How does infi compare to S30V??

I wonder what the hardness is of S30V as heat treated by Paul Bos (Strider blades for example). Strider has tested S30V and have decided it is enough of an improvement to replace their Bos treated BG42 blades which ran Rc 60-61, I believe.
 
Originally posted by Cliff Stamp
...a lot of it depends on how you felt about the above (BG-42/ ATS-34), if you had problems with them chipping S30V would be more durable, and would be well recieved.
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Thanks, Cliff. Yeah, also I recall in Phil's testing of S90V against BG42 @ Rc61, they were comparable in terms of incidence of chipping, so I'd expect S30V to win out over S90V in that area as well.

Actually, I'd gotten to the point where I had no problems with wear resistance/edge holding of that Rc range in BG42, as in Reeve's Sebenza's. Of course, I like the additional wear resistance of S90V, but after all, you still have to sharpen the knife eventually no matter what it's made of, and I tend to touch my knives up as I go anyway--rarely take full advantage of the wear resistance of S90V. So the added toughness of S30V, especially for use in folders and thin-bladed stuff that's prone to chip, is a very welcome addition to me. I have a couple of folders ordered in S30V already, from Kit Carson and RJ Martin.

Of course, when it comes to hard-use choppers/priers/all-out abusers you can stake your life on, make mine 1/4" INFI every time.

Say, wonder if Busse might consider ever making an INFI folder...?

Nah, I must be dreamin'. :)

-Will
 
hehe, alot of people share that dream, Will.

harrydog, 59-60. Rob Simonich told me at Blade that they were consistently getting 59.5 from Paul Bos on S30V (Strider, Rinaldi, Simonich, Hossom...I think they all use him).
 
I notice that Strider is still cranking out their high-end customs using BG42 as opposed to S30V. I wonder if this has to do with the fact that the BG42 is run at a higher Rockwell level. In the long run, I think we may be splitting hairs between the advantages/disadvantages of ATS34, BG42, and S30V. The edge geometry is probably more important.
 
Dang Clif, you been peeking in my shop window again? You are partly right, the blades Paul Bos does for me in S30-V are as Owen states consistently 59.5 However this is only on the bigger blades I do in S30-V. My smaller blades I am running harder, at 60 to 61 Rc. In my opinion, 62 Rc with S30-V is just too dang hard if the knife is to see any impacts at all with a nice thin edge. I ground some thin blades, .010 before sharpening and saw edge chipping on a brass rod. Oncombat grade knives I have settled on the heat treat by Paul Bos at 59.5 Rc and am seeing a very very good balance of toughness and edge holding. I have taken some S30-V knives to destruction and it is the toughest stainless I have ever worked with.
 
Originally posted by Rob Simonich
I have taken some S30-V knives to destruction and it is the toughest stainless I have ever worked with.
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Rob,
I'm interested in hearing more about this. What kind of destruction did you do, and what were your findings? Specifics if possible, also what size of blade did you destroy? Did it include chopping, prying etc.

Thanks for stopping by, and I look forward to hearing more about your findings.
:D:D
 
Hi Eric, we met at the Blade Show if I remember right. :)

I cant post my finding right now out of respect for Blade Magazine who is doing an article on the testing which they witnessed in the October issue of Blade, which is on the stand early August. After that issue comes out then no problem! :)

I can say the tests did include chopping, prying, digging, as well as ABS approved cutting tests.

Geeze, I am glad I found this thread, there is a good dicussion going on here! I got to use the search feature more often! :D
 
Rob,
I realize you can't give the full details of your experience with the steel because of the article, but wonder if you can comment on one thing in particular.
I don't know much about A2, but have read that it's "Rc sensitive", in that it's performance peaks at certain Rc levels, but is substandard at others. You make a distinction between S30V at 59-60, at 60-61, and at 62. It seems like there's more than a little difference for a small difference in hardness.
I just saw a thing on knifeforums about Chris Reeve Knives doing a knife that will be presented to SF guys when they pass the Q course (I'll come back and post a link-just info about their contract, and specs for the knife, but it's interesting).
It's S30V@57-58, which if I remember right, is higher than they run A2 on their one piece knives. I can't imagine them making a "less tough" knife for distribution to SF personnel.
So...does it go both ways?
Is there a substantial increase in toughness with just a 1 or 2 point drop?

I'm curious, because I'd like to get Trace to make me a Megiddo later this year, and was going to go with A2 or 3V treated by Bodycote, but I'd much rather have a knife with better stain resistance, and forget about the coating. I'm holding out to see what people think of S30V when they use it in larger knives. I hope Ethan Becker will comment about this somewhere at some time, since he got that exact knife in (I think) S30V at Blade, and I'd really like to hear what he has to say about it.

edit: here is the link to the post about the CRK
http://www.knifeforums.com/ubbthrea...=174595&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=0&fpart=
 
Essentially yes, the early promotion from some people was very high and in excess of the actual abilites, much like Talonite. And just like Talonite, there are significant drawbacks which were either ignored or prone to misinformation, mainly hardness related issues (edge retention and durability), Reeve for example.
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Cliff, great way to make your point:D
Those very things have steered me away from Talonite. Not to mention the cost...
 
Originally posted by Rob Simonich
Hi Eric, we met at the Blade Show if I remember right. :)

I cant post my finding right now out of respect for Blade Magazine who is doing an article on the testing which they witnessed in the October issue of Blade, which is on the stand early August. After that issue comes out then no problem! :)

I can say the tests did include chopping, prying, digging, as well as ABS approved cutting tests.
Click to expand...

Rob,
Yes, we did speak briefly at Blade, it was a pleasure meeting you. :D


Looking forward to the article and more discussion on this topic once it comes out.

Thanks for the info. :D:D
 
I may be simple-minded in this issue, but since INFI is pretty much available only to Mr. Busse, and S30V is available to anyone who wants to purchase it, it seems it would be a relatively simple thing for Busse Combat to buy some S30V, grind up some blanks just like what they're doing for their INFI knives, perform some various heat treats on the S30V and do some destructive testing. From reading these forums, it seems that Busse Combat has done a good bit of testing on their proprietary steel and has the equipment to make relevant S30V comparison knives for further R&D. Am I wrong here? Maybe they've already done this? Who knows, the shadow?
 
Nobody (Rygel--cool avatar),

I'm guessing that Busse Combat has already done this, though I don't know for sure. It's pretty obvious that Busse keeps up on research and innovation, in the pursuit of offering the best product possible.
 
Rob, thanks for the clarification, I was just going by what Hossom said, which was you did initial testing at 60 RC, but are now running at 59 RC. In regards to 62 being brittle, Wilson isn't into the "tactical" rage, we are talking about hunting and fillet knives, so no chopping or prying.

In regards to Reeve using S30V at a higher RC than his A2 blades and what that means in regards to toughness. Reeve has said in the past that BG-42 would make a directly better one piece than A2, it would just be too expensive. Considering their comments on toughness (equating toughness to machinability and wear resistance) and hardness in the past, it is next to impossible to draw conclusions on the steel from the decisions made. You can't even get him to comment on what it means in regards to toughness that he is running S30V softer than his BG-42 in the Sebenza.

-Cliff
 
Rob, according to your comment above is it correct that you have Paul Bos heat treat your big knives in s30V , but your smaller S30V knives you heat treat yourself? If this is true, why? I am only curious-
Martin
 
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