Glock v 1911 A1, rational opinions sought...

Marion David Poff

Marion David Poff

Joined
Oct 8, 1998
Messages
5,403
I know that this is one of the perrenial "Busse v Strider" type deals but if you don't mind trotting it out again....

I have shot a Glock in 9mm and a 1911A1. I preferred the 1911A1.

Let me ask this way.

Is there anything missing in a quality 1911A1?

What are the advantages of the Glock?
 
Glocks are light, and very simple, and requires less in training for trigger control. However, the long "safe action" trigger pull takes more to shoot accurately.

1911's take much more training to operate safely, but take more training in trigger control. However, the single action trigger takes less to shoot accurately

Glocks hold more rounds, 1911's a few rounds less. Glocks generally fit better in larger hands while 1911's in smaller hands.

They are both excellent guns and one should have both.
 
I love shooting my 1911s for bullseye, bowling pin shooting and action shooting

When it comes to personal protection give me a GLOCK; as easy and safe as a revolver. :)

A safety can get you in trouble in a tense situation if you forget to release it.
 
Yes, I think it's two different types of guns. I've found that Glocks seem to work best for women who have not shot anything (and hence have no preconceived ideas) or men that were brought up on revolvers. Glocks also work best where weight is at a premium and maintenance, like cleaning, cannot fit a schedule.

To operate in worst case conditions, a 1911 needs looser tolerances. Mine are more of the 'target, IPSC' variety. A bit tighter, more accurate and best shot when very clean. My Glock 23 was also well taken care of, but the local police department carries them, which exposes them to all kinds of bad weather.

If my butt was in a sling, and you handed me either firearm, I'd be well protected. It's just a different manual of arms.
 
Originally posted by RGRAY
I love shooting my 1911s for bullseye, bowling pin shooting and action shooting

When it comes to personal protection give me a GLOCK; as easy and safe as a revolver. :)

A safety can get you in trouble in a tense situation if you forget to release it.
Click to expand...

Excellent post :D
 
Thanks CUTIGER 3,

My wife and I were in a IPSC match.

She shot in front of me and forgot to release the safety on her cocked and locked 1911 before her first shot; so of course I had to laugh at her. :D

Then I got up and did the same thing. :o

I wouldn't want a cocked and locked 1911 in my nightstand draw if I needed it quickly in the middle of the night.

A 1911 can be made very accurate, but you give up reliability for accuracy.
 
The single stack mag on the 1911 results in a handle that is easier to point.

n2s
 
I own both a Kimber SS Full Size 1911, and several Glocks. If i were target shooting, my Kimber is more accurate, BUT, for self defense i would definitely prefer the Glock for several reasons.

First, as was already said, the Glock holds significantly more rounds, and i dont care what anyone says, more rounds is better no matter how you look at it. And its not one or 2 more, in .45 its 6 more (8 vs 14), a 9mm G17 holds 20 ROUNDS! with the +2 floorplate.

The Glock design is, IMO, inherrently more reliable than a 1911, 1911's have a rep for being picky about non FMJ ammo, Glocks eat up anything. Incidentally, i have a G17 that has at least 10,000 rounds through it, not ONE jam yet, not ONE. Wish i could say the same about the 1911's i have owned and shot.

Another great reason to choose the Glock is that is virtually rust proof. When FULLY disassembled (not just field stripped), i wash the frame and slide in the SINK, with warm water, dish soap and a toothbrush, it works perfectly and i have yet to see a speck of rust, try THAT with a 1911, yikes!

While both the 1911 and the Glock can be easily disassembled into its smallest parts, it takes less time with the Glock, and spare parts are DIRT cheap and easily replaced, not that youd ever really need to, the Glock is virtually indestructable. I have heard of G17s that have gone well over 100,000 rounds with no major parts failures, im not sure a 1911 could do that. Glock is one of the few guns i would buy used, they just dont wear out.

I guess the final reason is that a Glock is a bit cheaper than a quality 1911.

I keep a G17 near me at all times, yes, its JUST a 9mm, but its 20 ROUNDS of it, and the G17 is so easy to shoot accurately and quickly, i can put all 20 in the size of a fist at 21 feet in about 5 seconds.
 
A new shooter should consider a handgun with a manual safety.
The Glock has the highest rate of negligent discharge of any firearm ever used in Law Enforcement. These "AD's" usually happen when drawing from a holster or when re-holstering.

The .45 ACP Glock carries more rounds at the expense of being quite huge. Even the smaller Glocks are thick. If you are looking for a concealment gun, I would not recommend the Glock. There are many others that will suit you better.

In addition, after learning the fundamentals of pistolcraft, the progression in firearms that you choose will be much more informed.

I am a certified 1911 nut. I have over one hundred thousand rounds through the pattern. A "tuned" 1911 will be your favorite pistol over time, no doubt. The problem is that they do not always work 100% out of the box and for a casual shooter that can be a huge distraction.

Glocks generally run 100% out of the box (generally) and are more tolerant of abuse and low maintenence. They are ingenious guns.
By all accounts, the 9mm versions are the best.

In my opinion, the Glock needs a manual safety.

Failure to actuate a manual safety under stress with a 1911 is simply evidence of poor training, since a 1911 should be ALWAYS be fired with the shooting hand thumb riding on top of the safety lever when assuming the firing grip and during the presentation of the firearm. This also keeps the safety from being put "on-safe" accidentally during recoil.Any other way is grossly incorrect.
 
Having carried both on tactical teams I'd opt for the Glock. (Even easier now since the dept. no longer allows single action to be carried.)

Even after having been throated and polished my 1911 developed an extraction problem (replaced extractor a few times) that was a mystery to myself and my armorer buddies. I shot great with the gun for a long time, but sentimentality aside, it was time to retire that weapon.

When the crap hits the fan I want the combination of simplicity and firepower and that's what the Glock offers. More rounds than the 1911 and regardless of training, I've seen people freeze up under extreme stress and tension. I don't need the manual safety and to date the Glocks have proven to have a very good track record with the local and federal departments down here.

Draw, point, shoot, holster.

My two cents. Your mileage may vary. Etc etc.
 
Originally posted by Anthony Lombardo
A new shooter should consider a handgun with a manual safety.
The Glock has the highest rate of negligent discharge of any firearm ever used in Law Enforcement. These "AD's" usually happen when drawing from a holster or when re-holstering.

Click to expand...

Anthony,

Then why do most people say you should start with a revolver; if a safety is so important?

Also, isn't one of the first rules; don't put your finger inside the trigger guard unless you plan on firering it?

Well said, Blues. :)
 
I own five Glocks and a Charles Daly .45. I enjoy shooting my 1911 type .45 but it gets dirty faster and is less reliable than any of my Glocks. Glock are much easier to clean than 1911 .45's. My nightstand gun is a Glock 22 and my carry gun is a Glock 27.

If you collect guns, you should have at least one 1911 .45 in your collection. If you can only afford one handgun at this time, buy a Glock.

FYI: The Glock 36 is the same size as a Colt Officer's Model .45. The Glock 21 and 30 are thicker than a 1911 .45 because they take double-stack magazines.
 
I'd like to add, the reason there maybe so many more AD/ND with Glocks is because so many departments issue them, and not all cops are gun people.
 
I'm not an armorer or instructor. I have no credentials as a weapons expert at all. I was tought to shoot by a redneck boyfriend of my mother's who emphasized muzzle awareness. I'll always remember: "Never point at anything you don't want to shoot. Period!".

He also emphasized not putting your finger on the trigger until you're ready to shoot or actively shooting something. This prevents things like shooting yourself in the ass while drawing or holstering a pistol (or worse, in the hip).

You posted that:

"Failure to actuate a manual safety under stress with a 1911 is simply evidence of poor training, since a 1911 should be ALWAYS be fired with the shooting hand thumb riding on top of the safety lever when assuming the firing grip and during the presentation of the firearm. This also keeps the safety from being put "on-safe" accidentally during recoil.Any other way is grossly incorrect."

I appreciate the accuracy and speed of a well maintained SA cocked and locked 1911 in trained hands. But, with all the (sensible) stipulations listed in your post about training and proper presentation, what happens if your well trained strong arm is disabled/wounded? What if the thumb that's supposed to fall naturally on the safety is broken or heaven forbid, missing? What if you missed a tactical class or two? How well does this philosophy work for weak hand, under stress use?

I'll take my old G21 for defensive situations. I think especially for most folks who are responsible gunowners, but haven't the time or money to take tactical classes, yet still want to protect their families, a Glock represents a more sensible choice than a 1911 derivitive. That said, a model 19 or 17 makes more sense for for most as the 21 is kind of big for most (but so am I ).

jmx
 
jmx, also well said.

I have owned and liked the Glock 19 (with extended mag. 18 rds. and nite sights) since it first came out.

The only thing it did not feed were the bullets I made and forgot to crimp. :o

For size comparison:
 
Good points by all - I wish I got here sooner.

I can't add much to what has been said. I own both. I shoot both. I can hit much better with a 1911 - it points naturally for me. I have to work to get the Glock to hit, especially in multi-round rapid fire.

The 1911 takes a bit more work to master - it is not an everymans' gun. It can be finicky at times unless you use quality ammo and quality aftermarket mags. It likes to be clean and lubed.

The Glock is not as finicky. It works all the time.

That being said, give me a 1911 anyday. I like to keep my guns clean anyway.
 
Hey there MDP, how are you?

If it is your only line of defense, take whatever holds more bullets.
Never smaller than 9mm.

Glock’s don’t work well for me. That’s not true. They ALWAYS work. But it is one of my least favorite guns to shoot. They just feel wrong.

Look at it like this…

Can you go wrong with the Glock?
Almost never.

Can you go wrong with a 1911?
Yes.


All that being said, the 1911 will remain the greatest battle sidearm of all time.

If I could own only one…1911…



Mick
 
Amen Mr. Mick !!!!!!

If your strong hand thumb is out of action it is a simple task to wipe a 1911 safty off with the weak hand fore finger . Learn to shoot whatever gun you carry both weak and strong handed . It it not the gun that makes the shooter but rather the man who has practiced will become the better shooter . The best gun is the one you have with you when the crap hits the fan .


PRACTICE ABOVE ALL ELSE IS THE ANSWER
 
With all due respect, Jerry, you may not get a chance to do that. Or your weak hand/arm may be disabled.

One of the drills we go through during quarterly qualifications is how to load and rack a weapon when the weak hand or strong hand is out of commission.

Adding the issue of the safety to the equation just complicates it that much further.

I'll stick by what I said and say that in a combat situation simplicity rules. There are countless instances where individuals have, under stress, failed to properly arm their weapons, forget their location when trying to call it in on the air, or otherwise lost touch with their training.

Glocks and Colts are both fine weapons. But if I get into the sh&t storm, I want simplicity on my side.

(That said, I usually shot higher scores when my Colt was working properly. ;))
 
It is excellent discussions like this that remind why I love this place.

Mick- Well met.

Thank you all for your perspectives.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top