H1 Steel not as rust proof as I was told.

EntrancedVermin

EntrancedVermin

Joined
Jul 26, 2016
Messages
274
Hello,
I have been curious about H1 steel for a long time. I did not find the answers I was looking for online about the steel. A lot of people were saying it was rust proof but I wanted to find out for myself. So about 7 months ago I put an H1 ladybug in a jar with some 1084 high carbon steel to see if it would rust. Filled up the jar about half way full with a saltwater solution and for the first few months It was about halfway in the water and half way out but eventually it fell over. The first few pictures from when it was when it was in the jar for about 7 months. 20181027_012959.jpg 20181027_013007.jpg 20181027_024319.jpg 20181027_024313.jpg

This picture is just simply rinsing it with soap and water.
20181027_024430.jpg 20181027_024438.jpg


And lastly is me using soap and water to rubbing it off. I found it on one side the rust is actually stuck onto the steel so I cannot confirm if the steel actually rusted or if the steel is only holding the rust.20181027_025008.jpg

So if anyone has any questions or requests id be happy to answer/fulfill them.
 
NoFair said:
That test doesn't show H1 rusting it just shows rust deposits from the other steel on the H1...
Click to expand...

This is what I'm thinking as well. I might even go as far to suggest the salt water solution, which would be an electrolyte solution, could be causing some electrochemical bonding from the carbon steel in there. We see a lot of that in the bicycling world with different electric potential between carbon fiber and aluminum, aluminum being fairly corrosion resistant but butted up to CF and you'll get a fair amount of corrosion deposits which can cause seatposts to stick, rivnuts to "wear", and some other funky things in bearing races. Especially during times of temperature changes as that often allows for water to catalyze further reaction, though you already have the salt water to create a media to work through.

Looks like there's a bit of rust even on the handle. I think you have a case of staining mostly. Honestly, 7 months in salt water and no pitting... that's a winner for corrosion resistance even if you find out it had a little rust on there from the H1.

It's been a while since I've taken electrochem classes and researched this phenomena so my terminology is a bit rusty and I wouldn't trust this to 100% but I'm reasonably sure of the overall concept, just not exact details. Take that for what you will from a "bad scientist" and fuzzy-ish statments.
 
P.S. Cool test. I love to see people testing "common knowledge" and questioning what we're told to check validity of statements (like mine with it's fuzzy confidence in concepts). :thumbsup:
 
microbe said:
And this test is an example of which use case exactly?
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Dropped it off the dock and found it the following spring, obviously. Or dropped it in the bottom of the boat, which has a little water in it, and forgot about it.

Or, investigating alternate storage conditions. Almost like trying to pickle a knife, I think making fermented pepper mash works just like this.
 
Just to clarify this "test" was just for fun it has no real world application. Ive only even seen one other salt series have rust before from a guy that worked on a fishing boat. That's were the idea of the salt water solution came from.

This is most likely rust deposits like i speculated and others have pointed out. I plan on seeing if i can get the rust off and see how hard it is to get off.

Thanks you for all the comments.
 
Last edited:
Updated: with out using any type of abrasive material i managed to get more of the rust off. I rubbed it hard with a paper towel and denatured alcohol. Then I took my fingernail and try to rub off the much as I could at this point it all feels flush and smooth even though they're still a layer of rust on top of it.20181027_073555.jpg
20181027_073549.jpg

Edit: You gotta love the rust stained handles though, remembers me of the hap40 series
 
EntrancedVermin said:
Just to clarify this "test" was just for fun it has no real world application. Ive only even seen one other salt serous have rust before from a guy that worked on a fishing boat. That's were the idea of the salt water solution came from.

This is most likely rust deposits like i speculated and others have pointed out. I plan on seeing if i can get the rust off and see how hard it is to get off.

Thanks you for all the comments.
Click to expand...

In theory, because the steel can't rust but that doesn't mean it will resist acid entirely (different chem reactions) but should be affectedly much more more slowly, using some vinegar or another acid should take the rust off. We use some much stronger stuff to take corrosion off of stainless steel in the food industry. I don't know that we've gone fully to muriatic acid/HCL but we have used some pretty harsh stuff if it's really resistant. Vinegar is a pretty weak acid. Coke could work pretty well too as the carbonic acid content is pretty strong. You could get muriatic acid and dilute it down but that's not something you want hanging around if you don't really have a need for it elsewhere but it's pretty affordable at home depot and the like.
 
bikerector said:
Dropped it off the dock and found it the following spring, obviously. Or dropped it in the bottom of the boat, which has a little water in it, and forgot about it.

Or, investigating alternate storage conditions. Almost like trying to pickle a knife, I think making fermented pepper mash works just like this.
Click to expand...

Fingers crossed if I ever find a knife in the dock, it's H1.
 
microbe said:
Fingers crossed if I ever find a knife in the dock, it's H1.
Click to expand...

I'm really curious to see how the LC200N holds up for some of the new Salt series knives. That salt native has my name on it when it comes out. I really hate the yellow scales of the salt series though and black is unexciting but acceptable. Wish they would do more orange like the recent spyderhawk release (nice knife). The yellow is the reason I don't have a hawkbill H1 dragonfly yet... suppose I should just get more familiar with RIT die.
 
So the conclusion is that while there is rust on the blade, the blade itself did not rust. Rust as noun versus rust as verb. Cool test!

I'll bet a green Scotchbrite kitchen scrubbie will take the rust deposits off.

Zieg
 
Somewhere on Spyderco Forums some guy did a saltwater test where he left a Spyderco Salt in the ocean for like 3-5 years (?). It had some similarities to this. Sal commented something like "it isn't rust" and "we would like to look at it".

Besides, if thats the worse that happens to H1 after that long of a period, I have no fear.
 
There's a custom True Saber N2 in W2 with hamon, tapered tang and CF scales somewhere in the dunes or shores of OC or Assateague Island. Keep your eyes peeled for a clump of rust in the shape of a plantain.
 
Oh boy.:eek:

Rusty water causes H1 to rust.
Or it caused some weird reaction and it plated on.

I have a beater PacSalt that gets dunked in
Pacific 3 times a week when I am Surf Fishing.
Never rinsed off.
Zero corrosion.

gs7glgF.jpg



EntrancedVermin said:
This is most likely rust deposits like i speculated and others have pointed out. I plan on seeing if i can get the rust off and see how hard it is to get off.
.
Click to expand...

Soak it in White Vinegar... Rust will go away.
 
The fact the the showside has 0 rust what so ever is a clear sign that the other 'rust' isn't rust from the H1 but from the 1085.
 
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