Folding knife breaks

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FFK said:
Also a flexible HT..56-58RC. You and others keep bringing up my FFK, and yes the FEA results are very impressive, and yes I understand why they mean nothing to those who

comment negatively. How about a design suggestion or two on how you would prevent what happened to the "Folding knife that fell apart".
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What the?!? This thread you started turned into a plug for your knife! How ever did that happen?!? :eek:
 
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FFK said:
How about a design suggestion or two on how you would prevent what happened to the "Folding knife that fell apart".
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Bigger pivot.
Simple as that, and many, many, many knife companies have already done so.

The issue that usually isn't an issue has already been solved.
 
stabman said:
Bigger pivot.
Simple as that, and many, many, many knife companies have already done so.

The issue that usually isn't an issue has already been solved.
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You serious?

A 15 year old Buck knife isn't as strong as many newer offerings? Wait, a single instance on a foreign knife forum from 4 years ago isn't proof that the most common construction method for folding knives today is fatally flawed?

I still think we need to get rid of one of the scales, a liner, and then add a big clunky lever to the pivot pin. That'll cure what ails ya.
 
Tripton said:
You serious?

A 15 year old Buck knife isn't as strong as many newer offerings?
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A 15 year old Buck (or better yet, a 2 dot Buck) will be stronger than a new Buck 110.

Older models tended to have no soft bronze bushings and the lock bar and blades were not stamped and had closer tolerances when locked up. Not an uncommon topic in the Buck sub forum.

An actually, this ferun' Opinel is tougher than the Buck... by a large measure.

Buck 110 and Opinel #10 by Pinnah, on Flickr
 
pinnah,
The buck is on my workbench(20yrs). Can't say nothing about that Buck.
 
FFK said:
Looks like the knife fell apart exactly like I thought it would. Washers to blade tang clearance created the space needed to turn blade tang into a lever that pried the knife

apart. Duh.... The G10 compressed, liners deform, pivot pin breaks, simple ! Looks like he needed to do more with the only knife he had at the time. Probably not just a video

on how to make kindling from a 2x4 in your back yard. Idk....a dohickey might have helped.
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If TONS of expert knifemakers on this forum (and quite a many at that) indicate that this is one of the least common problems with design...

...and if you cannot find this issue on this large forum anywhere...

...and if you cannot even find this issue in all of the English language forums...

...and if you cannot find more than one or two events searching most of the Internet...

...what does that say about how big of an issue this really is in the real world?








FFK said:
Sam Wilson....."Folding knife breaks" some slang, I admit. Idk....maybe "Folding knife falls apart" would have been more accurate. I thought it was interesting that a folding

knife would break like that. I am happy that some made comments on the topic of the thread. Seems like bolsters are a must for increasing lateral strength.

Also a flexible HT..56-58RC. You and others keep bringing up my FFK, and yes the FEA results are very impressive, and yes I understand why they mean nothing to those who

comment negatively. How about a design suggestion or two on how you would prevent what happened to the "Folding knife that fell apart".
Click to expand...

The REASON people are bringing up the FFK and not in positive light is because you have not presented anything except words regarding how strong your knife is while speaking negatively about many different designs that are tested and proven through usage, and we have seen zero hard evidence or verifiable empirical evidence that your design improves upon them.

Additionally, you ask people for advice and then you brush them off or tell them why their advice is "wrong" because of this whole lateral strength thing. You ignore people and requests. You are making claims without backing them up. Do you really expect people to be overwhelmingly positive when they are treated in that fashion? Do you understand why people eventually start talking about anything except the topic intentionally, and why these threads get closed?

Further, let's say this is an issue and a knife with strong lateral strength is a major plus. You have not given anyone reason to believe your design makes any sort of improvement over other locking mechanisms. For all we know, your knife could fail long before the knife you are referencing in this thread did, let alone a lock of notable strength such as the Tr-Ad lock. As many highly-respected makers have noted, computer simulations are not comparable for hard (and verifiable) data. It is IMPOSSIBLE at this stage of development to give much in the way of feedback on the FFK without having tests on the FFK itself...not other knives.

People are not super positive here because they are hoping that before you make the next new thread bashing some design or trying to tell the world that the lack of lateral strength is the biggest issue since ozone depletion that you either do some actual testing or send this to someone on this forum to do unbiased and verifiable testing rather than discussing weaknesses that you feel folding knives have. Claims which are unverified are just that.

Please...for the sake of your company and the FFK knife, go back to some of the previous threads, review some of the requests and advice, and make arrangements for actual testing of the prototypes with a baseline comparison such as the Tri-Ad lock rather than spending effort on a thread which at this point will yield no more useful information until you actually test your own knife.
 
Unfortunately, the fellow does not seem to understand that computer simulations must be backed up with actual physical testing.
I see it quite often how parts in the automotive engineering world are working out beautifully in simulation, but once the actual physical tests are done, problems show themselves.

And these are simulations run on programs costing tens of thousands of dollars, by engineers with decades of experience, not some guy on the internet.

Real life...it doesn't live in a computer.
 
cricketdave said:
Mostly because he starts thread after thread after thread on the same subject or manages to cause it to migrate to the same point. Just folks getting tired of it. He would find a much more forgiving crowd if he would just comment on a few threads honestly about whatever subject in it. Instead its a feeling of oh good grief here we go again.
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I have never done this, but in response to your thread cricketdave:

:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:

His posts are little more than trolling efforts, and for those that don't believe it, click on his name and read his posts. It is all about how inferior all other knives are to his superior design.

Enough already. Why in the world do good people continue to respond to this guy?

Robert
 
I tried prying a paint can lid off with a knife. I slipped and stabbed my hand. It seems that prying anything with a sharp object is inherently dangerous. Other than prying, I can't imagine what else would cause lateral stress on a knife, unless you were using it as a throwing knife.
 
pnsxyr,
"Looks like the knife fell apart exactly like I thought it would. Washers to blade tang clearance created the space needed to turn blade tang into a lever that pried the

knife apart. Duh.... The G10 compressed, liners deform, pivot pin breaks, simple ! Looks like he needed to do more with the only knife he had at the time. Probably not just a

video on how to make kindling from a 2x4 in your back yard. Idk....a doohickey might have helped".

Lateral strength is not important to you and that's fine. It might be to someone else. Computer simulation is not an important tool to you and that's fine. It might be to

someone else. If you don't agree with the design or premise and that's fine. Someone else may. I have not brought up the FFK on this thread unless it was brought into it.

Right now we are fine tuning the FFK via FEA testing. streamlining the design....that's where money is best spent. Yes eventually we will have to break FFK prototypes.

Ok........so there was a post about using a larger pivot pin. Does anyone think that would help ? I guess if you increase the pivot pin diameter you will also decrease the blade

tang steel around it ?
 
FFK said:
pnsxyr,
"Looks like the knife fell apart exactly like I thought it would. Washers to blade tang clearance created the space needed to turn blade tang into a lever that pried the

knife apart. Duh.... The G10 compressed, liners deform, pivot pin breaks, simple ! Looks like he needed to do more with the only knife he had at the time. Probably not just a

video on how to make kindling from a 2x4 in your back yard. Idk....a doohickey might have helped".

Lateral strength is not important to you and that's fine. It might be to someone else. Computer simulation is not an important tool to you and that's fine. It might be to

someone else. If you don't agree with the design or premise and that's fine. Someone else may. I have not brought up the FFK on this thread unless it was brought into it.

Right now we are fine tuning the FFK via FEA testing. streamlining the design....that's where money is best spent. Yes eventually we will have to break FFK prototypes.

Ok........so there was a post about using a larger pivot pin. Does anyone think that would help ? I guess if you increase the pivot pin diameter you will also decrease the blade

tang steel around it ?
Click to expand...


Computer simulations really mean nothing without a real life test. That's what people are saying. You might be a level 24 necromancer is dota or whatever, doesn't mean your great beans as a warrior in real life. ;)
 
FFK said:
pnsxyr,
"Looks like the knife fell apart exactly like I thought it would. Washers to blade tang clearance created the space needed to turn blade tang into a lever that pried the

knife apart. Duh.... The G10 compressed, liners deform, pivot pin breaks, simple ! Looks like he needed to do more with the only knife he had at the time. Probably not just a

video on how to make kindling from a 2x4 in your back yard. Idk....a doohickey might have helped".

Lateral strength is not important to you and that's fine. It might be to someone else. Computer simulation is not an important tool to you and that's fine. It might be to

someone else. If you don't agree with the design or premise and that's fine. Someone else may. I have not brought up the FFK on this thread unless it was brought into it.

Right now we are fine tuning the FFK via FEA testing. streamlining the design....that's where money is best spent. Yes eventually we will have to break FFK prototypes.

Ok........so there was a post about using a larger pivot pin. Does anyone think that would help ? I guess if you increase the pivot pin diameter you will also decrease the blade

tang steel around it ?
Click to expand...


Computer simulations really mean nothing without a real life test. That's what people are saying. You might be a level 24 necromancer in dota or whatever, doesn't mean you're great beans as a warrior in real life. ;)

BTW, lots of knife makers just skip the simulations and go on directly to real life testing because that's where the proof of the pudding lies. I don't know if Cold Steel does simulations but their "proof" vids do show what they are capable of. Your claims don't hold water because you don't seem confident that your $6000 prototype can survive a CS type test or you'd have rushed to do a vid already. Even just a wimpy car door or manhole cover prying.

What's that saying again? Neurotics build castles in the sky, psychotics live in them. :D
 
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singularity35,
"Computer simulations really mean nothing without a real life test". True statement, but first you crawl before you walk. Computer simulations are a necessary step.

The second part of your question is something about beans.....my be you'd like some cheese to go with your ? Sorry ...couldn't resist. LOL
 
FFK said:
singularity35,
"Computer simulations really mean nothing without a real life test". True statement, but first you crawl before you walk. Computer simulations are a necessary step.

The second part of your question is something about beans.....my be you'd like some cheese to go with your ? Sorry ...couldn't resist. LOL
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Not at all, as I said in my edited post, lots of knife makers skip that part but if you wanna do sims, go ahead. Let's just see real life proof of the pudding. Without the real life "proof" your sims are just hot air. :D

We all can afford to post out snarky remarks because we aren't selling anything, you're the one who wants to sell knives. :foot:
 
pinnah said:
A 15 year old Buck (or better yet, a 2 dot Buck) will be stronger than a new Buck 110.

Older models tended to have no soft bronze bushings and the lock bar and blades were not stamped and had closer tolerances when locked up. Not an uncommon topic in the Buck sub forum.

An actually, this ferun' Opinel is tougher than the Buck... by a large measure.

Buck 110 and Opinel #10 by Pinnah, on Flickr
Click to expand...

I was talking about the Buck 880 referenced in an earlier post. I am not sure where the 110 and Opinel would stand against one of them. Also, I don't care. There are hundreds of modern offerings that offer more, in every category.
 
Hhhhmmm I guess no "real life" proof vids are forthcoming. Didn't you say in THAT thread that you were coming out in a vid in two weeks? That seems to have been two weeks ago already. :thumbdn:

I think it's put up or shut up time by now. :D
 
Ffk, aren't you getting answers in the knife makers forum, serious questions about making knife, prototyping will be answered there, the are the group of people who are making yesterday's, today's and tomorrow's knives.

They will take any serious question under consideration and respond in kind just listen to the experiences accumulated through year of doing what you're trying to do , make a better knife.
 
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