H.I.Tomahawk?

Yvsa

Yvsa

Joined
May 18, 1999
Messages
15,395
:
Okay, alright already. I ain't gonna promise I will start on this real soon, but I need some input. I know we did it before, but we have a lot of new people and their input is desired as well.
What style would everyone like to see first?
If there are lurkers who would rather not post you're more than welcome to e-mail me and I will keep track of those choices.

1- The one I got for my little brother Rusty was on the good graces of my cuz and a good _trade_ was made.
This 'Hawk is nothing but pure weapon and although _some_ chopping could be done with it, it isn't a good chopper. It is a straight spike style.
However a larger size and shape could be designed that would make a good chopper.

2- A "pipe" style. I would prefer this style myself, BUT I don't know what US Custom's would allow in the country and if this one would/could come classified as "drug paraphenalia" it may cause trouble for HI if it is "Smokeable" and We Don't Want That.
If the head was done properly by the kamis we could carve our own handles from a piece of Ash Wood and Ash grows almost all over from what I understand. It would be easier for some guys than others. Ash has a "pith" which allows it to be burned out using a hot coathanger. It's not real easy, but I have made several from Ash and I have some already hollowed out so it's no problem for me personally.
Another option with today's good epoxies is to make a saw cut about 1/8" deep & wide and glue 2 pieces together and carve the handle from it. Any good hardwood would do.
The 'Hawk head if not already drilled out with the small hole for smokeing could be drilled by us.

3- A polled 'Hawk. This would be the easiest one to design and would no doubt be the most useful as it will perform many tasks.
This style of "Hawk was the least used by the ndn people.
However I could design the poll to where it could be drilled out with a large drill, may have to have a shop do it, and then a small drill to make it into a "pipe" style for those who would like a Pipe 'Hawk.

Okay, with these descriptions I would also like some more info as to weight.
So lets do them like this.

1-A = Heavy = 4" 4 1/2" cutting edge.

1-B = Medium = 3" 3 1/2" " edge

1-C = Light = 2" 2 1/2" " "

2-A = Heavy and so on. And the longer the cutting edge the longer the head of the 'Hawk within reason. They will be proportionate. The "Heavy" ones would be real working tools and the lighter they go the more "Weapon" they become. Some of the Old very Large 'Hawks had very thin blades and were much lighter making them better weapons than tools and I have to admit of having some of the mindset of the kamis in thinking bigger and heavier is better for a tool. However I was proven wrong with the YCS.
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Now for myself I don't have a need for one of these so the 1st one would "Possibly" be up for grabs.
And a "Contest" might be fun to have for it although I haven't decided yet, depends on the style.
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So let me know what your preferences are and I will see what I can do in my spare time.


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>>>>---¥vsa---->®

Each person's work is always a portrait of himself.

---- Samuel Butler.

Khukuri FAQ
Himalayan Imports Website
 
Yvsa, pictures or sketches would be cool for us 'Hawk neophites. The only one that sticks in my memory is the type used in the movie Patriot.
 
There's something about a piece of steel that's been hand forged.

I got mine, ( and it's very special ) so I'll hang back and let others in on the decisions, and let them have dibs on the first few hawks, at least to start with. When one wants me to give it a home, I'll know the symptoms ( somewhere between the flu and heroin withdrawal ).
 
OK, I'll vote for the "lighter, weapon" Hawk being produced first, as I really don't have a practical need for a "working Hawk" - but that's just me.
From your above posting this seems to be the one that could be produced with the least amount of problems. The "pipe Hawk" could come later when answers become available to your "potential problems/questions".
I would probably purchase one of each (weapon & pipe).

Happy Holidays to all, and best wishes for the coming year.
 
I like the look of the "pipe hawk" but have no desire to smoke from it. My thought is to replicate the look but leave the "pipe bowl" solid so it can be used as a hammer. This would have utility around the camp.

sing
AKTI #A000356
 
After browsing the rmjforge website, I think I would want 2-B.

I really like the looks of the pipe style.

This one in particular: It's called the English Smoothbowl

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[This message has been edited by rdnzl (edited 12-25-2000).]
 
I agree with rdnzl, I really like the pipe style. I would also like to see a large blade. Whatever you guys come up with I will buy. Happy Holidays!
Matthew

 
I don't have any real preference for any specific 'hawk style. I would prefer though the end result to be lighter and more weapon oriented. This 'hawk will be kept as a weapon only, I have my AK to work with.
 
I'm fairly sure it's non-traditional, but here's a small modification I used when I made myself a 'hawk recently.

For the handle, I used a nice piece of apple branch.On the butt end of the handle there's a ball pommel approx 2.25" diameter. I've found this gives a very nice balance, as well as a positive stop to prevent the handle slipping out of the hand (eg on a wet day, when wearing gloves &c) IMHO it also looks pretty darned cute...

For the head I used a 2" strip of 1/8" mild steel plate wrapped round a mandrel, forgewelded and waisted, with a cutting edge of file steel forgewelded in sandwich-fashion. Again, not the traditional way of making them (should drift the eye out after welding in the blade), but it hasn't bust yet!
 
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Howard thanks for the Website!
They do have some very beautiful 'Hawks.

I am thinking of a plainer version
that each person can put their own
"medicine" on if so desired. However a silver mounted 'Hawk with a bone and horn inlay might be very interesting indeed.

The H.I.'Hawk will hopefully have the reversed tapered hole in the head like many of the originals have.
I am going to try to fit a hickory handle from Crazycrow.com that I have (I think I still have it.) as this would make a good source for handles that break from throwing the 'Hawks.
And if you throw a 'Hawk it isn't "If" the handle will break, But "When."
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This method is the absolute best way to hold the head in place imo and what Howard means about the leather wrap keeping the head from sliding down.

Crazycrow.com is a good source for brass tacks with the domed heads as well as horse hair and tin dangles, the small ones, and beads such as the very old "trade beads."
Some of their trade beads are 200 or more years old and not the imitations that some places have. That way each and every person's 'Hawk would be authentically dressed up if they should choose to do so. Those old trade beads can be mighty expensive though, I know.
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Y'all should see my bear claw necklace.
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It would be interesting to see what the kamis would come up with for their own decorations on the H.I.'Hawk, but since from what I understand the people in that part of the world seldom decorated their khukuri's except for the Sword of Shiva and the inlay that's sometimes done.
And who knows perhaps at one time that had a religious significance and gave "power" to the khukuri.

I just discovered yesterday that WebTV now has what they call an
"e-scanner."
It will take only 4"x6" size pix or drawings, but that is big enough as I can send them to photo point and enlarge and crop them there I understand.
I am going to order one tomorrow so perhaps if I can figure it and photo point out I will then be able to post some drawings and such.
And that will save a lot of time between taking the pic or doing the drawing and sending it off.
Uncle Bill and others have been very gracious in posting my pix and drawings and I am very grateful for all their help!!!

Keep the comments an suggestions coming.
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------------------
>>>>---¥vsa---->®

Each person's work is always a portrait of himself.

---- Samuel Butler.

Khukuri FAQ
Himalayan Imports Website
 
:
Tom that ball on the end is much more traditional than you might think. Although I haven't seen a 'Hawk made that way it doesn't mean that some weren't.
The old warclubs of the Northeast were sometimes pretty heavy and more often than not had a ball or some other form of detent at the bottom of the handle.
I would love to have one of those very old style Iroquois Ball head curly maple warclubs. I am always in awe at how the Iroquois people's carved and smoothed those before the introduction of steel.


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>>>>---¥vsa---->®

Each person's work is always a portrait of himself.

---- Samuel Butler.

Khukuri FAQ
Himalayan Imports Website
 
Yvsa,

I'd go with a "weapon type" hawk. I like Rusty's style hawk with a back spike, but I'd also go with a pipe look hawk. The one in the movie "The Patriot"looks o.k. to me. I don't know if it is authentic looking, but it looked good on the big screen.

In the movie "The Last Mohican", Inoticed that the handles on the hawks were alot longer than the one on "The Patriot". Any info on these variations?

Also, the war club looks cool, sort reminds me of a rifle stock with some additions. Any info on these would be appreciated.
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WHenever these H.I. Hawks come out, I'm definately in!!!!
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My vote would be for a medium multi-use hawk. I have seen some hawks called "Ft. Meigs" style (if my memory is correct) that are very light, but used as a tool or weapon. Think of it as a primitive Cold Steel Vietnam hawk.

I have a very plain 4.5" blade, 13-14" hickory handled hawk that I used to use for everything, including throwing. You have to be a pretty big guy to use something this big as a weapon.

I'm very interested to see what you come up with!
 
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Keep the suggestions and comments coming guys. I am gonna get this done pretty quickly, for me that is.
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Seriously, although I still have projects in the works this is something that shouldn't take that long and the more input I have the better the 1st one will turn out for everyone.



------------------
>>>>---¥vsa---->®

Each person's work is always a portrait of himself.

---- Samuel Butler.

Khukuri FAQ
Himalayan Imports Website
 
I think it's a good idea.

I also become extremely upset when a symbol of US history on a level with the Winchester rifle, light cavalry saber, or the American flag...

People who would equate such eloquent heritage with drug paraphenalia should have their assumptions questioned by Torquemada. Repeatedly.
 
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