FINISHED my first damascus fixed blade!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

C

chad2

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Sep 2, 2011
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over all length: 9 1/8"
sharpened edge length: 4"
length fron handle to tip of blade: 4 1/4"
blade thickness: 3/16"
brass pin thickness: 1/4"
g10 thickness: 3/8"
handle at thickest point: 15/16"
blade material: alabama damascus
edge angle: 25 degrees on both sides

HEAT TREAT:

1) i heated to 1550 for 2-3 mins as the directions call for and quenched in canola oil heated to about 80-90 degrees then put it into my freezer for 24 hours
2) i repeated the first step to be sure of full hardness then i tested the blade with a file it skates :-) yeah!. and then it was back in the freezer for another 24 hours
3) the next day was a temper at 400 degrees for 2 hours then pull out and quench in cold water. back to the freezer for 24 hours
4) the next day was a temper at 400 degrees for 2 hours this time letting it air cool to room temp then back to the freezer 24 hours
5) the next day was a temper at 380 degrees for 2 hours letting it cool to room temp.




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comparison picture
 
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Chad - very nice! Love the belly, overall shape and handle. Give it a nice sheath and good to go.

GREAT job!
 
Looks good Chad. How did you like working with Damascus? I am also working on my first two with Damascus from Alabama Damascus and I am afraid I am going to get hooked on the stuff. ;)
 
Nice job.


BTW,
The freezer thing is just a folk tale. The Mf is about 200F for that steel mix, so there is no gain from keeping it at 10F overnight. Also, the martensitic transformation is a very fast process (fraction of a second) so long soaks at any temperature above -300F will not do more than an hour at that temp. Complex alloys and stainless steels benefit from sub-zero quench(-100F) or cryo (-300F), but carbon steels do all their work above 100F.
 
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Patrice Lemée;10628710 said:
Looks good Chad. How did you like working with Damascus? I am also working on my first two with Damascus from Alabama Damascus and I am afraid I am going to get hooked on the stuff. ;)
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It is a dream to work with i love the stuff it sharpens a little easier then 154cm at a 400 degree temper, very nice edge. Very easy to grind and hand sand when not heat treated and there was very minimal decarb after quenching even twice :-) i could not bevlieve my eyes when i first heat tretaed it and saw almost no decarb with canola oil and the second time i was floored. Especialy because i am used to using 5160 and motor oil. You will be hooked but i do not have the money to make knives from this stuff it cost way to much this knife was for a body of mine. So go ahead and get hooked i wish i could :-)
 
Before you get hooked, be sure to try out a few other types of damascus. Mostly they are a lot more expensive, but since Patrice is so wealthy that should not be a problem. ;)
 
Wow, I love the handle on this thing. You got the shaping almost perfectly symmetrical on both sides! Any secrets to that? That is definitely something I have trouble with on layered G-10
 
Good looking knife Chad. Nice handle contours... well done, sir!

Yes, as stated above the freezer thing is useless on carbon steel. I believe your damascus is either 5160 or 52100 with 15N20 and 203 stainless. None of that benefits from cryo treatment. And by cryo I mean real cryo(-300F), not -4F to -10F, which is the range of most freezers. I think you can save yourself A LOT of time by ditching that process. Unless you have found evidence that it truly does something.

Just my thoughts.
 
wolffbite said:
Wow, I love the handle on this thing. You got the shaping almost perfectly symmetrical on both sides! Any secrets to that? That is definitely something I have trouble with on layered G-10
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I do everything by eye first i use a my ginder and get it as close as possible and then i do a lot of hand sanding to my liking. :-)
 
That is a nice looking blade.

That grind is a real cutter.
 
Rick Marchand said:
Good looking knife Chad. Nice handle contours... well done, sir!

Yes, as stated above the freezer thing is useless on carbon steel. I believe your damascus is either 5160 or 52100 with 15N20 and 203 stainless. None of that benefits from cryo treatment. And by cryo I mean real cryo(-300F), not -4F to -10F, which is the range of most freezers. I think you can save yourself A LOT of time by ditching that process. Unless you have found evidence that it truly does something.

Just my thoughts.
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This is how i look at it we are all knife makers here our job is to go above and beyond right. we sell knives that you normally can not get that kind of craftsmanship from a manufacturer, right? Know here is my question to you guys do you believe it is hurting the steel for me to put it in a freezer? If not then i am doing my job as a knife maker by going above and beyond what is normal for a manufacturer. If ed fowler says he has found that it has given him some good results then that is good enough for me. Let me know what you think of this, because i think every custom maker should live by this. Now i am not saying that you are wrong for not doing it fowlers way but the things you do you should be going above and beyond.
 
I agree with going "above and beyond" and commend you for having that attitude. Just because an added process doesn't hurt the blade, doesn't mean it benefits it. In my opinion, the freezer method(regardless of who uses or promotes it) has not met the burden of proof needed to convince me that it does anything at all. Real sub-zero cryogenics has been proven to benefit high alloy stainless steels.... not so for plain carbon steel. It is just that simple for me. Do you have any proof that it does? If you want to truly go above and beyond, you should be asking yourself these questions and demanding demonstrable answers.
 
I went back to review your original post. You go from the quench right into the freezer without tempering first.... that can damage a blade beyond repair. If you insist on using the freezer method, atleast temper at 350-375F first.

HEAT TREAT:

1) i heated to 1550 for 2-3 mins as the directions call for and quenched in canola oil heated to about 80-90 degrees then put it into my freezer for 24 hours
2) i repeated the first step to be sure of full hardness then i tested the blade with a file it skates :-) yeah!. and then it was back in the freezer for another 24 hours
3) the next day was a temper at 400 degrees for 2 hours then pull out and quench in cold water. back to the freezer for 24 hours
4) the next day was a temper at 400 degrees for 2 hours this time letting it air cool to room temp then back to the freezer 24 hours
5) the next day was a temper at 380 degrees for 2 hours letting it cool to room temp.
Click to expand...
 
Rick Marchand said:
I went back to review your original post. You go from the quench right into the freezer without tempering first.... that can damage a blade beyond repair. If you insist on using the freezer method, atleast temper at 350-375F first.

HEAT TREAT:
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Do you have proof of that?
 
Ed fowler clearly states on his website that he does 24 hour cycles between each quench and temper and puts the blade in the freezer every time read his website
 
I hope this discussion doesn't turn into a urination tournament.

I will say I'm basically in agreement with the sentiment that "above and beyond" means being willing to do the work to make sure what you're doing is right, as opposed to just taking someone's word for it.
 
here we go again.....

I've tried the "freezer trick" for fun..no, nothing nada..no effect what so ever,especially on non-stainless steels. Cryo is another ball of wax, even with dry ice I've seen 2-3 pts. of additional hardness.

Proof that not tempering before cryo can case dammage? Yup, it only took me once. I didn't snap temper the blade and it just broke- "pop". Quenching induces alot of internal stress even with it sitting at room temp, taking it to the -100 and below before tempering is asking for problems.
 
chad2 said:
Do you have proof of that?
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Lots of reliable proof for that in just about any metallurgical text on the subject. That is the difference.

I thought you posted your HT process for input? My mistake. I don't want to cause a flame war.
 
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Rick Marchand said:
Lots of reliable proof for that in just about any metallurgical text on the subject. That is the difference.
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Would love to get my hands on one of those books one day but i think this discussion should be done on a diff thread thanks for all of your post guys :-) and you to rick :-)
 
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