How do you test your knives?

Actually, you very much intended to offend, as your last 'conciliatory' post very clearly shows.
Don't go getting all butt hurt because you were called out for a deliberate misquote.
You pretty much ignored other posts that we're in some cases, less than supportive, and others that were outright dismissive in their attitudes.
Thanks for the left-handed, out the back side of your face ,"my bad". Your opinion REALLY means a lot, and who you would or would not buy from is so important to me.
Now, I shall stick my tongue out at you and blow a raspberry.
 
I torture test my knives occasionally.
Sometimes I’ll just randomly stab and pry the tip into a 6x6 piece of wood in the garage just to make sure it holds up and doesn’t break off.
It’s also helpful to see the grain.
I’ll drop them point first on the garage floor too to make sure they don’t break.

I chop through wood with camp knives to see how they perform but also to feel how comfortable the handle is.

Not all tests are targeted at the strength of the steel. Some are so I can see what might look good, but feel terrible in hand.
 
OK, guys, lets knock it off. Just hit the back arrow and look at something else.
If it keeps on, I'll have to close the thread.


To ancientsteels - I may not be the go-to authority on hamon and Japanese blades, but I have never seen or heard of the line in san-mai being called the hamon. I have referred to it as a faux-hamon, and seen that term used by others. Hamon and faux-hamon are very different things
 
Rick Marchand said:
nmbarta... I think you are painting with too broad a brush in some respects and not a large enough one in other areas.

You have to realize that a line like this is going to insult people. I don't agree with the logic behind this statement, either. We seem to share the same need for what I consider extreme testing... but I would never be so close minded to assert that those who choose not to abuse their knives don't have the same level of sincerity in making a functional knife. An argument could be made that they are more grounded in reality. Just something to consider.


Dan... I think you are over-reacting to nmbarta's personal opinions. Be secure in you own conclusions and the fact that others will be like minded.

Let's not get out of hand with the digs, guys.
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I totally agree, sometimes a knife is just too good looking to beat up, and then some blade-smiths have juts done it so long that they are confident in their work.
 
Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
OK, guys, lets knock it off. Just hit the back arrow and look at something else.
If it keeps on, I'll have to close the thread.


To ancientsteels - I may not be the go-to authority on hamon and Japanese blades, but I have never seen or heard of the line in san-mai being called the hamon. I have referred to it as a faux-hamon, and seen that term used by others. Hamon and faux-hamon are very different things
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You are exactly right!
I only used the term "Hamon" to convey the idea I was trying to put in to words, and I admit that it was a poor choice.
And to those that may have been offended at my posts I will say again, I am not the best at putting into words the exact idea I am trying to covey, And sometimes it just doesn't come out right at all. In none of my posts do I ever mean any offense to anyone, I am not here to give offense, make smart remarks, or gouge people.
I even went and edited some of my comments to be better worded once the others with the right term chimed in.
I thanked them for correcting me and clarifying my mistake.
As I have said before when I cannot think of or remember the right term, I resorts to colloquial terms that are understood even if they are incorrect.
Its not a complete lack of knowledge of terminology on my part (though I have room to learn, and I respect those who correct me and inform me my misquote/mistake), but rather a difficulty putting things into words, (Again I apologize for this.)

I however don't understand why others must take offense at my poor wording and phrasing, when I have made it openly known that I DO NOT INTEND OFFENSE, and have done my best to clarify that I don't always have the best success at conveying my meaning, or using the right word or term.

I came here to learn, and to share what I know, to the best of my ability.

Please take this for what it is worth.

If my presence here is causing that much consternation, I can simply not come here anymore.
I have no desire to cause consternation, nor do I wish to cause stress, or malice.

As always,

Wishing everybody the very best!
 
DanF said:
Actually, you very much intended to offend, as your last 'conciliatory' post very clearly shows.
Don't go getting all butt hurt because you were called out for a deliberate misquote.
You pretty much ignored other posts that we're in some cases, less than supportive, and others that were outright dismissive in their attitudes.
Thanks for the left-handed, out the back side of your face ,"my bad". Your opinion REALLY means a lot, and who you would or would not buy from is so important to me.
Now, I shall stick my tongue out at you and blow a raspberry.
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I am not butt-hurt. I thanked those who chimed in and corrected my mistake.
I mean you no offense, and I apologize if my comments caused offense, that was not my intention.
I had no intent to target you nor was that my intention either.
we are all supposed to be here to build each other up, offer encouragement, support, advice, and knowledge.
I edited my posts once others chimed in with the proper term, so that accuracy or at least a semblance thereof would be achieved, and I thanked them for their correction and clarification.
To you I offer nothing but my friendship and respect, and should that fail, I turn the other cheek, and wish you the best.
To lash out at others solves nothing.

Good luck to you!
 
ancientsteels said:
I am not butt-hurt. I thanked those who chimed in and corrected my mistake.
I mean you no offense, and I apologize if my comments caused offense, that was not my intention.
I had no intent to target you nor was that my intention either.
we are all supposed to be here to build each other up, offer encouragement, support, advice, and knowledge.
I edited my posts once others chimed in with the proper term, so that accuracy or at least a semblance thereof would be achieved, and I thanked them for their correction and clarification.
To you I offer nothing but my friendship and respect, and should that fail, I turn the other cheek, and wish you the best.
To lash out at others solves nothing.

Good luck to you!
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That post had nothing to do with you.
 
Josh,

That's a good point. I could already tell with this knife that the blade is a little too light or the handle is a little too heavy, or both. It feels nice just holding it, but it doesn't chop like I'd like it to, I also think I have just a little too much curve in the whole thing. I'm going to keep the grind a little lower and bring the tip up about 1/4" on the next one. I think I'll also taper the tang a little and drill a few more holes in the handle.
 
I took some advice form the less extreme testers last night.
I cut up some antelope back straps, a few potatoes, an onion, a few cloves of garlic, opened a couple good micro brews with the tip and then left it dirty on the counter to see how it holds up.
It didn't rust (1084) but it did stain/patina, or whatever it's called when it turns blue/yellow/tan. It actually looks like temper colors.
Not what I expected at all. I figured it would have some surface rust, but it doesn't. Looks kind of neat.
 
I think there is a problem with making an analogy between custom furniture and custom knives. Mass produced furniture uses very different materials with very different assembly methods compared to custom furniture. Those differences equate to both tangible and intangible differences for lack of a better way to say it. The intangible differences being things like true hardwood looks nicer than a veneer. A hand rubbed finish looks better than sprayed on finish. The big intangible of bragging rights saying it was hand built. There are also very tangible differences in things like solid hardwood is stronger than pressboard. Dovetail joints are more solid than plastic spin lock nuts, etc.

With knives, the actual part that makes it a knife really isn’t that drastically different between a mass produced and custom knife. You are often comparing the same steel. Mass produced can also be as if not more consistent in heat treating than the small custom maker. The mass produced knife depending on manufacturer may be at a slightly lower Rockwell, but that’s generally speaking on purpose. It’s also the reality that the average person cannot tell through proper use of the knife a couple Rockwell difference in hardness between blades. I know some folks take the “performance” approach to custom knives, but it’s not really an angle I’m super subscribed to because to me the manufactured knives aren’t actually “bad” speaking from a tangible perspective. I just don’t think it’s the same functional comparison as cheap furniture.

What I see custom knives generally having as the desirable factor over manufactured knives are the “intangible” elements (bad word because some of this you can see and feel). Custom knives have options (and nicer options) of materials for handles. There is generally a higher fit and finish that has no functional difference but just looks nicer. There is an artistry of both design and execution involved. There may be more focus on ergonomics of how the knife feels in the hand for a given task. There is an exclusivity to custom which yes is a part of value if that exclusivity is desired. I guess what I’m saying is there is plenty of “value” to a custom knife over a manufactured knife that has nothing to do with having some black magic secret sauce that can make the exact same chemically composed steel somehow mo betta and proving that through aggressive testing. That custom knife does still need to function as a knife though, and preferably as the type of knife it was designed to be, so I agree with the camp of test it doing the things it is meant to do. If a chef’s knife can chop through nails but feels uncomfortable in the hand cutting tomatoes, how good is it?
 
nmbarta said:
Thank you,
I was figured there was a standard for knives, how to test, and what to expect of a good blade.
I guess there just isn't. Now that I know that, I can just go about abusing my metal how I see fit I guess.
I love rifles, and there is a standard that is pretty much across the board, 1 moa is a pretty good shooting factory rifle with factory ammo.
I expect more from my full custom built rifles, and I get more from them. They will shoot 1/2 moa all day, and I get quite a few 1/4 moa groups from them as well. I know them well and what they are capable of, I load the ammo for them and know what they do together, because of this, I can hit targets much farther away than most. My rifle is actually better than most.
I just assumed that custom knives were a bit like that, obviously, truly, better than the store bought stuff.

I have a 100.00 full set of kitchen knives with steak knives that cuts food. If I were to "test" them with food, they'd pass the test just fine.
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Cut the food? Yes, if Ht is good etc. My custom Culinary knives are balanced & the handle sized for my customers and Sure a old Kia will get you to work & back but a Lexus will be a joy & invigorating to drive. ————————-Like a well balanced and handle sized custom Chef knife will be over your $100.00 set of knives..
 
Rhino,

I agree completely. The Lexus doesn't just feel better and look nicer either, it performs better as well.

Lanternnate,

I see your point. In this case, the maker may need to test to make sure that the 20 dollar walmart special isn't a better knife than the one he's trying to sell at 10 times the money.
 
Rhinoknives1 said:
Cut the food? Yes, if Ht is good etc. My custom Culinary knives are balanced & the handle sized for my customers and Sure a old Kia will get you to work & back but a Lexus will be a joy & invigorating to drive. ————————-Like a well balanced and handle sized custom Chef knife will be over your $100.00 set of knives..
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Yeah but have you ever had to pay for a mechanic to work on a Lexus? Jeeze... :eek::D
 
KnuckleDownKnives said:
Yeah but have you ever had to pay for a mechanic to work on a Lexus? Jeeze... :eek::D
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just a toyota with a fancy badge. used to make the front axles for toyota and lexus.
you test a knife by doing what the knife is designed for. i slice onions, tomatoes, cucumber, boneless beef or pork. when sharpening, i usually stop when i can push cut newsprint cleanly. a knife is to whittle or slice with, if i want to chop i use a hatchet or ax.
 
Agreed, but sometimes we’re testing for what someone else would do, not what we would do.

scott.livesey said:
just a toyota with a fancy badge. used to make the front axles for toyota and lexus.
you test a knife by doing what the knife is designed for. i slice onions, tomatoes, cucumber, boneless beef or pork. when sharpening, i usually stop when i can push cut newsprint cleanly. a knife is to whittle or slice with, if i want to chop i use a hatchet or ax.
Click to expand...
 
This topic always turns out the same. A battle between the extremes...

Camp 1 - Test your knives beyond what is expected.
extremist - How can you ever be confident in your product, if you don't test to destruction?

Camp 2 - Test your knives to suit their intended purpose.
extremist - A knife is first and foremost a cutting tool. Anything more is senseless abuse.

I personally don't see either as wrong. Just different.
 
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