How to Heat Treat AEB-L in the Home Shop

Great timing. I am in the process of making one with AEB-L and the HT did not come out as good as I'd like. Gotta try the process listed here. Thanks.
 
Just to clarify, I did not mean to imply that AEB-L or 13C256 NEEDED LN, just that it won't hurt and according to what I was told by they guy from B-U, you DO need it for stuff like Elmax to get the max performance because that steel needs a minimum temp about 20 degrees lower than what dry ice will give you. That chart seems to imply that for high speed steels, etc, you "need" -150F to really get into that "sweet spot" For guys like me, the stumbling block for LN is not the cost of the gas, which I can get right across the street form my shop. It is the cost of a decent dewar and by decent, I mean one that works and still has all of the parts with it, especially the intact lid. ;)
 
Yea, we use dry ice/acetone and get about -106° at least for sure. Ive checked it..The heat treat we have been using will give the AEB-L about 62rc off the plates then the sub zero quench takes it on down to appx 64rc so the sub zero quench is working.I do feel that a steady continuous quench is very important..Plates straight to the slurry as fast as possible...We have not worked with ELMAX and some of other "super steels" just because I know it takes LN to get it there and we don't have a dewar..A dewar is not something you see around here and I don't mind paying for equipment but I don't know that shelling out $500 for a dewar that may get used once every six months is wise..All the stainless steels we use can be treated just fine in the slurry. I can buy dry ice for .99 cents a pound right down the road..No problem getting LN either but a dewar is the issue..
I look forward to trying some of the things that DevinT posted here...
 
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It's AQ hardness curve.

Ken H> said:
Well, from those graphs it does look like Sandvik is saying 15% and not a typo. Also, it looks like quenching from 2050ºF, then into dry ice slurry gives most hardness and less RA at 15%. I was thinking a lower number for RA was the norm for properly HT'd blades? I sure wish AEB-L gave as much HT'ing info as Sandvik does for their steels.

Bluntcut: are those "as quenched" Rc numbers in the top graph give about 61 Rc as max hardness (<2 000ºF) for 12C27 even with dry ice?

Ricky, your "600", isn't that 600ºC? Which is 1112ºF.

Remember folks - taking HT info from one manuf and using for a different manuf is not the same. While both AEB-L and Sandvik are both Swedish manuf - they are still not "necessarily" the same HT requirement. In the real world, they should be VERY close.

Ken H>
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Ken H> said:
Well, from those graphs it does look like Sandvik is saying 15% and not a typo. Also, it looks like quenching from 2050ºF, then into dry ice slurry gives most hardness and less RA at 15%. I was thinking a lower number for RA was the norm for properly HT'd blades? I sure wish AEB-L gave as much HT'ing info as Sandvik does for their steels.


Ricky, your "600", isn't that 600ºC? Which is 1112ºF.


Ken H>
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Yes Ken. You are correct.
 
Im not trying to argue with anyone really Im not..I just want to say that 15% RA seems very high for a steel like AEB-L in my mind...Id expect that from maybe D2 or A2 but not aeb-l..Especially with the level of fine edge stability I get from aeb-l.
 
Well, I KNOW you're not trying to argue with me because I personally don't know enough to have a real opinion on AEB-L steel - but that 15% for Sandvik does come right off the Sandvik website. Your thinking is exactly what myself and others are thinking, BUT - usually a mis-print only shows up once, but Sandvik has it in print and in graph..... I do realize that mis-print could have been in hand written notes which caused a webdesigner (who may well know nothing about HT'ing) to have the mis-print and carried it into several different spots. This question seems to call for a chat with a Sandvik engineer.

Ken H>
 
Wow, allot to take on here. and consider. I have been using Aldos AEB-L. I dont have a RC tester but......
1. I just place my foil wrapped blanks in a cold oven. Evenheat 220v.
2. Heat to 1955
3. Plate quench w/ compressed air shot in the sides.Place in acetone/ dry ice slurry 20 min.
4. . Temper 350X2hrs
The only testing I can do is, performance, they seem to get and hold an edge fine.

Never had any problem with real world use.
 
AEB-L has no primary carbides like 154cm or 440c so i does not require long soak or ramp times. In general, the faster a steel heats up and the faster the quench, the smaller the grain size. The smaller the grain size the tougher and more wear resistant it is.

Hoss
 
Hoss, in your experience is medium to medium fast speed oil "too fast" of a quench for thin section of AEB-L?
 
I haven't done a lot of oil quenching of this steel. I prefer the plate quench. I have in the past, quenched this steel left in double sealed foil, in water with good results. A lot cleaner that way and you don't have to fiddle with the foil wrap. Medium fast oil should be fine.

Hoss
 
Devin thank you for posting this. I've had pretty good success with AEBL and like it a lot but I'm still new and always looking for more data.

If you don't mind I have two questions for you. This is the first I've heard of the prequench so...

1) I don't have two ovens, would you see any issues with a pre quench at 1725 and while quenching let the oven drop to 1550 and then put in for a short soak and ramp to 19XX? Any issues or reasons not to?

2) Because I find it a pita to have to buy dry ice and try not to waste electric I usually do 3-5 blades at a time. I've never noticed any issues but I don't have a rockwell tester yet and I've always worried that the slight drop and rise in temp in between quenching each knife is a problem. Should I be worried about this?

To elaborate further I usually soak at 1975 for 7-10 minutes then pull out the first blade, plate quench with aluminum plates and some compressed air, about 3 minutes, then set aside and do the next blade. With each blade taking about 3 minutes and 5 blades total the last blade will have been at 1975 for roughly 17-22 minutes.

Thanks again!

-Clint
 
I have a coupe quick questions too guys. Sorry if they are dumb ones. :eek:

1) Any particular size to make the coupons?
2) Do they have to also be in the stainless steel foil?
3) Liquid of choice for the dry ice slurry. I've read all these were used: denatured alcohol, methyl alcohol, 97% isopropanol, mineral oil, low odor mineral spirits. What is the less dangerous/easiest to dispose of?

Thanks
 
For the coupons I would guess an 1.5"x1.5" would be adequate. Just a guess though. You would need to put them in the foil also. I have been using denatured alcohol and just pour the remnant back into the original container. I don't lose too much per use, so a gallon will go a long way.
 
Thanks a bunch Lo/Rez. Now only need to buy Dry Ice. Welding/gaz place will have some I think with a minimum of 25 lbs buy (42$). Guess I need to do more than one blade to optimize cost.
 
Not sure how the do it up there, but here in Florida, you can find it in your local grocery store at times.
Patrice Lemée;15569247 said:
Thanks a bunch Lo/Rez. Now only need to buy Dry Ice. Welding/gaz place will have some I think with a minimum of 25 lbs buy (42$). Guess I need to do more than one blade to optimize cost.
Click to expand...
 
There may be other options. If you have a place that sells purified water they might have some available. Places that cater to hunters and fishermen may also carry dry ice.
 
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