Here comes the Thunder!

[Lorien]

ah, now we're getting somewhere interesting!

I am very grateful in particular for Matt to chime in on this thread. Any information regarding the technology behind composites is greatly appreciated and Mr. Diskin, I understand, is quite the mad genius.

I am pleased to come to the understanding that this material will not dissolve in water; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrophile

Thanks guys, I've been pretty busy lately and this thread has helped pull me back in. Frankly, I'm slightly depressed by the fact that this will be yet another year away from actually meeting many of you again and for the first time at Blade. Anyway, good to be here thanks for having me!

 

[J. Oeser]

I guess if you like the color of natural canvas than you would find this material appealing, however I wouldn't be surprised that some don't like this color on a knife handle.

There are quite a few people that like the color of natural canvas and some that don't. I guess it's just different strokes for different folks.

Most of the time with my knives people will just let me put a color scheme together with some minor guidelines like color or material etc. The other day I had someone specifically request that I NOT use LSCF, anything else was fine. Go figure.

Who the heck is Jared!? Thanks for the kind words, Kevin:thumbup:

Hey now...

It is a phenolic based laminate, made with both heat and pressure. It doesn't "fuzz" at all. It is made for outdoor applications.

It's good to get more info on the material.

I used it initially because I was curious and I am admittedly a fan of burlap which this resembles quite a bit as well as a fan of LSCF. This was kind of a cool combination of both. After using it, I like it and it's another option in my arsenal.

 

[jonnymac44]

There are quite a few people that like the color of natural canvas and some that don't. I guess it's just different strokes for different folks.

Most of the time with my knives people will just let me put a color scheme together with some minor guidelines like color or material etc. The other day I had someone specifically request that I NOT use LSCF, anything else was fine. Go figure.




Hey now...



It's good to get more info on the material.

I used it initially because I was curious and I am admittedly a fan of burlap which this resembles quite a bit as well as a fan of LSCF. This was kind of a cool combination of both. After using it, I like it and it's another option in my arsenal.

Just messin' buddy!

 

[RyanW]

I will chyme in here, I was able to use some of this material over a year ago. It is on my personal backpacking knife and gets used hard and often. I like the look and feel of it.

I don't know why Sanchez is jumping on Ben, he is not trying to get rich by hyping a new material. If you don't like the look don't put it on your knives or don't buy knives made with it. Luckily everyone likes different things, what a boring world it would be if we all carried the same knife with the same handles.

Blue, thanks for the compliment on my knife.

 

[Kohai999]

I made the mistake of buying some black and blue 2 x 2 carbon fiber/kevlar laminate from an untested source a couple years ago and the blue kevlar fuzzed up when shaping just like you're talking about. What a waste of $150 that was, but lesson was learned! At least it makes a pretty backdrop for taking photos of knives now

If it was from us, and you feel that it was not what you hoped it would be, stop by the booth for a refund or exchange....nobody wants to get ripped off!

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson

 

[stew]

I'm unsure about it. I love the look of lightning strike CF but the constrast between the wire and CF is quite strong but with this the wire and fabric the colour difference is quite subtle. It makes it look a bit like inclusions in the material to me. I do wonder if it is something I had in hand that I would appreciate it more than looking at pictures.

 

[jonnymac44]

If it was from us, and you feel that it was not what you hoped it would be, stop by the booth for a refund or exchange....nobody wants to get ripped off!

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson

Hey STeven, no not a all!! I would have talked to Matt privately if that was the case. Matt's always supplied me with amazing stuff and has been one of the best suppliers to work with ever! We're all good:thumbup:

If I recall the place I got the lousy stuff was from a company that catered to the custom car market, I think they were marketing the stuff more towards things like custom door panels and such where it would be cut to shape but not ground down at all.

 

[Kohai999]

I will chyme in here, I was able to use some of this material over a year ago. It is on my personal backpacking knife and gets used hard and often. I like the look and feel of it.

I don't know why Sanchez is jumping on Ben, he is not trying to get rich by hyping a new material. If you don't like the look don't put it on your knives or don't buy knives made with it. Luckily everyone likes different things, what a boring world it would be if we all carried the same knife with the same handles.

I'll see if I can field this one without ruffling too many feathers. Saw the post last night, but was too out of it to write intelligently.

If the rules of knives(things like blade-to-handle ratio on folders, symmetry in daggers, unique, superior design) are to be thrown out with the bathwater(they have been, I've seen it firsthand), it would seem that the old mode of business should go with it.

This is the rule where everyone is entitled to your trade secrets, and if you need a template for a knife, just ask the person who originated the design. The concept that each unique amd self-sufficient person is somehow ENTITLED to eat your lunch or attempt to do so in the knife industry should have died years ago, but instead at the extreme we have Chinese factories banging out straight copies of John Young knives complete with signatures for $100.00....to say that this is criminal is unnecessary...and some of the participants on BladeForums justifiy and celebrate their counterfiet knives.

It isn't that Ben is selling the material Ryan....it IS that it seems 1/2 the posts in this thread, and certainly what is going on in people's minds....an inevitable and evident and unnecessary comparision to LSCF....which Matt may not have created, but is the #1 with a bullet manufacturer of the material...he takes pride in offering a unique and well crafted material to the public, something that is desired and has someone knowing what he is manufacturing and standing behind it.

So, if someone arbitrarily decides to come up with a different but similar material, by the new rules, Matt would have every expectation to demand an "IP showdown" where the JCL explains basic elements of his material to the satisfaction of those interested parties.

Basically, fair is fair in an new mode of business.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson

 

[chuxwan]

I'd like to see this stuff in person. From the photos, it just reminds me of a basket.

 

[BenR.T.]

.....So, if someone arbitrarily decides to come up with a different but similar material, by the new rules, Matt would have every expectation to demand an "IP showdown" where the JCL explains basic elements of his material to the satisfaction of those interested parties.

Basically, fair is fair in an new mode of business.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson

Just so there is no confusion STeven, this stuff has been around way before LSCF was a twinkle in Matt's eye.
Matt and I talked and were all good. If he feels the need to defend himself or product he is welcome to do so. To imply that I stole Matt's idea is simply not true.

The fact that other people compare it to his material isn't a "rip off", but I think more of on obvious comparison.

And to compare me to a to Chinese company selling forgeries, is childish at best.

Best regards

 

[Kohai999]

Just so there is no confusion STeven, this stuff has been around way before LSCF was a twinkle in Matt's eye.
Matt and I talked and were all good. If he feels the need to defend himself or product he is welcome to do so. To imply that I stole Matt's idea is simply not true.

I don't think that there is an implication that the material is somehow new....the promotion of the material is new.

Bakelite has been around for over 100 years, but there are few it any people offering it, because it is fairly obscure and rare as a handle material. Karl Anderson is the ONLY maker that I have seen with a substantial amount of it, and he doesn't really sell it....but wouldn't it chap the ass if someone had 1,000 pounds of it sitting somewhere and just marched into the knife market with it?

The fact that other people compare it to his material isn't a "rip off", but I think more of on obvious comparison.

And to compare me to a to Chinese company selling forgeries, is childish at best.

Best regards

It is an unecessary comparison....let the material stand on it's own merits without bringing a comparison into the mix.

I made an example with the Chinese knockoffs....it isn't the same thing....namecalling is not necessary. The post above was a direct resonse to Ryan W., not intended as an insult towards you and what you are doing.

Can you not see that?

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson

 

[BenR.T.]

Steven, I am not trying to start a flame war here, quite the opposite. I totally get it if you don't like the material. I am not claiming it is the greatest handle material ever, or even the best looking.
I am simply sharing a product I discovered, with everyone else, they can take it or leave it. I meant no disrespect to Matt or anyone else by doing so.

So to be clear, you DON'T want a knockoff John Young with TSK scales for Christmas? :foot:

 

[Kohai999]

Steven, I am not trying to start a flame war here, quite the opposite. I totally get it if you don't like the material. I am not claiming it is the greatest handle material ever, or even the best looking.
I am simply sharing a product I discovered, with everyone else, they can take it or leave it. I meant no disrespect to Matt or anyone else by doing so.

So to be clear, you DON'T want a knockoff John Young with TSK scales for Christmas? :foot:

Ben, I get what you are doing, and have no personal problem with it. Good luck!

I'll pass on the John Young knockoff, but just might have a B.R. Tendick knife in my collection someday.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson

 

[RyanW]

I don't think that there is an implication that the material is somehow new....the promotion of the material is new.

Bakelite has been around for over 100 years, but there are few it any people offering it, because it is fairly obscure and rare as a handle material. Karl Anderson is the ONLY maker that I have seen with a substantial amount of it, and he doesn't really sell it....but wouldn't it chap the ass if someone had 1,000 pounds of it sitting somewhere and just marched into the knife market with it?



It is an unecessary comparison....let the material stand on it's own merits without bringing a comparison into the mix.

I made an example with the Chinese knockoffs....it isn't the same thing....namecalling is not necessary. The post above was a direct resonse to Ryan W., not intended as an insult towards you and what you are doing.

Can you not see that?

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson

OK Now my ass is in Chaps! I have a really hard time understanding points you are trying to make (my problem I am sure). Just to clarify, Are you implying that I am "Knocking something off"?

 

[The Amazing Virginian]

OK Now my ass is in Chaps! I have a really hard time understanding points you are trying to make (my problem I am sure). Just to clarify, Are you implying that I am "Knocking something off"?

I did not read that Steven was saying anything like that at all. He wasn't implying anything about you.

Step back and take another read.

I think he was just trying to respond to your comment about "Sanchez jumping on Ben" and he expanded the discussion to business practices in general in the knife world, including folks in China knocking off copies of John Young's knives (right down to forging his name on them).



I am hoping to see this material first hand next week at Blade. I wil be able to do that, right, Ben? Assuming I am able to examine it there, then if I like is as much in person as I like the pictures, I am inclined to try to commission a knife with it. And I already have a couple of makers in mind to approach about that. We'll see, I guess.

 

[RyanW]

I did not read that Steven was saying anything like that at all. He wasn't implying anything about you.

Step back and take another read.

I think he was just trying to respond to your comment about "Sanchez jumping on Ben" and he expanded the discussion to business practices in general in the knife world, including folks in China knocking off copies of John Young's knives (right down to forging his name on them).



I am hoping to see this material first hand next week at Blade. I wil be able to do that, right, Ben? Assuming I am able to examine it there, then if I like is as much in person as I like the pictures, I am inclined to try to commission a knife with it. And I already have a couple of makers in mind to approach about that. We'll see, I guess.

I have read through it a few times. I am just unsure which comment he was referring to... Its all good

 

[BenR.T.]

...I am hoping to see this material first hand next week at Blade. I wil be able to do that, right, Ben? Assuming I am able to examine it there, then if I like is as much in person as I like the pictures, I am inclined to try to commission a knife with it. And I already have a couple of makers in mind to approach about that. We'll see, I guess.

It should be represented by several makers, Chuck would know better who will have it.

OK Now my ass is in Chaps...

Now that is a picture I didn't need in my head!!

 

[RyanW]

It should be represented by several makers, Chuck would know better who will have it.

Ben I will bring my EDC with the material on it if Virginian would like to contact me, it is a good example of one with some wear on it.

Now that is a picture I didn't need in my head!!

Haha, not a pretty sight indeed! :barf:

 

[Kohai999]

I did not read that Steven was saying anything like that at all. He wasn't implying anything about you.

Step back and take another read.

I think he was just trying to respond to your comment about "Sanchez jumping on Ben" and he expanded the discussion to business practices in general in the knife world, including folks in China knocking off copies of John Young's knives (right down to forging his name on them).

I am hoping to see this material first hand next week at Blade. I wil be able to do that, right, Ben? Assuming I am able to examine it there, then if I like is as much in person as I like the pictures, I am inclined to try to commission a knife with it. And I already have a couple of makers in mind to approach about that. We'll see, I guess.

Yep that's about it.....I think people who like this material should check it out....and the more knowledgeable you are about the material, the more likely you are to have a satisfying experience with it.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson

 

[Bhamster]

I like this thunder stuff. The name is a bit much though. It would be interesting to see what it looks like cut at different angles. I would not hesitate to purchase a knife with it and it might even tilt me in favor of a knife. I like carbon fine as a useful material but never really thought much of the aesthetic value of it.