Falkniven F1 3G - Sadly disappointed

[The Welshman]

I don't doubt that the OP could have received a faulty knife from the factory. And I hope that he posts Fallkniven's response when he gets it.

But here is my VG-10 F1 being pounded through a 3 1/2" diameter chunk of Poplar.

They all aren't lemons. I've been using this one for about 4 years.

Nice Pics, I hope i can try the same out if Falkniven send me another one

 

[kinskibrain]

That wasn’t necessarily about this thread. More of a built up annoyance at people who show up in every failure thread and cast insults concerning choice of knife, level of skill, unnecessary tasks being performed, etc. It gets old.

As for the “idiot” knives comment, some people may like those knives. I’m not sure what you mean exactly by that term, but I assume you mean thick. I’m no Cody Lundin, for sure, and I like my outdoor knives much thicker than my kitchen knives. Then again, I don’t always live in a well-controlled world, so I prefer to be overly prepared. Some may also need to do things with a knife others wouldn’t need to. I'm glad we have the variety we have.

About the warranty issue folks are mentioning, I like a good warranty. Take ESEE’s for example, it’s not a gimmick. They have the best warranty they can offer because they believe their knives will not fail under all but the most abusive conditions. I like that. It gives me confidence. I don’t mean to interject fanboyism and they’re not the only company with that sort of warranty, but they provide a good example for a warranty discussion. The OP also mentioned buying one of their knives. Hopefully, FK will be able to determine what happened and make it right, if need be. Take care.

I hear you, and I'm sorry for using the i-word. Some concept lost in translation on my part (english is not my first). I should have worded it differently because it was honestly not my intention to insult anyone. Like you I appreciate the variety and I am also worried at times of choice being lesser. Tools, cars, machines, schools - very quickly will things get "dumbed down" because someone didn't pay attention. I hope knives of all varieties will prosper and to each their own.
I like ESEE too. I have owned both the 6 and the Izula but I had other knives that I liked more so they where sold. I would like to get a 3 someday. They come with too thick edges from the factory though. Must be close to 40 degrees inclusive which is why they can't cut wood well unless re-ground IMHO. Something is paying for that insurance and in terms of cutting performance I don't think the far cheaper stock v-grind 1095 can hold a candle to the hand-convexed vg10 from Seki. But then again the ESEE has other things going for it so I understand why some like it more. All the best to you.

 

[The Welshman]

So if someone pays the money for a high end knife, then the knife experiences a failure, it's that persons responsibility to keep it quiet until the manufacturer is notified and allow to fix it and assuming they do fix it, the failure should forever be kept quiet so as to not harm their reputation??? What???

I thank the OP for his post and what appears to me to be honest information. To the OP, please ignore the haters.

Thanks remmmm for your comments I completely agree with you which is why I posted in the first place, not to bad mouth Falkniven (I had no previous experience of their products and so no reason to like or dislike them) but simply to highlight my own experience

Regards

J

 

[kinskibrain]

Later that morning I once again unsheathed the knife to prepare breakfast and that is when I noticed the damage to the blade and the broken tip. I searched inside the sheath and my bag for the broken tip but could not find it.

I am honestly sorry about your knife, but at least it sounds like you had a great adventure. All I wanted to stress is that the circumstances are unclear. We're all speculating. It could be the heat treat or the grind or perhaps you were unlucky and hit a rock. You don't know how it happened either.
I have started lots of fires with my F1. I have knowingly abused it once when I wanted to do some ice fishing and didn't have my axe or drill and used my F1 to hack a hole through 30 cm of ice in -25 C. I have chipped 1095 Moras hacking in ice but the F1 was completely unmarked even after such heavy abuse. I was prepared to swallow eventual chipping but it was fine. In five years of using this knife almost daily I have had zero problems. I only sometimes think of making it thinner because I think the convex profile could be less beefy.
So forgive me if I sound suspicious when I see pictures like that I naturally wonder what has happened to the poor thing as I know from long experience how ridiculously sturdy the F1 is. I hope your F1 will be sorted out and you should write more about your adventures "exactly as they happened". They sound like a lot of fun. Take care.

Cheers to Esav Benyamin for excellent post.

 

[GTVi]

Due to lack of information of all of the facts, the OP deserves the benefit of the doubt.
He has documented his story as best he can. If he were lying then he and only he knows it and will only be mocking himself. However no other person can pass judgement on what happened with so little facts on how the tip was damaged. Let it be. What we do know is the tip WAS damaged, the evidence is there, and it would be a shame to find out it is a manufacturing fault. Although I can understand that the likelihood is probably a low percentage based on other peoples statements.

I hope the OP has another opportunity to review another F1 and demonstrate the quality of the knife and Fallkniven's reputation.

 

[digdeep]

I think most people come to Bladeforums to learn and to share experiences as friends and teachers. And that is how it should be.

However, there are a certain few who have not come to be friends (or even friendly) and find this venue as an opportunuty to criticize and denegrate others, it's what they do best - they like to play the part of the forum badass. I have never understood that kind of person and I guess I never will.

From what I can tell The Welshman did not come here with an attitude or agenda. He came to share an experience he had with a knife. That's one of the purposes of a forum like this. And I for one found the review honest as well as interesting.

 

[Mikael W]

But I have used a SGPS FK before, and I just don't like the steel at all. Deforms and dulls too quickly for my tastes. But my uses don't require easy sharpening.

SGPS shouldn't deform and/or dull quickly at all!
I think I know what You are saying,as I had similiar thoughts on my first FK, the TK1.
I couldn't figure out why it didn't hold the edge as good as a cheap laminated carbon steel Mora.

It took me several months of learning to sharpen and hone the convex powdersteel, before it started to hold the edge, as it could be expected of such a premium knife.
This also meant that the factory edge and the steel right behind it, was replaced with a new edge.
Today that knife is my benchmark,when I measure good cutting qualitys, but I have so far not managed to equal the TK1.
Without the factory edge it has turned out as a very good knife, perhaps my best 4" blade.

Today I have several 3G steel knives and the TK2 feels much harder already out of the box.
It doesn't deform or dull as the TK1 or as You describe.
Instead it keeps almost all of the factory edge, as it is so hard to dull it.
Same with my TK3 and SK3.

The TK3 was flatground with a bevel and has been convexed, with the help of a diamond DC stone.
The SK3 Juni is so hard that the original edge grinding marks refuses to go away.
It just don't go dull in regular use!
It can be dulled but it takes an effort or accident to do that.

My WM1 in 3G has had 3 accidents,were the tip hit the concrete workshop floor.
The first two hits damaged the tip and it had to be resharpened.
The third time the tip took a piece out of the concrete, but stayed unbroken.

All this various experience with 3G over the last 6 years, had made me think and discuss with Fällkniven, why I feel a difference between the knives.
Firstly it's in the sharpening skills of the user and in my case it has been a learning curve that takes a lot of time.
Both Peter and Erik has said that the differrences shouldn't be there and every batch is followed by it's own heat-treatment protocol including a test blade.

So that leaves me very puzzled.
Is there a differrence as I, Hardheart and others can witness about from using the knives or is it in the sharpening skills?


The maker of the carbon steel blade in the broken Sami knife mentioned before in this thread said:
-Just grind to new steel as the edge sometimes gets overheated in the grinding process!.
That's from a maker of blades!

Maybe this is what it's all about, overheating when grinding the factoryedge?

Regards
Mikael

 

[mete]

I've been trying to tell people about that for years !! My final sharpening is by hand not machine . For the best new alloys diamond is the way to go or at least a good ceramic stone ! In addition I usually sharpen an edc freehand . Don't wait until the blade is very dull .an occassional touch-up is the best way.
So master the basics .
Get a good steel that has been properly hardened .
Learn to find a good shape, usually convex .

 

[Mikael W]

Mete, I agree with what You say and this is my thinking too!

In real life, this means I sharpen my new and expensive knife until it behaves as I want it to do.
I don't have the stamina to send knives back and forth to the maker, everytime I feel the edge is gone too hot.

Right or wrong I don't know, but what else to do?


Regards
Mikael

 

[Sig_Op]

I am not making claims against you. I am making claims against your review. I am sorry Welshman but you don't know anything about me or my use of knives so you calling me an indoor knife-polisher is unfair. And I don't know anything about you either. All I know is that I have seen a picture where the knife edge has quite clearly been used with a fire steel (judging from the brown particles surround what looks like a burn) and that the user has allowed a stainless knife to corrode.
Experienced users know the importance of taking good care of their equipment in the field. Especially if their life depends on it.
The circumstance of the broken tip or the damaged edge is still not known. I re-read your post and there is just a general description of an evening with camp duties. As I wrote - I am only commenting on your post. Nothing else.

have you ever used falkniven? striking a ferro rod on the spine,theglobs ofspark seem to melt into it, ive used them plenty and ill tell you, it seems like they melt there. i dont see the blade beong used. and az square as the spine iz on those knives

 

[Mikael W]

have you ever used falkniven? striking a ferro rod on the spine,theglobs ofspark seem to melt into it, ive used them plenty and ill tell you, it seems like they melt there. i dont see the blade beong used. and az square as the spine iz on those knives

Sig-Op, Kinskibrain is a wellknown user of FK's since long and I know him from a Swedish speaking outdoor forum.

The F1 VG-10 version has the outer laminate in softer 420j2 steel.
It is said to be around hrc 55 and this makes the outer laminate much tougher than the core.
A sort of industrially made differrential hardness as the core is hrc 59.

Personally I use a piece of cut off metallsaw blade as a firesteel striker and I always have an easy to clean knife.

The pic is the extra set I keep in my travelpack, a firesteel & sawblade, a Stainless Mora with epoxied Mooseantler, a Laplander saw and a GB Mini ax.

View attachment 324604

Regards
Mikael

 

[arty]

I have a number of Fallknivens in a variety of steels. I like the knives, but I wouldn't expect to use any stainless steel as hard as a good, tough high carbon steel.
If I had the option of getting a hatchet in 440C or a high carbon tool steel, I wouldn't consider the stainless 440C. For a fishing knife, it is a different story, and
I like steels with plenty of chromium - like VG10.
I have little experience out in the field, but I do know that thin edges with acute angles don't make for strong edges. If sharpening chisels, I wouldn't sharpen a
mortise chisel with as acute an edge as a paring chisel, and the opposite applies. My F1 is in VG10. This a good, high quality steel, but I wouldn't expect a stainless steel like this to be as tough as typical high carbon steels. I wouldn't buy a carpenter's chisel for very rough work if made in VG10 or G3.
I know that the knife is advertised as one that was used for survival purposes, but I also know that the 3G steel is very high carbon and high chromium steel. For me, this makes it a slicer.

 

[Mannlicher]

did not read all the thread, but I find it a bit odd, that a fellow out of the USA, posts a negative review of a knife as his first post on the forum. Odd.

 

[Brisket]

I too have several different Fallknivens in VG-10 (laminated and solid), 3G, & SGPS and have never had any issues. I consider the F1 a cutting tool and as such have never used one to pry, dig or baton. It is not a bushcraft knife, shovel or axe and there is a reason why we don't see those tools made from premium stainless steels of high hardness. As arty mentioned above, those tools are usually made from high carbon steel and they are less prone to chipping and are easier to repair in the field should they need it.

I know the F1 is marketed as a survival knife, but that obviously means different things to different people. I see survival in general as the process of enduring and escaping whatever situation you are in with what resources are available to you. Those survival resources are generally limited and not replaceable, so if you take your refined edge cutting tool made from a premium powdered & high hardened steel to improve edge retention and start hammering the crap out of it with a stick, dig a hole with it or other stressful tasks to the point where it is no longer a refined edge cutting tool then you just might just fail at surviving because you suck at preserving your limited resources.

The F1 is well known as the survival knife of the Swedish Air Force and though I haven't seen their survival manual I have scanned the Swedish Army survival manual and doubt that it is significantly different. That manual, like many others, cover the use of your survival knife and other kit items to make items such as bowls, spoons, improvised footwear, snares, traps, shelters, bone sewing needles & fish hooks, twisted rope, etc. as well is game processing. The photos depict small tree branches for use as wood material and there are no instructions in the 200+ pages that I have found for using your knife to split wood, dig holes or other knife stressing activities.

If you look at the Fallkniven warranty, you will see that they consider a knife to be a "precision cutting implement" and state that incorrect use will invalidate the warranty. Here is the Fallkniven warranty from the 2013-2014 catalog: (I'm pretty certain that by "prising" they mean "prying".)

Warranty
We offer a two-year guarantee covering material and manufacturing defects, i.e. defects that arise during manufacture but are not discovered until the knife is in use. A defect is generally discovered within half a year, not after several years. We repair or replace the knife. The guarantee is not valid if the knife has been used incorrectly -the knife is a precision cutting implement and is not to be used for levering or prising. Discoloring caused by blood, salt-water or other corrosive substances is not covered by the guarantee, neither are broken blade points. The sheath will be replaced if faults in the original manufacturing are found.

Fallkniven has a excellent reputation for warranty service and I would imagine that they will make good on this claim even if they find the knife free of manufacturing defects. That is one of the reasons why Fallknivens are on the pricey side and why user misuse helps keep it that way. Just to be clear I'm not saying the OP doesn't have a defective knife and that is certainly possible, but it appears from his own photos and description that misuse might be a factor. Tips don't just fall off knives (defective or not) on their own. I have broken very few knife tips post puberty and in every case I knew immediately after it happened. In all but one case the tip breakage was due to an accidental knife drop.

 

[pwet]

I know the F1 is marketed as a survival knife, but that obviously means different things to different people. I see survival in general as the process of enduring and escaping whatever situation you are in with what resources are available to you. Those survival resources are generally limited and not replaceable, so if you take your refined edge cutting tool made from a premium powdered & high hardened steel to improve edge retention and start hammering the crap out of it with a stick, dig a hole with it or other stressful tasks to the point where it is no longer a refined edge cutting tool then you just might just fail at surviving because you suck at preserving your limited resources.
.

most clever intervention of the thread imho. its all about expectations meeting real life.

funny story though, customer services are all full of damages that just happened without the user even knowing, touching, using the good, no matter the industry branch.

to the op, as you went to sleep with a pristine razor sharp knife that was damaged when you woke up, did you conssider someone could have used your knife to do whatever crap could have caused the damages during your sleep ? say striking the ferro rod a couple of times because the fire died , using the edge and striking a rock with the tip in the movement ? people often lie in those situations. i'm surprised this option was not explored yet.

what i mean is that damage doesnt happen by magic even if the knife is defective the tip has not decided to get shorter, and as you inspected it after the only half demanding job you performed ... something else may have happened.

 

[shunsui]

If Fallkniven sends you a new knife, can I have the broken one ?

 

[Brisket]

pwet - thanks for you comment. The unknown user scenario you proposed is certainly plausible in this case. I had seen kitchen knife damage from obvious misuse in my own household that no one was willing to fess up to.

 

[The Welshman]

OK guys so hear we go, sorry for the delay in posting the outcome of my broken Fallkniven knife. I had to wait until Fallkniven gave me their response.

First up - I sent the knife when I was back in the UK after Christmas and Fallkniven sent the knife back to me less than 2 weeks later so im happy with their response time.

Secondly - The original knife was sent back to me but regrinded. To be fair it looks like it did when I first opened it at Christmas as a brand new knife. The edge is shaving sharp and the manufacturer has taken away the blemish's in the edge as you can see from the picture (sorry about the quality their from my phone).

I am a little disappointed that the knife was not replaced with a new one as I still do not understand why the tip broke so easily. That said I am happy with the finnish on the knife after its regrind and maybe this extra grinding/sharpening process will actually help to strengthen what was a brand new blade. A few members have said in this post that the knife really comes into its own after usage and sharpening - fingers crossed ;-)

Also I didn't hear anything from anyone at Fallkniven about the knife? After looking at the knife I presume they thought like many of the members who commented in this thread that I was mis-using the knife or that I lied about how it was broken.

So now that I have my knife back, new edge and I have NOTHING to loose by lying I will say this ONE MORE TIME. - I did not mis use the knife, I did not drop the knife, the knife was not used by anyone except me. It was used for menial camp duties and I have NO IDEA how the tip broke off. Obviously it didn't happen by magic but I will never know.
I am a reasonably experienced outdoorsman, I have owned and used knives for a long time using them for their intended purpose. I travel alot and have used knives in the Jungle, In the Desert, In the Snow, Up Mountains, Volcano's, I have been a diver for fifteen years so I have even used them under the water.

I am not bragging, just trying to give you a better picture of who I am and to give my background to the members in this thread who are calling me an inexperienced, newbie idiot.

I will post again on this forum reviewing the new Fallkniven F1 and its performance. I have the opportunity to put it through its paces in the woods in a few days on a camping trip with some friends. I am also about to take delivery of a Becker BK2 which I plan on modding so ill post about that too (not that the Bladeforums probably need any more BK2 reviews ;-))

I would like to finish this review and its outcome by saying firstly - THANKYOU to the members who showed their support and knowledge throughout this thread - you are a credit to Bladeforums and I have benefited from your encouragement and advice. Thankyou to Fallkniven and Eric for addressing my problem and fixing it.

To those 'members' who doubted me and still doubt me, called me names, blindly throwing their ten cents into my review, calling me a knife hater, Fallkniven brand tarnisher and all the other BS. I should change the title of this thread from Falkniven 3G Sadly Disappointed to Fallkniven 3G pleasantly surprised but sadly disappointed in the ignorance and immaturity of certain people.

For those people who benefited from my HONEST review of the F1 3G and to those people looking to buy the knife I will offer this advice -

1 - If you buy the knife with the intention of using it in possibly wet conditions get the Zytel sheath, the leather looks nicer (IMO) but it will deform in when wet.

2 - If using a firesteel with the knife use a striker instead of the spine of the knife. It works just fine, throwing big sparks but it seems that on this particular model of the F1 the sparks actually melt the metal on the spine - not great but easily overcome.

3 - be careful when using the knife out of the box, use it for less demanding tasks and sharpen to allow the blade to perform at its best in the long run.

4 - Be careful about posting negative reviews on this knife on Bladeforums, you will get a plethora of Falkniven cult members tracking your every move for the rest of your life. They will hunt you down in the woods, string you to a pole and BBQ you over a fire made (of course) with FAllkniven knives and then they will eat you using their - you guessed it.

 

[The Welshman]

did not read all the thread, but I find it a bit odd, that a fellow out of the USA, posts a negative review of a knife as his first post on the forum. Odd.

Hi Mannlicher - Why is it odd that i posted an honest review? - are you another one of those members who is going to call me a liar or a Fallkniven hater? - even though as you stated "did not read all the thread"

What seems odd to me is that it should matter why I am "a fellow out of the USA" and that you bother to comment without reading the thread!

 

[The Welshman]

If Fallkniven sends you a new knife, can I have the broken one ?

Hi shunsui, they sent me back the original so no new knife for you sorry ;-)