Heat Treatment - Crystal Weaving Foundation

[Jens Schuetz]

Then to another depth and then to another, almost like weaving?
:-o

 

[BluntCut MetalWorks]

Cool advanced thoughts :thumbup:

Maybe in the future, it's possible to weave together layers of hyper strength material to yield composite almost as strong, yet tough enough for edge tools. In today world, we've graphene single layer coolness but stacked together yield graphite <= well, not tough enough for edge tools but at awe everytime I watch giant graphite inductor melting ingot. Pencil me in

CWF HT is through hardening like conventional (depends on composition). Conceptual CWF HT is at a single grain level. So hopefully someone can come up with enhancement, maybe with a hybrid cova-tallic bond (per see) to stitch together layer w/i a single grain (and might as well inter-grain).

almost like a case hardening process where you change the properties of the surface of the steel to a certain depth?

Then to another depth and then to another, almost like weaving?
:-o

 

[Ken H>]

Loung - I'm still following along with interest your CWF HT results........ just hoping someday to actually see the process so I can attempt to achieve similar results..... following with hope {g}

Half way thru "Catching Shrimp with bare hands" - good book, your family, and the rest of South Vietnam folks sure suffered a lot.... and it gets worse after the communists take over. Glad ya'll make it to USA.

Ken h>

Ken H>

 

[BluntCut MetalWorks]

Thanks, Ken.

I recovered about 50-60% of my voice and due to my work schedule => CWF videos slipped to Aug 13th at the earliest. Tentatively later today, I will send you a for-your-eyes-only email.

==Luong

Loung - I'm still following along with interest your CWF HT results........ just hoping someday to actually see the process so I can attempt to achieve similar results..... following with hope {g}

Half way thru "Catching Shrimp with bare hands" - good book, your family, and the rest of South Vietnam folks sure suffered a lot.... and it gets worse after the communists take over. Glad ya'll make it to USA.

Ken h>

Ken H>

 

[Ken H>]

Thanks Luong - I'll be looking forward to email...... and it WILL stay just between us.

Ken H>

 

[Natlek]

You claimed what you are doing is science. It isn't. Sorry. That's not semantics.

Your methods and results aren't scientific.

And discussing the validity of your method and results certainly are fair game.

Or did you just expect us to just blindly accept what you claim to be true (and I'm not at all sure what that even is..)

This is a sophisticated audience of experienced knife users, many professional materials scientists and metallurgists, and even more professional knife makers.

You cant expect people to just accept your "scientific" claims.

If I were in his place /bluntcut/ I would never share my knowledge with someone like you ...........never .

Just for you ................http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technolo...ying-plastic-that-could-change-the-world.html

hairdresser https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maurice_Ward

PS . bluntcut , I apologize for the off topic :thumbup:

 

[Ken H>]

That Starlite stuff is amazing!!!!! To bad the inventor kept it secret and lost to the world! A time for sharing for sure.... All because he wanted to maintain 51% of rights - I'm sure that prevented any serious company from working with it.

Ken H>

 

[BluntCut MetalWorks]

Umm, if saving people from burning was Starlite's goal/inspiration -> sad state of current being. Walking around with 1+Billion$ worth of starlite sample in my pocket would make my other private parts nervous

LOL - I've idea how Starlite might works and how severity of its limitation. Heat shields normal/perpendicular heat vector. OK, I am done OT myself.

 

[BluntCut MetalWorks]

The goal is to build a strong & tough solid using identical shape small building unit. Between units & group of units - interconnection, gap and vacancies determine strength & toughness of the result solid.

I use Combinatorial Optimization Graph to distilled 2 optimization goals:
* Maximize interconnectivity between units
* Minimize solid volume & radius

Conceptual to build highly interconnected crystal via 2 steps process:
* Create a outter structure frame by weave a hatch or spiral frame and formed tight pack inner/pocket/trap volume
* Convert inner/trapped volume to final crystal form & lattice

CWF HT - Applied to Steel Heat Treatment - FCC/Aust & BCT/Mart crystal lattice.
* shallow hardening - fast cool to avoid Pearlite Nose, then begin step1
* obj = work piece/blade
* please read http://www.reluctantgourmet.com/smoke-point/ Points: smoke ~400-480F, flash ~600F; fire ~700F.
* fill hot oil bath 2/3 full - leave room for oil thermal expansion in volume

s1: quench obj to 450-465F oil bath, slice around for 10 seconds, then stir around for 1 minutes
* do this for 1 or more objs
* Suspend/hanging this obj in this bath

Explanation: build the outter structure by minimize fcc phase change to bct driving/pushing force and at the same time induce pulling force, hence change of lattice orientation

s2: Cover the oil bath with a lid or aluminum foil.
* Target for uniform 1F/minute drop in temperature.

s3: 1 hr later - remove lid/cover.

s4: When oil temperature falls below 200-180F (take around 2-3 hrs depend on oil volume), air cool the blade to near room temp (~70-90F)
* ok, to leave obj overnight or a year

s5: Wash/clean blade. Straightening if needed and easy because the blade is still highly ductile(very high RA%) at this point
* ok, to leave obj overnight or a year

s6: Cryo (subzero should be ok for many steels) for 3-4 minutes, take out, wash
* ok, to leave obj overnight or a year

Explanation: Via thermal contraction (reduce atomic radius) to nucleate/calving strain/dislocated points, setting up for HCP precip. BCT outter structure will contract less than trapped/inner FCC pockets.

s7: Soak obj in 275F oil for 5 minutes. Take out & wash.

Explanation: hcp precip + Via thermal expansion (increase atomic radius) - spatial now allows retained-austenite conversion to martensite

CWF HT is done. Obj rc should be at peak hrc for maximum wear and very good toughness.

Temper ONLY when warranted by intended usage requires more ductility.

[video=youtube_share;qSn_m92DTpk]http://youtu.be/qSn_m92DTpk[/video]

 

[Mecha]

I had a feeling it would be a process related to martempering or austempering. A stable HCP crystal structure in steel is quite the thought! Great stuff, Bluntcut!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hexaferrum

 

[BluntCut MetalWorks]

Thanks.

Martempering is sort of given but cwf ht temperature is descending rather steady at/near Ms. I see Ms as a region rather than portrait/depicted as a line, so martempering could end up with some austempering... and vice versa.

I had a feeling it would be a process related to martempering or austempering. A stable HCP crystal structure in steel is quite the thought! Great stuff, Bluntcut!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hexaferrum

 

[Mecha]

Thanks.

Martempering is sort of given but cwf ht temperature is descending rather steady at/near Ms. I see Ms as a region rather than portrait/depicted as a line, so martempering could end up with some austempering... and vice versa.

Yes, I sort of lumped them together as "quenching into a hot media" heat-treatment! :]

 

[Tenebr0s]

What austenitizing temperatures are you using for the steel, prior to quenching in the hot oil?

 

[Chris "Anagarika"]

Luong,

Thank you. Haven't finished watching, but you sounded much different from your earlier videos .

 

[BluntCut MetalWorks]

Use whichever appropriate Aust temp per specific steel as if doing conventional ht. Except with good CWF HT temperature control (1F/minute cooling), high alloy steels should aust about 50F higher than maximum mfg recommended aust temp.

e.g. aust temp (recommended but not necessary temp I use)

Low Cr high carbon steels (108x, 109x, 52100, w2, etc..): 1450 - 1475F
* need to avoid pearlite nose with interrupt quench with fast quenchant to drop blade temp before 1000F before quench in hot oil.

Aeb-l & similar: 1950-1975F

Mid & High Cr steels: 50F above mfg maximum recommended aust temp

Mid& High Cr with Nitrogen added: mfg recommended aust temp range
​

What austenitizing temperatures are you using for the steel, prior to quenching in the hot oil?

With helped of my voice consultant (a cold), hopefully I will be pick to play the main dude in Conan The Dorger - granny award wimmer.

Luong,

Thank you. Haven't finished watching, but you sounded much different from your earlier videos .

 

[samuraistuart]

This is some serious "out side of the box" thinking. Very interesting stuff. Thank you so much for sharing your process. I was very surprised to hear that the steel is still "soft", even after beating the PN, especially after cryo. Understand that to be quite a bit of retained austenite (because it was held above Ms and then slowly dropped from ~475 to ambient). Surprised that even after the cryo quench, RA still there? Even more surprising to me, that the RA then gets converted to martensite after a temper at such a low temp (275F). Never would have suspected any of that, but you're way more intelligent than I am!

 

[BluntCut MetalWorks]

Thanks, Stuart!

Sorry, I am strongly disagreed with your last sentence. Take one to know one, colleague we are :thumbup:

Just want to avoid confusion about soak at 275F - energy at this temp + dislocation is mostly (99+%) below activation for phase change of martensite to something else. So I avoided use 'Tempering'. IME 315-330F temp range definite showed clear sign of tempering (mostly mart to cementite precip). Near 250F where I found thermal expansion (increase atomic radius) clearly taken place, so workable soak temp range about 240F-300F. I used a convection toaster oven (with at least 20 minutes preheat to stabilize temp), so 275F +- 25F flux worked fine thus far.

This is some serious "out side of the box" thinking. Very interesting stuff. Thank you so much for sharing your process. I was very surprised to hear that the steel is still "soft", even after beating the PN, especially after cryo. Understand that to be quite a bit of retained austenite (because it was held above Ms and then slowly dropped from ~475 to ambient). Surprised that even after the cryo quench, RA still there? Even more surprising to me, that the RA then gets converted to martensite after a temper at such a low temp (275F). Never would have suspected any of that, but you're way more intelligent than I am!

 

[Chris "Anagarika"]

Luong,

Finished watching. The concept is so cool and shows your understanding of how it works.


PS: I had to look up 'Dorger' but can't help laughing granny award

 

[me2]

I have heard of similarly treated blades (marquenched, but air cooled from 450 and without austempering potential) not only surviving a drop point first into concrete right out of the quench, but actually sticking into the floor and standing upright. This was also before any tempering.

 

[BluntCut MetalWorks]

CWF HT is neither Marquench nor AustTempering. In the video, I explained CWF concept and how it applied to HT.