How tough is Talonite?

Cliff...

Does Chris have empirical data to back that statement up?
As a scientist you know very well theory does not always stand up in the lab. I respect Chris, I lust after a Sebenza, but until he has actual physical data his statement is mere speculation.

Why not make a Talonite Seb and do a rigorous one on one testing vs a BG42 or CPM Seb.
 
DC,

Does Chris have empirical data to back that statement up?
Click to expand...

None that I have seen, nor any physical spec. testing except the low RC which I don't think can be directly compared to steels for obvious reasons.

As a scientist you know very well theory does not always stand up in the lab.
Click to expand...

Especially if its one of mine.

Why not make a Talonite Seb and do a rigorous one on one testing vs a BG42 or CPM Seb.
Click to expand...

I would definately be interested in any direct comparasion. All the reports I have seen from those that have used Talonite have praised its utility including Ron Hood who does a fair bit more than "light work". The only one I have seen critize Talonite / Stellite is Tom Mayo who has commented that it does not take an edge well for him.

-Cliff


[This message has been edited by Cliff Stamp (edited 23 May 1999).]
 
Cliff....

"The only one I have seen critize Talonite / Stellite is Tom Mayo who has commented that it
does not take an edge well for him"

Yep, only one I've seen as well. Rob said very much the same thing upon initial completion of Talonite #1. Rob then put some critical thought into the matter and ended up with a product that owners and users are impressed with.
 
DC, Rob seems like an excellent knifemaker just from what I have read. What I like most is seen in the following :

http://www.bladeforums.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/002194.html

Anyone will be willing to talk about their successes but it takes a whole different kind of person to discuss problems they have encountered. This type of information is very valuable, explict descriptions of testing are rarely posted. I for one will be keeping an eye out for posts by Rob and looking forward to my Talonite blades.

-Cliff
 
Cliff,

I'm glad others are questioning Chris Reeve's statements about Talonite too. He has my respect as a knifemaker and businessman, but I fear his statements are simply ill-informed.

As far as Rob goes, and DC alluded to this, his experience with Talonite was what he termed a"roller coaster". If you haven't visited his web site and read the "Talonite Project" saga you owe it to yourself to do so. I was fortunate enough to track progress with Rob as this first knife was the one I commissioned that became known as the Wambli. The first attempt to get a good edge frustrated Rob and he documents it
smile.gif
!!

The only error in the story is about using the knife on game... the narrative alludes to waiting for me to try it out in the field. I told Rob to give it a work out (this after his high power microscope inspection of the first ground edge which lead to a different approach and a hair popping result....Tom Mayo please take note as Trace Rinaldi, Kit Carson and many others have been able to produce a remarkable edge). Rob proceeded to field dress and fully butcher two large does (which included bone cutting). This with the same edge that chopped up that pile of stuff illustrated on his web page. He shipped the knife to me edge as is and I proceeded to cut up a ton of stuff ranging from PVC to nylon rope. It took a long time before that edge required touching up. Simply amazing!

So when we talk of toughness, this edge did not chip nor bend nor curl. It took a lickin' and keeps on tickin'! Dunno what more folks can ask for! I'm sure as heck a convert.

-=[Bob]=-
 
I thought I'd add a few recent notes to this Talonite discussion.

Last week I had some fellas start work on a new addition here at the place. I loaned one of them my Kanji (Rob Simonich Talonite)and the other got my trusty Busse Mean Street (A2). It was a TOUGH thing to do.

I told them to rip the blades up. Use them to cut tar paper, tin.... I didn't care. The only rules were that they couldn't throw them and they couldn't try to cut nails. All I wanted was to know how often they sharpened the blades and what they thought when it was done.

On the afternoon of day two I wandered over to chat with them and check the job and noticed that Aaron, the guy with the Mean Street, was using the Kanji. I asked about that and he said that the Mean Street needed too much sharpening. Keep in mind that these guys usually use tin snips on the roofing material and utility blades on the tarpaper etc. Bill had the Kanji and wanted to trade his .243 Winchester for it. Sorry

In day three I took the blades back. The Kanji was a bit worn, the Busse was scratched. The kanji edge had rolled some but had not lost it's ability to cut freehanging paper. The A2 wouldn't cut a *art. I spent the better part of an hour bringing the Busse back. The Kanji just needed a quick go with a steel.

I think I know where I will spend my money. I'd love to get a chopper to lay up against the INFI BM's I have. I have a feeling.....

Next week I'm taking a gang of Wardens from California Department of Fish and Game to the mountains for a 5 day survival course. I'll do the same thing with them and let you know how it comes out.

Thanks for listening.

Ron
 
Dr Hood,

Great post! I'm glad to hear the results of other folks giving talonite a work out. Rob sure makes a great knife. I think folks tend to forget that Rob liked this stuff so much he put his money and reputation on the line and became an exclusive distributor for it. That sure says something.

And so does your speculative comment about Talonite versus INFI. I already know from first hand experience that Talonite holds an edge longer than CPM440V, but against some of the "newer" proprietary stuff like INFI I could only guess. Generally I don't think that there is a cutlery steel that is going to challenge Talonite for edge holding. The great thing is having real field evaluations like what you have been arranging. You know your knives and certainly subject them to severe use and conditions in your survival outings, but to have some groups go at it as well is additional icing on the cake.

BTW your friends observations about A2 match those of another group who tested one of Rob's Talonite Cetan/Wamblis during a wild boar hunt a month or two ago. The comparison there was the old Blackjack knives which had a good reputation for their A2 steel models. They loved the Talonite too.

Again Ron, we all appreciate your dropping in here to share information with us. Glad to see you're finally rid of that jungle crud you had.



------------------
-=[Bob]=-

I did NOT escape from the institution! They gave me a day pass!

 
well...saw my name mention so will throw in my 2 cents.....to refresh everyone...i said it doesnt take a FINE edge....like 440v and 420v.....it takes a nice edge and holds it a long time (stellite) never used talonite.. not sure what the difference is....have bent some tips on stellite blades (i hollow grind everything except the machetes and camp knives i make)....i mean bent....thin stock that is ground thin...bent....yes you can bend it back.....butch winter....been collecting knives and writting articles since before the guild was formed... took a BIG chip out of a stellite knife with a chicken bone (ask him about it not me)..dont even know who made the knife....i am not bad rapping this stuff...just stating facts... i love a nice crisp edge...i found the stellite tended to roll over on me sometimes, and yes maybe i should have tried harder and stuck with it longer but im sure i made over 30 knives out of the stuff and it cost like the dickens.....i have been using the new crucible particle metals for the last two years and i love them...and yes they are a little brittle....to me knife steel is a lot like life....there is a big balance beam out there and you have to decide where you want the needle to end up, way on one side...way on the other, in the middle or a little to one side....great thread...i enjoyed reading it.....am considering getting some talonite...i just made my first 420v knife and got two 18" bars from ed.....aloha and goodnite... http://www.mayoknives.com for a pic of the 420v knife

[This message has been edited by tom mayo (edited 24 May 1999).]

[This message has been edited by tom mayo (edited 24 May 1999).]
 
Tom,

Thanks for the needed clarification. I do think you'll find that the Talonite is different enough from Stellite that you'll form a much improved opinion on issues about fine edges and edge resistance to chipping, rolling, etc. Hope you get a chance to try it out.

-=[Bob]=-
 
Guys at this point I would like to thanks you all for your help. It has been very greatly appreciated and worthwhile--not to mention helpful. Unfortunaltly I still cannot decide and I am agraid I am going to have to wait for Mr. Stamp to try each out under his own special knife torturing process before I can. By the way Mr. Stamp what knid of baldes are you having make from the stuff?
oonce agian thank you very much and I hope this topic keeps on going.

thanks and take care
collin
 
Ron addressed the main concern and that was the edge deformation that most people think will happen with Talonite because of the low RC. If it holds up significantly better than A2 then I don't see how it can be considered weak in that regard.

Collin, I am getting a small thin utility knife (basically a Wambli in Talonite with a slightly finer point, 3/32 stock, sandblasted and grooved G-10 grip), and a large chopper.

I am unsure of the geometry on the chopper yet as I am not familar with the properties of Talonite. I will know more after I have worked with the smaller blade for awhile.

-Cliff
 
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