First Knife In Progress

[Tiiiiiiiim]

Ok, so i have NO idea what goes into forging a blade and all that stuff and i've probably done this all wrong in a way insulting to the real knife makers but hey, gotta start somewhere. If anything it will just help me get a feel for shaping the blade.

Thats what it looks like after 2 hours. (sorry for the crappy photo.)

The metal i used is just from an old circular saw blade, it's probably some crap metal that wont even hold an edge but hey, good practice. I just drew it out on the saw blade with a pen, cut it out with an angle grinder, then shaped it up with a course file.

 

[Ochs]

Not quite sure what you are looking for here...but somehow I doubt you want to be told that you made a great blade. LOL. Seriously, kudos to you for giving it a try. This is exactly how I got started. Actually, circular saw blades should hold a decent edge especially if they do not get them too hot in the process of making them. Realize of coase that this saw blade has been hardened so it is tough to work with and after a few of these you will need a new file. :grumpy: Most knives are first ground from metal in the annealed state then heat treated and given a final grind and polish. If you have interest in making knives I would recommend doing some reading, Bob Loveless' book "How to Make Knives" is a great place to start. Good luck.

 

[Tiiiiiiiim]

Ok, thanks. Yeah, i was just going to post some progress pics so people could tell me what im doing wrong and right so i can improve on the next one.

 

[Ochs]

Making knives is a long and detailed process of steps and in your case this is the short cut tough work method since the steel is already hardened.

First things first though we need to finish designing what we are making. You seem to have a decent blade shape, though the tip could maybe use to be a bit pointier depending on your use. Since this is a first knife and you are already started let’s just focus on making something functional and basic and concentrate on your handle design and how the transition to the blade is going to work.

Now get out a few of your favorite knives and look closely at them and figure out how you want your handle to be, then draw/trace where you want your handle and transition to the blade on your metal with a sharpie pen. Also, think about what you are going to use as a grip as you will likely need a drill press with a carbide bit (or maybe three bits) to get through that saw blade I would recommend strongly that you consider a Mil-spec type cord wrap handle. Let’s assume that you do a cord handle, consider putting a guard type bump in the front and back of the handle to create a stop point for your cord. A small notch in the front and back of perimeter edge could work too. Once you have the profile of the entire knife drawn then stick the blade in your vise and take your angle grinder and file to it until you have the profile shape you drew on the metal.

You might also want to do your best to draw a straight line down your blade edge with a scribe or sharpie to give you something to file to keep the blade edge straight. Also mark with a sharpie where you want your primary blade bevel to go to and have at it with the file. Post some picks when you’re done. Good luck.

 

[Tiiiiiiiim]

haha, i think this posts a bit late. I've been at it again this morning. Thanks for going to the trouble though.

The blades just about done, just have to get a few more scratches out. Im not that happy with the shape. I probably shouldn't have attempted the bevel on the top and would have preferred to have less of the blade angled. I couldn't do everything i wanted or how i wanted because the metal was quite thin. I'll try thicker metal next time so i can define the lines more. Pics below.

finished shaping with file

cleaning off scratches with oil stone

honing surfaces with fine diamond water stone

buffed it up to see remaining scratches

edge ground and sharpened (current state)

 

[Ochs]

Well you have put some elbow grease into that. For a sawblade first that blade looks pretty nice. Personally I would focus on how to make the handle work well at this point. A nice blade is fine but needs a handle to be useful. You might even consider loosing a little blade length in favor of a functional handle but that is just me. You are off to fine start.

 

[Campbellclanman]

Well you have put some elbow grease into that. For a sawblade first that blade looks pretty nice. Personally I would focus on how to make the handle work well at this point. A nice blade is fine but needs a handle to be useful. You might even consider loosing a little blade length in favor of a functional handle but that is just me. You are off to fine start.

Ochs

I have just been reading your great comments of support to tiiiiiiiim, well done, and tim-thanks for sharing- its real interesting what you are doing-keep it up

 

[Ochs]

Campbellclanman thanks for the encouragement. I assume you are Scottish, I'm Cameron. Anyway Tiiiiiim not sure if you have solved your hand work yet or not but had a couple of ideas for you given the shape of the material you have to work with. You might try a curved handle. Here are a couple pics that might help. Have you decide what to do for the handle material?

 

[Campbellclanman]

Hey there Cameron...didnt my great great Grandfather kill your Great Great uncle just down by the..... lol,
possibly the other way around.
Im of Scotts heritage, Im 1/4 Scotts blood.my grandparents immigrated to New Zealand.
Keep up the good work..i wish I could do what you guys are...
It looks as though tiiiiiim has only one choice and that is a half tang? either that or will the handle be slightly short if full?
Thank you.
p.s ..tiiiiiim...are those bb pellet holes circled in your garage wall? lol

 

[Ochs]

Half tang could work sweet and judging from the shop we might have some wood to work with!?

 

[Tiiiiiiiim]

Anyway Tiiiiiim not sure if you have solved your hand work yet or not but had a couple of ideas for you given the shape of the material you have to work with. You might try a curved handle. Here are a couple pics that might help. Have you decide what to do for the handle material?

Half tang could work sweet and judging from the shop we might have some wood to work with!?

Im actually thinking of attempting a folder, the blades only about 3 1/2'' long. And yes im planing on a wood handle. I actually work at a custom furniture makers (that's where the pictures are taken), so we have plenty of timber.

Keep up the good work..i wish I could do what you guys are...
It looks as though tiiiiiim has only one choice and that is a half tang? either that or will the handle be slightly short if full?
Thank you.
p.s ..tiiiiiim...are those bb pellet holes circled in your garage wall? lol

Yeah, it was only a small saw blade so i didn't have much steel to work with. That's why i think a folder would be good.

Haha, no they're not bb holes. probably just drill holes.

 

[Ochs]

tiiiiiim, you can do as you like and I will help as I can from here but folders require lots of careful planning before even touching metal in order for the movement to work right and all the shapes to come together, I would suggest you wait a year or so to try that. I think that is an extremely tough go. As Campbellclanman suggested how about a half tang. I have one I am repairing right now pictured below as well as one I made from bamboo.

Here is a good example of one with a wood handle in the Custom Section here on Blade Forums.

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=750472

At this point if you do it this way it is important to find the block of wood you are going to use, cut it to basic square over size as shown in picture. Then cut and shape the hidden portion of the half tang knife. I have sketched a possible diagram for you in the picture. If you are going to add a guard or are going to notch the wood so it rides up onto the back portion of the blade you will need to figure that out and size your wood for that.

Now note the notches in the diagram in the picture by running a pin though the handle side to side at these points you can permanently attach the handle to the blade, allong with some good industrial grade epoxy from the hardware store. The pins could be stainless (410 or 416 if possible), brass, nickel or copper. In a pinch get 12 gauge or large single stand electrical romex wire the others will likely be available at metal superstore or craft store if you live in a large town or city. Also the exact pin location and notches can be moved or additonal ones added if you like.

Now when you cut your hidden tang out be sure not to cut a square inside corner where the tang meets the blade. Note how the diagram shows a rounded inside corner where the the blade tapers down to the tang. This is to avoid a weak spot and have the tang break off at the end of the blade.

Once the tang is shaped take your handle block carefully mark out the layout of your tang as you want it to be on the knife. You can see on the wood block for the one I am repairing the basic shape of the knife handle I will make and where the pin holes will be (hard to see sorry). By the way don't ask why I am fixing this POS, my Mom loves it so there you go. LOL. Oh and you might want to masking tape your blade so it does not cut you or get scratched up in this pocess. Take the marked out handle block and if you are lucky enough to have a drill press it will make this next step come out so much more acurate and save a multitude of possible problems. We will need a bit the width of the thickness of your blade and long enough to accomidate the entire length of the hidden tang. Mark measure and plot this a couple times to make sure you have it right and try not to over drill these holes. drill a series of holes adjacent to each other to accomadate the depth of your hidden tang. Then dirll out the pin holes. Sweet, I just found this post...Here is a detailed post by Bruce Bump, a true master knifemaker. Check out this he explains it well and has some good detail shots too.

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=659442

Then post your progress before you glue and pin it all up. or sooner if need be. Good luck!

 

[Tiiiiiiiim]

Wow, thanks for going to all this trouble. I read the post too late again. Im pretty set on making a folder now, i like the challenge and the problem solving. I didn't get that much done today. I just cut out some rectangle bits of steel from the same blade for the inside of the handle, selected my timber and started shaping.

I set the timber on the blade just so you could get a feel for it.

Why does making a folder take so much preparation, it's all just positioning isn't it?

 

[Ochs]

Yikes! It appears easy enough to position your blade. But are you proposing to use wood as the frame? If so this is going to be a LARGE folders and sit on your shelf. At this point I think you just need to sit down and figure out how you are going to do it. You will need a carbide bit to drill a pivot hole through that and a decent drill press. I would recommend that you use some titanium or 410 stainless in say .050-.080 thickness as a liner frame. You will need to get a pivot, figure out your spacer material, if you are planning to make it lock you will need to figure out how the lock will work. Also, you will need to have a stop or notch for a slipjoint to hold the blade in the open position. You are eager there is no doubt about that but I would encourage you at this point to do some searching in the Knife Makers Discussion Forum here, and read about how to make this work.

 

[Tiiiiiiiim]

Wood as the frame? Not sure i understand. I was going to make an inside of the handle using the spare steel from the saw blade that would contain the blade then just attach the wood to the outside which i think they call "scales". I probably should read up on stuff but it seems more fun just figuring it out. I've got an old crappy folder i can take apart to look of the blade stop and the lock works. The type of lock i was going to do is the one where you just attach a piece of sprung metal to the inner handle that lock in behind the base of the blade when extended and you just push across with your thumb to fold up again. I forget what the locks called...the normal one. We have a drill press and everything at work. I was just going to use the left over blade steel as the spacers and stuff, would that be ok?

 

[Ochs]

I am more than happy to help you with your project. If you want to figure it out that can be fun too and go for it...So, my questions for you are: Do you think there might be any problem with using the saw blade as your frame? and if so why? And finally, and please be honest with me, am I wasting my time?

 

[Tiiiiiiiim]

I don't see any reason not to use the saw blade, then again thats why i asked. I'm sorry that your last posts were a bit of a waste of time, i really do appreciate it though and found your post about the pivots etc. useful. I would be very thankful if you could continue monitoring my progress and giving sugestions. In the end it's up to you.

I'm at college for the next 2 days so i wont be able to get out to work on the knife, Maybe i'll use this time to do a bit of research.

 

[Ochs]

Some research is an excellent idea, please consider a couple things. First, reread the posts here and see if there is something that might indicate why using the saw blade could present some problems. Also, if you don't mind at least consider the half tang fixed blade.

For your own knowledge the locking mechanism you refered is a Walker Lock, created by Micheal Walker, it is the most common, very strong and fairly simple mechanism, and commonly referred to as a liner lock. If you need a resource for this google Ray Rogers and check out his webpage, it has good information on how he builds his. If you have access to a library you could also find Bob Terzuola's book "The Tactical Folding Knife." Consider how to accomplish the steps involves. Let me know how it goes.

 

[thomgood]

So Tim just don't try and cut your blades with a torch it'll remove carbon around the heated area you cut then you have to grind all that heated zone away,about three eights of an inch.

 

[thomgood]

Hey Tim also get this book its by Ed Fowler titled Knife Talk. There are two books part one and part two.