should be stated in the warranty that they are not.

 

[B.F.U]

The link I put up that you quoted isn't correct. Still a good read though! Here is the correct one: http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...SEE-Warranty-Does-Not-Cover-Handles-or-Sheath

So how were they not upfront and honest? Putting aside that the scales are not covered. I agree with you in that they should be or it should be stated in the warranty that they are not.

Their whole marketing is based on their, as they word it, no questions asked warranty. Meanwhile, they display a picture of a knife that someone shot that they replaced as evidence that they repair or replace any damaged knife no matter the reason. They do say that throwing a knife is dumb, and I agree, but they don't say it isn't covered (I think we can agree shooting a knife is dumber than throwing it). More importantly, they don't state anywhere that the handle, hardware, and sheath are not covered (again, I didn't have a problem with the sheath and don't have a problem with it not being covered because, unlike the handle, it's not part of the knife). In my case, it seemed to be used as a loophole to get out of repairs. I don't consider that being upfront, that's not how I'd do business if my reputation was based on my service and warranty.

I didn't plan to use the warranty, I have never damaged a knife and subsequently used the warranty before that I can recall and haven't since (I sent a Scallion that my dad broke the tip off of back to Kershaw for him once). However, I did buy the knife largely for the security and peace of mind from knowing that if anything did happen, as I planned to use it camping, that it would be repaired or replaced. I feel a large portion, if not majority, of ESEE sales are based on this same idea. I provide my experience and opinion on the ESEE warranty in threads like these so that someone considering purchasing an ESEE based partially or largely on the warranty might see that it is not what it is advertised as. I have real experience using several ESEE knives, and I have real experience with the actual ESEE warranty and customer service. So I provide my contrasting experience to the MANY people who might not have experience with the warranty (or using the knives as they are advertised).

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[B34NS]

ESEE says one thing, does another.

"NO QUESTIONS ASKED" in all caps, then said again in the H2 with stolen valor kook Cantebury's knife being promoted in the background.

It says: "You must complete this form and return it with your knife."

When you click that form, in order to complete it, you have answer questions

Sure, they add:

Which given ALLHSS's feedback doesn't sound like they honor those words either. Sounds like their warranty depends on the mood they are in. :thumbdn:

Perhaps this was the 99% Jeff Randall was referring to when he made this claim:
"In all honesty, the knife industry is about 99 percent bullshit. We sell knives every day to people who will never use them. Knife buying is more of a want than a need." http://indefinitelywild.gizmodo.com/how-survival-knives-are-designed-and-manufactured-1577108102

 

[craytab]

Notice the part where they say 1095 carbon steel? Is the handle or the sheath made of steel? The knife was broken doing what they ask you not to do. They still replaced it. Anyone considering this story as a cautionary tale should remember to not be an idiot and throw a knife not designed for throwing, just like Esee says. And with that, I'm done with this thread as it is sufficiently derailed. OP, hope your problem gets figured out.

 

[GB940Rookie]

If my "friend" broke my knife, my "friend" WOULD pay to get it fixed, one way or the other. I wouldn't waste the company's time because I did something stupid(like letting someone use my knife)

Hey OP, how's it going with your sheath? Any luck?

 

[VanDammet]

OP - I'd also like to know how the sheath situation is going now...any improvement, did any of this advice help you out?

I've heard of this infamous Esee warranty before, & the related wording about folks being stupid with their knives. I don't know a whole lot about Esee really, though the Esee 6 looks like a heck of a knife...I don't know, as a potential customer...and one that would never even think of throwing a knife, it's still a turnoff to see a knife company even go there - it just seems beneath a professional company that produces great products. I mean, it's really not all that big of a deal to me...it wouldn't stop me from purchasing a 6 or other, but ya, it does come off as unbecoming. And "craytab" - when I read the bit about "No Questions Asked Warranty on all 1095 carbon steel knives.", if I'm just looking at that line, I'm taking that to mean they're covering their knives....in whole. Now, if they used the word "blades" instead of "knives", then I'd see the point you're making in your above post about the handle (scales) & sheath not being made of 1095 steel; but as it's written, I'd certainly take it to mean they're covering their entire knife(ves)....and if Esee sells their knives & sheaths together, I'd expect them to mean they're covering the included sheath as well, as part of the entire "knife(ves).", right??

 

[B.F.U]

ESEE says one thing, does another.

"NO QUESTIONS ASKED" in all caps, then said again in the H2 with stolen valor kook Cantebury's knife being promoted in the background.

It says: "You must complete this form and return it with your knife."

When you click that form, in order to complete it, you have answer questions

Sure, they add:

Which given ALLHSS's feedback doesn't sound like they honor those words either. Sounds like their warranty depends on the mood they are in. :thumbdn:

Perhaps this was the 99% Jeff Randall was referring to when he made this claim:
"In all honesty, the knife industry is about 99 percent bullshit. We sell knives every day to people who will never use them. Knife buying is more of a want than a need." http://indefinitelywild.gizmodo.com/how-survival-knives-are-designed-and-manufactured-1577108102

I think the 99% is the real issue. He condescends against his customers, then when someone actually uses (or abuses) their knives AS THEY ADVERTISE THEM TO BE CAPABLE OF he goes back on the warranty and finds loopholes. Not an attitude I'd look for in someone providing customer service.

Notice the part where they say 1095 carbon steel? Is the handle or the sheath made of steel? The knife was broken doing what they ask you not to do. They still replaced it. Anyone considering this story as a cautionary tale should remember to not be an idiot and throw a knife not designed for throwing, just like Esee says. And with that, I'm done with this thread as it is sufficiently derailed. OP, hope your problem gets figured out.

Craytab, I know you're a good dude and not this simple. I hope you're just being facetious. To suggest that that sentence refers to only the blade and tang is downright silly. It doesn't say only the blade and tang is covered, it says "the knife" and the handle and hardware are part of the knife. The SOLE purpose of that sentence is to distinguish between their knives with 1095 blades and those with 440c blades.

Do we really have to go over how the warranty reads again? No questions asked. You are dumb for doing X with a knife =/= X voids or is not covered by our "no questions asked" warranty.

If my "friend" broke my knife, my "friend" WOULD pay to get it fixed, one way or the other. I wouldn't waste the company's time because I did something stupid(like letting someone use my knife)

Hey OP, how's it going with your sheath? Any luck?

My "friend" offered to do the return process, then offered to replace the knife. I purposefully didn't bring my "friend" into it because I told him he could use the knife. I'm not going to punish my "friend" for the dishonest knife warranty of a company or its elitist owner. Again, it's the only time I've sent a broken knife that was my fault for warranty work... because I assumed the warranty was honest.

I think anybody looking at this objectively can see the reality.

Has leaving the knife in half way helped any OP?



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[KennyB]

I think the 99% is the real issue. He condescends against his customers, then when someone actually uses (or abuses) their knives AS THEY ADVERTISE THEM TO BE CAPABLE OF he goes back on the warranty and finds loopholes. Not an attitude I'd look for in someone providing customer service.



Craytab, I know you're a good dude and not this simple. I hope you're just being facetious. To suggest that that sentence refers to only the blade and tang is downright silly. It doesn't say only the blade and tang is covered, it says "the knife" and the handle and hardware are part of the knife. The SOLE purpose of that sentence is to distinguish between their knives with 1095 blades and those with 440c blades.

Do we really have to go over how the warranty reads again? No questions asked. You are dumb for doing X with a knife =/= X voids or is not covered by our "no questions asked" warranty.



My "friend" offered to do the return process, then offered to replace the knife. I purposefully didn't bring my "friend" into it because I told him he could use the knife. I'm not going to punish my "friend" for the dishonest knife warranty of a company or its elitist owner. Again, it's the only time I've sent a broken knife that was my fault for warranty work... because I assumed the warranty was honest.

I think anybody looking at this objectively can see the reality.

Has leaving the knife in half way helped any OP?



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Yeah I can see the reality that you're unhappy they wouldn't buy you a new knife when you broke the scales, and now you're trying to drag their name through the mud and playing semantics games.

Did they replace your knife when "it broke"?
Are there numerous other people complaining about their warranty?
Are there numerous other people complimenting their customer service?

I guess it's whichever reality you want to believe in. All I am trying to point out is the OP should take your experience with a grain of salt in the face of overwhelming contrast in how other customers were treated. Are you suggesting he not even attempt to contact the company? What awful advice, yet you've stated your purpose is to offer what you consider to be a PSA about your one exclusive interaction with them. The fact you ignored specific warnings in throwing it not withstanding, you're still one voice in a crowd that's overwhelmingly satisfied. Just admit you've got a bone to pick, don't pretend you're doing anyone some service. Oh and let's not forget while you claim to want to be forthcoming, you still haven't actually disclosed any of the conversation that took place.

Maybe, just maybe, you should have taken some personal responsibility for what damage your friend did by abusing the knife and just bought new scales yourself. Instead I bet you intentionally broke it so they'd replace the 150 dollar knife so you could avoid paying 50 bucks for new scales. I mean I would be interested to know what hard use you could have been doing to break the blade with a broken handle...

Maybe a company that offers replacements on broken knives couldn't afford to pay for new scales every time someone broke them. Micarta isn't 1095, and in the meantime there are plenty of people who intentionally break their knives just to get new ones. Why burden the rest of their customer base by having to raise costs due to covering damaged scales? Did it occur to you they don't state in their warranty thst scales and sheaths are nor covered because they don't want to dissuade any customers who have broken theirs through legitimate use? You're basically crying they didn't replace your knife after you broke it for fun, not for work, not to get anything done, but because your buddy thought it'd be a fun time to throw it in a tree. I'm playing the world's smallest violin.

Meanwhile, if semantics are more important to the OP than principles, I guess he should take your advice and not bother with the warranty. Otherwise I would suggest he call the company and see for himself what they're willing to do for him.

 

[WK ONE]

Wow, this thread went all the way left. I should say that I, too purchased my 3 Esee knives party because of the warranty. having said that, I wouldn't ever "stress test" one of my knives (or throw it) because that's not what they're meant for. If I was batoning wood and the blade snapped, I'd expect it to be replaced promptly.

I've spent all of last night and today with the 3 halfway in its sheath to hopefully spread out the plastic retention nubs. I'll post an update when I get home from work in a few hours.

 

[B.F.U]

Yeah I can see the reality that you're unhappy they wouldn't buy you a new knife when you broke the scales, and now you're trying to drag their name through the mud and playing semantics games.

Already said I wanted a repair.

Did they replace your knife when "it broke"?
Are there numerous other people complaining about their warranty?
Are there numerous other people complimenting their customer service?

I don't see any people with actual customer service experience in this thread, and I don't recall many in any threads. It's almost exclusively, "They have a great warranty. If you ever need it they'll fix you up, but I never have/you never will."

If there are troves of people that have actually used the warranty and had a great experience, rather than just praising the warranty at face value, and I just rubbed him the wrong way or caught him on a bad day then... well, I guess that sucks for me.

I guess it's whichever reality you want to believe in. All I am trying to point out is the OP should take your experience with a grain of salt in the face of overwhelming contrast in how other customers were treated. Are you suggesting he not even attempt to contact the company?

You should take everyone's opinion with a grain of salt, but experience is worth more than trust in the warranty at face value with no experience.

I'm not suggesting that at all. He should definitely contact them, as always a call would probably be best. I wish I had called, maybe I'd have talked to somebody with some sense.

What awful advice, yet you've stated your purpose is to offer what you consider to be a PSA about your one exclusive interaction with them. The fact you ignored specific warnings in throwing it not withstanding, you're still one voice in a crowd that's overwhelmingly satisfied. Just admit you've got a bone to pick, don't pretend you're doing anyone some service. Oh and let's not forget while you claim to want to be forthcoming, you still haven't actually disclosed any of the conversation that took place.

I do "have a bone to pick" in a sense, but that and trying to help people out by giving them relevant information so that they can make the best decision with their money is not mutually exclusive.

Again, I don't see the crowd of positive actual experience with the warranty.

Did I not in the linked thread? I thought I did. I'd have to search through my emails, but they should still be there. I have nothing to hide.

Maybe, just maybe, you should have taken some personal responsibility for what damage your friend did by abusing the knife and just bought new scales yourself. Instead I bet you intentionally broke it so they'd replace the 150 dollar knife so you could avoid paying 50 bucks for new scales. I mean I would be interested to know what hard use you could have been doing to break the blade with a broken handle...

I did, I admitted that I did something stupid with the knife. I guess my problem was that I was naive enough to think that ESEE would stand by their main selling point as it is written on their website. No, I don't feel exploitative or petty for trying to have the handles repaired. The cost of ESEE knives is without a doubt higher than comparable alternatives due to the warranty.

Maybe a company that offers replacements on broken knives couldn't afford to pay for new scales every time someone broke them. Micarta isn't 1095, and in the meantime there are plenty of people who intentionally break their knives just to get new ones. Why burden the rest of their customer base by having to raise costs due to covering damaged scales? Did it occur to you they don't state in their warranty thst scales and sheaths are nor covered because they don't want to dissuade any customers who have broken theirs through legitimate use? You're basically crying they didn't replace your knife after you broke it for fun, not for work, not to get anything done, but because your buddy thought it'd be a fun time to throw it in a tree. I'm playing the world's smallest violin.

So they don't state an important exception to the warranty so more people will buy the knives? ... Yeah, pretty much what I'm saying.

Go ahead and play away, they absolutely cover any costs incurred by warranty work with their inflated prices.

The knife snapped while splitting wood, so......

Meanwhile, if semantics are more important to the OP than principles, I guess he should take your advice and not bother with the warranty. Otherwise I would suggest he call the company and see for himself what they're willing to do for him.

You can think whatever you like of my principles, this quote has your most useful statement. His best bet is to call ESEE, that way maybe he gets someone who will help.



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[B34NS]

Notice the part where they say 1095 carbon steel?

Reads pretty straightforward, but I circled it in red just in case. Their products in the 1095 line are covered by this warranty, 440C, the lite machete, and the Avispa/Zacundo are not.

Is the handle or the sheath made of steel?

No fault but their own vague warranty language. There is no specific language regarding coverage of handles, hardware, or sheath being covered or not covered under this warranty for knives made in the 1095 product line. If they don't like it, they are more than welcome to update it. Survive! Knives is specific that they do not warranty the sheath and the coatings.

It's not that hard to add a few meaningful lines of clarification rather than taking the effort of cryptically expressing disdain for having to honor said warranty when they don't like how their products are used simply because they lack confidence in their durability.

The knife was broken doing what they ask you not to do.

Irellevant. Unless knife throwing voids this alleged "No Questions Asked" warranty, they are legally obliged to hold up their end of the deal regardless of their opinions of their customers. If they don't like how their tools are used, they are more than welcome to design a better knife or stop making them entirely. It's a free market, no one is forcing them to sell knives to people.

They still replaced it.

That's great! That's what the warranty is for is it not?

Anyone considering this story as a cautionary tale should remember to not be an idiot and throw a knife not designed for throwing, just like Esee says. And with that, I'm done with this thread as it is sufficiently derailed. OP, hope your problem gets figured out.

I thought your initial advice was better. Just use the knife and if the problem persists contact the company. What does your personal opinion of what you deem "appropriate" knife use have to do with anything in regards to a "No Questions Asked" warranty support in question?

My advice to OP, I've had similar experiences with ESEE sheaths. I feel it has more to with the design of the molded sheath itself. It does get better with use, but I found kydex and leather to be better alternatives than the stock sheaths in the end.

 

[WK ONE]

Update, if anyone still cares:

Attempts at "stretching out" the plastic sheath by leaving the knife halfway in didn't work. I'm going to try sanding the nubs tonight.

 

[B.F.U]

Update, if anyone still cares:

Attempts at "stretching out" the plastic sheath by leaving the knife halfway in didn't work. I'm going to try sanding the nubs tonight.

Despite all the silliness (in large part my fault) in this thread, you really should call them first.

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[WK ONE]

Despite all the silliness (in large part my fault) in this thread, you really should call them first.

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Nah, it's OK. I've taken a bit off the nubs already, so it's a moot point. If anything, maybe this will convince me to get a leather sheath I've had my eye on.

 

[DocT]

WK One, the issue with your Esee is that the clip plate is screwed onto the sheath inappropriately. I made this same mistake myself, and went back and read the instructions. Once I did that, I was able to figure things out and now mine is perfect. If it is put on incorrectly it causes the sheath to tighten on the knife and it will be very difficult to remove. It is a common tale but true.

 

[craytab]

WK One, the issue with your Esee is that the clip plate is screwed onto the sheath inappropriately. I made this same mistake myself, and went back and read the instructions. Once I did that, I was able to figure things out and now mine is perfect. If it is put on incorrectly it causes the sheath to tighten on the knife and it will be very difficult to remove. It is a common tale but true.

It is not the clip plate:

Sorry, I should've clarified: I don't have a clip plate on the sheath, I have the molle back, which is screwed down well below the opening so I don;t think that's the issue.