Frame Lock Folder: bronze washer won't lay flat?

KLJTech

KLJTech

Joined
Aug 26, 2005
Messages
1,180
This may sound like a silly question (nitpicky) but does it matter that the one of the washers one of my new knives does not lay flat /flush between the blade and the Titanium scale?

I was opening and closing one of my new knives (bought a few last week) last night while sitting at my workbench (under a 150 Watt Halogen lamp) and noticed that I could see light between one end of the washer and the scale. I doubt that I ever would have noticed this in normal household lighting. It appeared that you could slide a piece of paper between the washer and the Ti side.

I carefully removed the Torx screws and removed one of the sides so that I could lift out the blade, wipe down everything and then re-lube (I used TUF-GLIDE by Sentry Solutions) and replaced both washers and the blade then put the knife back together.

I tightened the pivot as tight as it would go then backed it off less than a 1/4 turn and now the knife blade moved smoothly and freely and there was no longer any gap. Needless to say I was pretty pleased with myself for fixing the problem but today I grabbed the knife before leaving the house and held it up to the light to make sure all as still fine and I'll be damned if the gap wasn't back again.

The folder costs more than a couple hundred dollars so I feel that everything should be lined up and fit near perfectly together BUT maybe I'm being too picky and this is common with folders. I grabbed my Spyderco Sage 2 and held it up to the light and the knife couldn't be more perfect....now I wish I'd never noticed the washers in the other folder.

Would any of you be bothered by this or am I expecting too much and just being too nitpicky? Can anyone think of a fix? I don't know if I tightened the pivot all the way and left it that way for for a day or so if it would remain flush once I loosened it a bit or not.

Thanks in advance for your feedback!
Enjoy your weekend!
 
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Let the knife teach you its intricacies. If there is no blade wobble at this time u are ok0for now as far as using the knife. Stay with the problem though if it bothers YOU but observe what u can while using the knife if you intend to DIY the problem. Your issue sounds weird and i think there is some type of tolerance "stackup" issue. Me i would send the kife back or call them and have a nice lil chat 1st maybe.
 
If I squeeze the Titanium scales together (in the middle of the knife) along the back of the scales I can make the washers lay flat but once I release it the washer is no longer making contact with both the blade and scale.

If this were a $50-75 knife it wouldn't bother me much but this knife is much closer to $400. I assume that it won't damage the knife over time but I also much assume, maybe incorrectly, that it's not as smooth as it would be if the washers were in fact flat on both sides of the blade while making contact with the Titanium scales. AAARRGHH! :o

I wish I'd never noticed it....all you need do is hold it up in front of you at eye level with a light source in front of you. There is no play in the blade at all, I don't know if this would get worse or better over time but shouldn't it be right out of the box or am I being too picky on a $400 folder? That's a good chunk of change (to me) to pay for a folder....I know for others its a drop in the bucket.

Thanks for your input...any and all feedback will be greatly appreciated!

-Kevin
 
I would talk to the one you bought it from and see what their take on it is. 400 is alot to pay for a folder and you should be happy. If it bothers you that much give the maker a chance to make it right. It doesn't matter what we think. If it's a big deal to you it's a big deal, you're the that paid the money. Talk to the seller/maker, they want you to be happy with their product.
 
i had a $250 folder where the blade was so uncentered that it scraped the liner. In your case the issue may affect its resale value so maybe that can be your argument to the knife co.
 
you *could* try new factory washers and while u have it apart u can check the scales for straightness with a machinists straight edge.
 
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May I ask what knife it is that has this problem? "Titanium scale" and "$400" make it sound like a Sebenza and I have never heard of such problems with them unless they were assembled incorrectly.
 
I tightened the pivot as tight as it would go then backed it off less than a 1/4 turn and now the knife blade moved smoothly and freely and there was no longer any gap. Needless to say I was pretty pleased with myself for fixing the problem but today I grabbed the knife before leaving the house and held it up to the light to make sure all as still fine and I'll be damned if the gap wasn't back again.
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A bent washer is not a problem. I mean, if it being bent bothers you, bend it flat :) , but the real and only issue is that the pivot screw is backing out. As you say, the knife is right when it is tight enough at the pivot that the washer is forced flat. Throw a little purple or blue locktite on the threads of the pivot screw, and the problem will go away.
 
Many monolocks of that price range such as sebenzas or SNGs have great warranties. I doubt the manufacturer will have a problem taking care of your knife.
 
If the knife still operated like designed and the lockup was solid I would use it for a while and see if the gap persisted. As the knife is used the constant mating of the washer and blade may resolve the problem.

If there is any doubt about the safety of the lockup I say send it back.

I bought a $400 folder from a popular knife maker thru one of their distributors only to find out that one of the washers was missing! I had to send it to the maker as they would not send parts out.
 
It sounds like either the back spacer is a shade too thick or the washers are a shade too thin, or both. It could also be that the scale is not totally flat.

This is something I personally would not be that happy about on a custom knife or high end production knife. I'd just contact the maker and see what they say about it. :)
 
kreole said:
A bent washer is not a problem. I mean, if it being bent bothers you, bend it flat :) , but the real and only issue is that the pivot screw is backing out. As you say, the knife is right when it is tight enough at the pivot that the washer is forced flat. Throw a little purple or blue locktite on the threads of the pivot screw, and the problem will go away.
Click to expand...

I'm almost certain now that the reason it appeared to fix the problem the night before was due to lube not having dried yet so it filled the gaps....the lube (TUF-GLIDE) then dries and the gaps are back. I did use Threadlocker Blue on the pivot screw and it was obvious that the screw had not backed out.
 
Haze said:
It sounds like either the back spacer is a shade too thick or the washers are a shade too thin, or both. It could also be that the scale is not totally flat.

This is something I personally would not be that happy about on a custom knife or high end production knife. I'd just contact the maker and see what they say about it. :)
Click to expand...


I too believe that the problem is either a standoff or the the stop pin is a hair too wide....could be that one of the scales is off just a tad (not 100% flat) but the washers are flat so its not the washers needing to be made flat. The knife was new purchased online so I'm certain that exchanging it would not be a problem.

I was mainly looking for feedback from the members of this forum to see if THEY would indeed exchange the knife if it were theirs or if it would be no big deal to them.

I don't want to mention any manufacturer or model since I'm not sure if I'm being too picky or not plus any company can allow one product out the door that isn't 100% perfect. To another customer this may have been perfect.

Had I not been playing around with my new knife on my extremely well lit workbench I may have not seen that there was a gap between the washer and the scales....another buyer may never have noticed this.

I'm pretty sure that they're not open today due to the holiday so I'll give it some thought until tomorrow. I'll most likely contact them and see about a replacement. This is the most expensive knife I'll buy this year so if possible I'd rather everything be has it should be.

Please feel free to let me know if I'm being to picky..... I'm going to feel like an ass telling them that there is a gap between one side of the washer and the scale so it would be nice to know others would do the same OR that it wouldn't bother you at all.

Thanks guys!
-Kevin
 
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i am not sure. But can i ask a question -if there is a gap then how come there is no blade play? Hopefully the knife gods will be in a good mood and send STR over to this thread. Over and out.
 
TheCarbideRat said:
i am not sure. But can i ask a question -if there is a gap then how come there is no blade play? Hopefully the knife gods will be in a good mood and send STR over to this thread. Over and out.
Click to expand...

The washer on one side (lockbar side) is flat and making contact with both the blade and the scale and on the other side the washer makes contact with both at the front of the knife but there is a gap facing the rear so I assume that there is enough contact to keep prevent blade play.
 
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KLJTech said:
The washer on one side (lockbar side) is flat and making contact with both the blade and the scale and on the other side the washer makes contact with both at the front of the knife but there is a gap facing the rear so I assume that there is enough contact to keep prevent blade play.
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ok NOW i can tell u have a distorted slab. Ship it.
 
TheCarbideRat said:
ok NOW i can tell u have a distorted slab. Ship it.
Click to expand...

I also think that it's the one slab since I can squeeze slabs together a bit along the back edge and then the gap at the pivot goes away. I don't know if that would ever correct itself with use or not....I'm assuming that the knife isn't working as smoothly as it would if both washers were making full contact.

Over the years I've only had a couple/few knives that needed to go back but I hate it not only for the inconvenience but it makes you feel like you're expecting perfection when you explain what you feel is wrong with knife.

Thanks for your input.
 
You are welcome. For 400 bux why shouldnt u? And tell them to provide a loaner for the mean time bcz u need to USE it -none of this 6 week hang time BS. Keep m sharp
 
Is the knife smooth? Does anything feel wrong when you open and close it? It might in fact be more smooth because thee is less contact with the blade and therefore less friction. If it were me and it didn't seem to effect function of the knife I would probably use it if that is what I bought it for and soon enough I would forget about it. If its a collector or your the type of person that let's something bug you then go ahead and at least call them to see what they say. On a $400 knife you should be happy and the company should be willing to make you happy. I've got a similar priced knife that wasn't perfect but I knew I was going to use it and I kept it because I didn't want to go without and wanted to use (and play :) with it.

If you think it will constantly bother you then get it taken care of because you have to live with it, not us.

Out of curiosity do they allow disassembly of their knives and do you feel comfortable taking it apart? You could pull it apart and see if the scale is flat by putting a straight edge on it. If it is flat and uses stand offs maybe try switching them around and maybe one will be more narrow and fix the problem. Not knowing the knife makes it hard to suggest a possible solution assuming you aren't opposed to tinkering with it yourself.
 
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