Yes. Bodybuilders also diet down to low single digits, that makes a huge difference in the formula. Not very relevant to normal population dieting to low teens (10-15% bodyfat).
-
The BladeForums.com 2024 Traditional Knife is ready to order! See this thread for details: https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/bladeforums-2024-traditional-knife.2003187/
Price is$300$250 ea (shipped within CONUS). If you live outside the US, I will contact you after your order for extra shipping charges.
Order here: https://www.bladeforums.com/help/2024-traditional/ - Order as many as you like, we have plenty.
How about a permanent monthly fitness skills thread?
- Thread starter koyote
- Start date
Yes. Bodybuilders also diet down to low single digits, that makes a huge difference in the formula. Not very relevant to normal population dieting to low teens (10-15% bodyfat).
Yep, a correctly done swing doesn't have much rotational outward force. Sure, you see a lot utube videos like that, but they are executed wrong.
Same as with Olympic lifting, most videos show poor execution with no understanding of the proper technique. Heck, most any lifting video in the internets will show piss poor form, be it squats, deadlifs, bench (yeah, I'm a powerlifter by heart) or the beloved snatch and C&J.
- Joined
- Feb 7, 2005
- Messages
- 1,086
Something I was thinking about while at the gym last night is the difference between looking physically fit and being physically fit. I think they are two different animals.
I'm a people watcher and am pretty good about noticing the tiniest detail of a person that would typically be overlooked. I see a lot of people at the gym who are huge and bulky, and constantly flexing and examining their muscle detail. I never see these guys doing any cardio or high repetitions. I also don't see them lifting massive amounts of weight. These guys also have about 10-13% body fat.
I also see guys lifting huge amounts of weight for around 3 sets of 3. These guys are fairly muscular and defined, so they probably have around 5-6% body fat. Again, no cardio for these guys at the gym; maybe they're doing cardio outside?
Next, I see guys that are sub-200lbs. These are the interesting guys working out. They typically have good muscle definition, flexibility, strength, and endurance. These guys are varying their workouts between exercises, weight, sets, and reps. They're also doing cardio, whether it's running, biking, machines, etc.
Next, there is the category where I fall in. 10% body fat, varying up the exercises, weight, sets, and reps. We're also doing various types of cardio. I think we're actually part of the above sub-200lbs guys, just not at that level of fitness.
I would only consider the sub-200lbs guys that can equally perform strength, endurance, and cardio exercises to be physically fit. Endurance and stamina with a decent amount of strength are what I consider physical fitness.
Right now, I consider myself mildly physically fit. My BMI is in the normal weight range, though I still have 8-10% body fat. I feel like I have fat that I need to loose. If I can see it, grab it, not see muscle under it, it needs to go.
Now, that's totally aesthetic on my part. I don't think loosing 5-6% body fat has any bearing on physical fitness, when you're in the normal BMI range.
I guess what I'm saying is that we need to be clear about what our goals are. Are they to look good, or be good? Paleo helped me look and feel better, but at a sacrifice. I'm anemic right now. It's very difficult for me to get the amount of protein and complex carbs to fuel intense workouts. So, I'm thinking about adding whole grain bread, cheese, and some other healthy, non-paleo food to my diet.
I'm a people watcher and am pretty good about noticing the tiniest detail of a person that would typically be overlooked. I see a lot of people at the gym who are huge and bulky, and constantly flexing and examining their muscle detail. I never see these guys doing any cardio or high repetitions. I also don't see them lifting massive amounts of weight. These guys also have about 10-13% body fat.
I also see guys lifting huge amounts of weight for around 3 sets of 3. These guys are fairly muscular and defined, so they probably have around 5-6% body fat. Again, no cardio for these guys at the gym; maybe they're doing cardio outside?
Next, I see guys that are sub-200lbs. These are the interesting guys working out. They typically have good muscle definition, flexibility, strength, and endurance. These guys are varying their workouts between exercises, weight, sets, and reps. They're also doing cardio, whether it's running, biking, machines, etc.
Next, there is the category where I fall in. 10% body fat, varying up the exercises, weight, sets, and reps. We're also doing various types of cardio. I think we're actually part of the above sub-200lbs guys, just not at that level of fitness.
I would only consider the sub-200lbs guys that can equally perform strength, endurance, and cardio exercises to be physically fit. Endurance and stamina with a decent amount of strength are what I consider physical fitness.
Right now, I consider myself mildly physically fit. My BMI is in the normal weight range, though I still have 8-10% body fat. I feel like I have fat that I need to loose. If I can see it, grab it, not see muscle under it, it needs to go.
Now, that's totally aesthetic on my part. I don't think loosing 5-6% body fat has any bearing on physical fitness, when you're in the normal BMI range.
I guess what I'm saying is that we need to be clear about what our goals are. Are they to look good, or be good? Paleo helped me look and feel better, but at a sacrifice. I'm anemic right now. It's very difficult for me to get the amount of protein and complex carbs to fuel intense workouts. So, I'm thinking about adding whole grain bread, cheese, and some other healthy, non-paleo food to my diet.
- Joined
- Mar 29, 2007
- Messages
- 5,846
I was actually going to suggest the straight leg lifts variant where you touch your ankles to the puillup bar
Good point. My workout buddy sometimes feels frustrated because he's lifted for years, but if you saw him in public you probably wouldn't guess it. But when he's in the gym maxing out machines you know what he's about. Strange how different peoples bodies can look.
- Joined
- Apr 25, 2007
- Messages
- 65
I recently started doing this and I agree 100% it's a great idea. I have a very strong focus on nutrition, strict ideas of what I will and won't eat. Lately I've been cooking the same amounts but eating half and saving half for later. I am trying my best to never eat until I'm full, period. I'm trying to eat small amounts spread throughout the day, and eating only what I need to recover from workouts and feel nourished, no more. I find anything past that just makes it tougher to digest, weighs me down, makes me feel lethargic and increases the risk of clogging up the toilet
My diet is based around leans meats and a variety of vegetables, with fruits, nuts and seeds for snacks and very small amounts of breads / grains here and there. From what I know this is what our digestive system is best developed for. I'm constantly evolving my diet as I learn more about nutrition (Feel free to criticize my lists!) A small sampling of things I do / don't eat:
Never consume:
Candy, pop, alcohol and other drugs, fast food, deep fried anything, anything with artificial flavors or colorings or preservatives, oily foods or anything cooked in oil, butter pork and milk (More a personal choice than dietary), more than a pinch of salt, chips, popcorn, coffee or caffeine in general, medicine of any sort unless absolutely necessary (My body takes care of itself pretty well), any sort of unnatural protein supplements, cheese, anything with high fructose corn syrup or refined sugars, bleached flours, artificial sweeteners like splenda....
Will consume as needed:
Chicken, turkey, fish, shrimp, lean high quality beef, eggs, soy milk, most fruits and veggies, large variety of seeds and nuts, water, juices made from 100% juice not from concentrate, peanut almond and cashew butter, whole wheat bread with an ingredients list containing less than 10 items (Rarely), oats, barley....
Will make exceptions when needed. For example if my girlfriends mom invites me to dinner and makes lasagna with cheese, I wouldn't refuse it. But I never use cheese on dinners I cook myself.
I find these lists easy to follow, and do so by choice not compulsion, because by eating small amounts of quality foods I feel my best. I get nothing out of pop and candy, bread doesn't really fulfill my cravings it just makes my belly feel bloated, and I've never felt a need for things like caffeine or "energy boosts," or "comfort" medicines like aspirin, sleep aids etc. (Not criticizing those that take them, everyone's body is different. I might see this differently when I'm 75 years old).
In addition to training strength and endurance, and trying to keep a good diet, I try to keep my mind active and healthy. I try to avoid negative situations when possible, stay away from TV and heavy doses of the news etc. Try to read at least something that makes me think daily, study some kind of subject I'm weak on etc. Also like to read The Bible and meditate daily to help keep my mind focused on important things.
I think the most important thing one can do is try.
That sounds like a good plan. The problem I've always had is portion control. I work out enough and with high intesity its just that I eat like there's no tomorrow. Plus at 40 years, I just don't burn the calories the way I used to. When my program starts next week that will change though. It will help having the guy who runs our gym counseling me and monitoring my progress. The good thing is that I'm in decent shape so the excess baggage should drop off fairly quickly. Even if it doesn't, I'm going to keep at the diet part of the equation. I'm actually looking forward to laying off the soft drinks and beer. Well maybe not the beer but I can survive
. Twice a week I've been doing a kickboxing class. I've found that it is very enjoyable plus nothing beats wailing on a heavybag. There is also a fusion kickboxing class that mixes our Monster workout with heavybag work. I haven't been able to try it yet. It sounds fun. I figure twice a week kickboxing with twice a week monster plus a day with lifting and I'll be all set.
Last edited:
Yeah getting myself to eat smaller portions took a conscious effort. My friend told me good advice. "Put your fork down." Slow down your eating. Between my mind being trained for 20 years to eat until my stomach was "full," and the mind naturally taking a long time to register it's fully nourished, it can be tough at first. I find eating with others helps, as you can spend time in between bites talking.
Completely agree on the punching bags. Just isn't anything like it. So much fun
Completely agree on the punching bags. Just isn't anything like it. So much fun
I think most here would agree with you on that. I have many friends that work out just to achieve the "Heman" physique, and the majority of them are not as physically fit as the pleasantly plump me.
I blew out my knee about 5 years ago grappling and after that it was down hill. I did nothing but sit on my romp being a pansy. I mean I stopped grappling, hiking and backpacking, hell I was even too lazy to car camp. I think I gained about 65lbs. I was so out of shape that when I bent over to tie my shoes I would be out of breath. Then in December of '08 I was fed up with myself and began taking my health and fitness level seriously again. I dropped the soda drinking, ate clean, worked out, and now I have lost 45lbs. The only thing I have left to drop is my belly.
Even now I am more physically fit than the majority of my friends that workout just for looks. I can run 7 - 7:30 minute miles (not great working on it) do about 15 dead hang pullups and tie my shoes many many times.
And in regards to your comment, wulfshrunting. Fedor, one of the baddest human beings alive:
I was actually going to suggest the straight leg lifts variant where you touch your ankles to the puillup bar
And the next step is touching the roof with the soles of your feet, keep them pressed for a second
- Joined
- Mar 29, 2007
- Messages
- 5,846
I strive right now for both. The looks help immensely with keeping your attitude up!
I have a few friends who are strict bodybuilders and aren't exactly weak, but I'm stronger and smaller than them. There is a sacrifice when you go for pure hypertrophy. (Especially as it involves a lot of isolation exercises that are the worst things for your joint helath.)
I'm currently in a strength building and fat loss phase again- I want to break this 20% barrier I've been at for a month and rip down to under 15% before I start focussing heavy on work capacity again.
Good news is that the specific strength building program using bodyweight and some light KB work (TGUs, limited swings, and some presses) is a massive joint strengthening program, too. (and I never even imagined I'd have a defined lower back, I got cordage!!!)
But my goals have always included very realistic survival fitness elements, and I would rather have a ripped 45 inch chest than a water bloated 49 inch chest.
Looking good is a part of feeling good, and not at all something you have to sacrifice to be good. You'll end up looking more like a gymnast than Arnie in Predator, but is that a bad thing?
- Joined
- Feb 7, 2005
- Messages
- 1,086
That's a great point, Christof. Looking good and feeling good go hand in hand for many people. I don't examine my self at the gym like some guys do, but I've noticed definition in my quads, core, bi/triceps, and upper chest. It's not much right now, but seeing it does keep me motivated.
It's all well and good to say "oh, bodybuilders are just about looks" but in their sport, that's all that matters. Why would they focus primarily on performance when it doesn't help their goal (proportion/ symmetry)?
However, for those that believe that bodybuilders are weak, do a little reading on Ronnie Coleman.
Also, someone earlier mentioned preferring strength work to endurance. Not to be a know-it-all, but please make sure you're an experienced lifter with a good foundation (letting bones and connective tissue adapt) before dropping below your 5RM for a strength workout.
However, for those that believe that bodybuilders are weak, do a little reading on Ronnie Coleman.
Also, someone earlier mentioned preferring strength work to endurance. Not to be a know-it-all, but please make sure you're an experienced lifter with a good foundation (letting bones and connective tissue adapt) before dropping below your 5RM for a strength workout.
- Joined
- Feb 7, 2005
- Messages
- 1,086
That was me, I think. Within the context that I said it, it's a true statement, because the workouts are much simpler. Outside of the simplicity context, I prefer varied endurance workouts.
Update: Tonight's run was even better than Wednesday night's. I'm reassessing my running prediction. I'm at 2.5 miles at 8.5min/mile right now, with a small walking break, then running the final mile for a total of 3.5 miles.
There's something about the cold and the dark, especially the dark, that enables me to run better.
I'm not going to increase too much. I'll increase to 4 miles in the next two weeks, then increase .25 miles per week.
I'm more excited about running than working out for a variety of reasons. Easy to see results in speed, distance, fat loss, ease of breathing, and zoning out while running. I don't get the runner's euphoria or high like a lot do. What does happen is similar to an out of body experience. I feel detached from my body and slightly higher than my physical body. It's pretty strange, and my limbs feel like they're very far away.
No, I don't use drugs; nor have I ever.
- Joined
- Mar 29, 2007
- Messages
- 5,846
I talk a lot about strength work at my current phase, but I don't lift plates on a bar. I don't really need to be- or become- an experienced lifter
There's a lot to be said for bodyweight strength training as pure "raw strength" training. You do have to progress through steps to develop the best tendon, rotator cuff, and joint strength- jumping from the couch into one arm pushups might be a bit much!
- Joined
- Aug 24, 2006
- Messages
- 318
I have become a night-time runner (hate running in the sunlight) and the weather is killing me lately. I can't wait for it to be above freezing at night.
Edited to add:
I'd recommend anyone who is interested in changing their body to get a Basal Metablic Rate test performed (not calculated, but actually go to your healthcare provider or fitness center and get your metabolism tested). It's an extremely useful bit of knowledge when you are attempting to calculate how many calories you need to consume in order to lose weight based on your own particular body. I've gotten tested several times over the last year and a half to monitor changes as well as modify my nutrition program more accurately.
Last edited:
I talk a lot about strength work at my current phase, but I don't lift plates on a bar. I don't really need to be- or become- an experienced lifter
There's a lot to be said for bodyweight strength training as pure "raw strength" training. You do have to progress through steps to develop the best tendon, rotator cuff, and joint strength- jumping from the couch into one arm pushups might be a bit much!
Exactly! jumping straight into one arm pushups would lead to an increased risk of injury. Building up slowly over a period of time is the equivalent to laying down a solid foundation with weight training, providing enough time is given with both activities.
Did you use eccentric drops or or one arm pushups on an incline to build up to them?
Congrats again on your weightloss