feather pattern question.

jdm61

jdm61

itinerant metal pounder
Joined
Aug 12, 2005
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If you want to make a long blade of feather damascus like a kitchen knife, do you just forge a really tight pattern with more layers, do the normal split and reweld and then just draw it out? it would seem to me that the pattern isn't going to "distort" because everything will all move the same amount in theory. Would you worry more about it being too coarse if you draw it way out? I guess that the same question would apply to anything where you made a "loaf" right?
 
I have never made that pattern but have been wanting to try it. I would think as long as it was stretched evenly it will be fine but the pattern will stretch out and become coarser but by how much all depends on your layer count you start with and how tall your billet is. I think you could calculate needed layers in the start billet by figuring the height of the start billet and how much it is going stretch and how many layers per inch you want in your finished billet. If your blade is say 8" and 4" tang and your start billet is 3" tall and you want say 50 layers per inch then your stack would need 50x12/3=200 layers in you start billet that was 3" tall.
 
jdm61 said:
If you want to make a long blade of feather damascus like a kitchen knife, do you just forge a really tight pattern with more layers, do the normal split and reweld and then just draw it out? it would seem to me that the pattern isn't going to "distort" because everything will all move the same amount in theory. Would you worry more about it being too coarse if you draw it way out? I guess that the same question would apply to anything where you made a "loaf" right?
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That's how I do it. I have made Bowles out of 3" tall billet at the split
 
the blacksmiths/smelters to ask this - who have intimate knowledge of creating feather damascus - would be hhh and dennis friedly - they are both experts at making feather damascus...

jzs
 
I wouldn't hesitate to try it as long as I was using a press to execute. Even with a press I think it would need to be flat dies and not rounded or drawing dies.

How would you figure out the proportion so you would end up with the correct width relative to length?

An interesting project for sure.
 
FWIW - there are a few smiths that make just amazing feathers - Dave Lisch, Bruce Bump, Bill Buxton and Kevin Casey spring to mind.

I'd see what those guys do :D

Bill Flynn
 
Fred. I have a press, but i think that having a small rolling mill at some point in the process might be even better. I would likely start with the small thick billet being the same general "shape" as the finished blade, albeit a lot shorter and fatter. That would require shaping, grinding a surface smooth and checking the orientation of the feather, I would think. I did read in one of Bruce Bump's threasds that it is probably better to lose some steel by grinding away some at the tip intend of trying to totally fore it to shape/profile.
Fred.Rowe said:
I wouldn't hesitate to try it as long as I was using a press to execute. Even with a press I think it would need to be flat dies and not rounded or drawing dies.

How would you figure out the proportion so you would end up with the correct width relative to length?

An interesting project for sure.
Click to expand...
 
After hot cutting can you weld right back up. Meaning do you have to hot cut all the way through or can you leave just a small section connected like you would when folding hot. I'm really wanting to try this pattern, but have seen 2 styles. One that's like yours and the other where it looks like it was just a layered billet split and each layer is solid all the way to the center. Any tips on doing this pattern,
 
I cut clear through; my reasoning, I want to be able to take each piece separately, square it up and grind the surfaces so when its rewelded the line in the center is even and the weld is a good one.
So much time is involved in making a feather billet you don't want to run the risk of failure anywhere along the process.
DSC01928.JPG
 
I have seen some where the center line is not, well, "centered" or aligned properly and that is something the I would definitely want to avoid. With the type of kitchen knife that I make, that would mean that the center line would be canted up slightly relative to the spine to follow a line from the center of the heel to the tip.
 
That is nice, as are Cody's examples. :thumbup:
Fred.Rowe said:
I cut clear through; my reasoning, I want to be able to take each piece separately, square it up and grind the surfaces so when its rewelded the line in the center is even and the weld is a good one.
So much time is involved in making a feather billet you don't want to run the risk of failure anywhere along the process.
DSC01928.JPG
Click to expand...
 
Cody Hofsommer said:
Here are a couple of mine. I don't have a press, I split it with a hot cut and a sledge, by my self.
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Beautiful.......and done the hard way too! You are my new hero:D
I have wanted to try a feather pattern for a while now, this thread is fueling the fire! Nice to see it can be done without a press.
Darcy:)
 
So doing some reading about s pattern. It looks like you go at it like a crushed W but when you get to the restack and weld. You don't lay it over and forge it out but split it from top to bottom which creates the nice layered feather pattern. Now how about the temp of the billet when splitting. Will different heats give a better flow of the pattern?

In my first post I was thinking you wanted a simple stack and cut like this.
58b1bc0cacc039603262200f5324226f.jpg
 
Dummy edit. All hail the King!!!!! That fact that Hoss was able to get that thing to stay in one piece is ming boggling. :D.
JTknives said:
So doing some reading about s pattern. It looks like you go at it like a crushed W but when you get to the restack and weld. You don't lay it over and forge it out but split it from top to bottom which creates the nice layered feather pattern. Now how about the temp of the billet when splitting. Will different heats give a better flow of the pattern?

In my first post I was thinking you wanted a simple stack and cut like this.
58b1bc0cacc039603262200f5324226f.jpg
Click to expand...
 
Last edited:
Hey, nice knife. That one is stainless, ten times harder to do than carbon steel.

Hoss
 
DEllis said:
Beautiful.......and done the hard way too! You are my new hero:D
I have wanted to try a feather pattern for a while now, this thread is fueling the fire! Nice to see it can be done without a press.
Darcy:)
Click to expand...

Very nice job, those are a booger to keep straight doing it like that.
 
Only 10 times? Humility is a good thing and all that ,but seriously, Hoss, I can't cant' figure out how you can do even something like a "simple" feather with stainless. :thumbup: When I posted my previous comment, I couldn't read he makers mark. ;)
DevinT said:
Hey, nice knife. That one is stainless, ten times harder to do than carbon steel.

Hoss
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