How would you handle this eBay shipping damage complaint?

jblyttle

jblyttle

Joined
Sep 3, 2014
Messages
3,741
I recently sold a full axe on eBay, a nice Kelly Michigan with a tight original handle.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/261706585276?ssPageName=STRK:MESOX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1561.l2649#shpCntId

I got a note yesterday from the buyer that the head was "separated from the handle/not what he bought/how will I fix this" kind of message.

I responded by telling him that it was tight but maybe loosened during shipping and offered him the choice of me helping him through fixing it and a $5 refund for his trouble, or the option of returning it for a full refund including the original shipping cost.

He does not want to return it if he has to pay return shipping, and wants at least %50 of the total cost refunded to him with the threat of no positive feedback. (I have over 400 perfect feedback). he also told me that you should never re-wedge a handle, that it is never as good and unsafe to use. He says the only option is to rehang on a new handle. Sigh.

I offered this for sale with Parcel select to keep the shipping cost down, and I can say that there is no reasonable way for me to back these any better. I put a double layer of cardboard around the bit and duct tape that tight, then tightly wrap the whole thing a cardboard to allow no interior movement and wrap the whole thing in a full layer of duct tape. It has never been a problem. I don't think that insurance comes with Parcel Select.

I'm offering a small refund or the option of returning for full refund. I shipped it in good condition and packed it more than reasonably well. If it arrives damaged, what are the reasonable expectations on me? I want a happy buyer, but I don't want to be taken advantage of either. Opinions?

BTW I have asked for pics, I'll post them when I get them.
 
pay for shipping and offer full refund. your time is more valuable than this and not worth the effort at possible poor feedback. In return for offering full refund, ask for positive top notch feedback. This is good in the long run because it shows new customers in the future that if they are not happy they will not get ripped off and be taken care of (ie: trust and integrity) which will only increase sales even more. Turn lemons into lemonade. Its very comforting to new buyers to know that IF their product arrives damaged in anyway that you will take accountability

i have no clue how you shipped it. It is your responsibility to ensure that the item arrives in condition advertised on your Ebay ad.

When someone gives you money for a product it means that they dont have to do anything and take zero accountability until the item is in their possession in proper condition. thats my take on it.

Also, even if a different agreement is reached than what i recommend, always insist on getting that top notch feedback. Always leave the customer feeling as though he/she got a great deal. salesmanship 101.
 
Last edited:
I've found shipping old axes to a dry climate like Arizona from a wet like here in Michigan will loosen heads.

I would want him to send the axe back. When I got it, I would give him a full refund with the return shipping. Chalk up a business loss. I would hesitate to give any refund before I got the axe back, however ebay's policies favor the buyer in these situations.
 
This fellow is taking you for a ride. His suggesting that re-wedging a haft is not a viable option (heck, quite the opposite; this is generally accepted practice, and in this case the perfect solution since the head's already off) entirely red flags the transaction. Bite the bullet, call his bluff and get that head and haft back! There are enough other 'anal orifices' out there that you don't need to humour the devious motives of this one.
I realize that you will take a hit (shipping) but I'll betcha he's too lazy to want to go to the effort of re-packing and re-sending it. Give it another day or two and offer to send him a first class wood wedge or a sack of fence staples and roofing nails, his choice.
 
300Six said:
This fellow is taking you for a ride. His suggesting that re-wedging a haft is not a viable option (heck, quite the opposite; this is generally accepted practice, and in this case the perfect solution since the head's already off) entirely red flags the transaction. Bite the bullet, call his bluff and get that head and haft back! There are enough other 'anal orifices' out there that you don't need to humour the devious motives of this one.
I realize that you will take a hit (shipping) but I'll betcha he's too lazy to want to go to the effort of re-packing and re-sending it. Give it another day or two and offer to send him a first class wood wedge or a sack of fence staples and roofing nails, his choice.
Click to expand...

I don't know if he is being devious, I just think that he has flawed reasoning. If he wants to keep it but get half his money back instead of re-wedging...

Anyway, I am waiting for him to respond with pics before I do anything, but I have already decided to offer to pay the return shipping. If I have to give him $15-20 to keep it, I'd rather pay the $16-17 and I get it back. It's a very nice axe. I'd love to re-wedge it myself and sell it again.
 
He's trying to scam you. This is a common ploy. You've gotten good advice. Call his bluff. Take it back and refund the entire cost plus shipping. This schmuck is gonna ding your ebay rating regardless of what you do.

That's a nice axe. And it's a nice vintage handle. Re-handling that axe would be a waste of good wood. No new handle could match the existing one.
 
I would offer a full refund, including the return shipping, upon receipt. I would also make ebay aware, so they can assist with the return.

n2s
 
jblyttle said:
He wants to keep it but get half his money back instead of re-wedging...
If I have to give him $15-20 to keep it, I'd rather pay the $16-17 and I get it back. It's a very nice axe. I'd love to re-wedge it myself and sell it again.
Click to expand...
Right on laddy! What you've got to find for me is a clean rafting axe (preferably maker stamped and without a haft) and I guarantee you won't get any nickle and dime, quibbling or BS from me.
 
I gotta go with Square Peg here. I bet he's trying to set up a better deal after the fact. He's beating up on your confidence. If you think about it good and hard is there a chance in hell that head came off the haft the way he is "saying" it did? I wonder if you'll even hear from him again after you asked for proof.

Square_peg said:
He's trying to scam you. This is a common ploy. You've gotten good advice. Call his bluff. Take it back and refund the entire cost plus shipping. This schmuck is gonna ding your ebay rating regardless of what you do.

That's a nice axe. And it's a nice vintage handle. Re-handling that axe would be a waste of good wood. No new handle could match the existing one.
Click to expand...
 
I agree with the above. Give him a full refund, cover shipping, then sell it to me!
 
I guess you guys were right. Full message exchange start to finish (to date) for your entertainment.
*****************************************
Buyer- Hi I don't want to leave a negative review. However, I just received the ax today and the head is separate from the handle. This is not how the item was listed. Is there anything you can do about this?

Me- Hi, sorry to hear that there is a problem. Can you clarify? When you say separated from the handle, do you mean that they have come apart, or is it a bit loose? Although these are used axes and the heads sometimes loosen, it was very tight when I listed and shipped it. I always note flaws, and I have one axe listed a few days ago that notes that it is loose. I apologize, but it certainly wasn't intended to be misleading, I'm sure that it just loosened during shipping.

As for what we can do, there are several choices depending on what you want to do. There are many ways to correct the problem, and you should be comfortable with them if you are going to use an axe anyway. Even if you bought a new one you would have to deal with this eventually. If you like, I can walk you through securing the handle. It is easy and straight forward. I would be willing to refund $5 as well for the trouble.

Also, although I do not offer returns, I would be willing to give you that option if you desire. If you want to ship it back, I would refund the purchase price and the shipping cost that you paid for me to get it to you. I will say however, that given the price you paid, that is a very fine axe. I have sold just heads like that without handles at all for close to that price. You may not get a better axe for that price, but the option is entirely yours.

In any case, I do apologize that the axe did not arrive the way that it left, and I'm sorry for any disappointment that you have. As you can see by my feedback, I ship good things and strive to have satisfied buyers. Let me know what you would like and I will work to make sure that you are happy. Thanks again.

Buyer- Thank you for replying. To clarify the head is not loose, the head is separate from the handle. I appreciate the options that you have given to me. I also know how to rehang a head on a handle however, that is not what I purchased. I would have purchased just a head if I wanted to do that. I am sure you are also aware that it is never a good idea to rehang a head on a handle that has come off as it will be more likely to come off and be dangerous during use.

I also appreciate that you have said I purchased a nice quality ax, and I agree with you. However, I don't want to go through the trouble of returning the ax especially as I would loose money sending it back to you because I would have to pay to ship it back; but thank you for offering that to me as a special case. What I would like is a refund fitting the case. I also sell on Ebay and have great reviews, and if this happened to me I would refund 100% right away or at the very least 50%. If $5 dollars is the best you can do, that's fine I'll take it, but I am not going to leave a positive review because of it.

Me- The $5 offer was if you chose to keep it, refund is always an option. However, for the head to be totally off something happened in shipping. Can you send me a picture? I definitely shipped a whole Axe with a tight head. If its off this may be shipping damage. Please send a picture and we will figure it out.

On a side note, I would agree with you that I would not rehang with the same wedge, but rehanging heads on existing handles is common accepted practice. As long at the handle is not damaged, a fresh wooden wedge followed by a metal one is as good as new. I m a member of an enthusiest community and its common.

Any, please let me see what we are looking at. If damaged it might be a case for a claim and you will get a full refund anyway.

Buyer- I do not doubt that you shipped a whole ax. I have attached a picture. As you can see it is nearly completely off, there is maybe a 1/2 in. at best holding it on. I could pound the handle to pull it back on but it's going to be extremely loose and I'll need to get the wedge out. Either way I didn't buy a whole ax just so I could repair it.

Thanks again for being so understanding in the matter. And that is a good idea about a new wedge. Generally for me by the time the head gets loose the handle is pretty worn and is usually just replaced anyway, but if not I will try a new wedge.


Me- Yes I can see that it popped loose. That one had its original wedge and it probably dried out. I would see if you can get it off and put a new one in along with a metal one. I understand that you didn't buy this to repair it, so if you want to send it back I'll cover the return shipping too. Let me know.

Buyer- It's fine, I already said I didn't want to go through the hassle of packing it up and shipping it off. All I asked for was a refund that fits this case, even just the cost of shipping would have been fine. But offering $5 is just insulting. The item arrived damaged and not as described, end of story. We can drop the issue now. I am unsatisfied and this back and forth isn't getting us anywhere. Thank you for your time and consideration.
**********************************

Looks like there was no winning for me on this one.
 
jblyttle said:


Me- Yes I can see that it popped loose. That one had its original wedge and it probably dried out. I would see if you can get it off and put a new one in along with a metal one. I understand that you didn't buy this to repair it, so if you want to send it back I'll cover the return shipping too. Let me know.

Buyer- It's fine, I already said I didn't want to go through the hassle of packing it up and shipping it off. All I asked for was a refund that fits this case, even just the cost of shipping would have been fine. But offering $5 is just insulting. The item arrived damaged and not as described, end of story. We can drop the issue now. I am unsatisfied and this back and forth isn't getting us anywhere. Thank you for your time and consideration.
**********************************

Looks like there was no winning for me on this one.
Click to expand...

You offered to refund the price of the axe and shipping - He doesn't want to "hassle" with returning it. What the buyer wants is to lord over ya with a bad review.

He would like a free axe or to cut his costs in half.
 
People are stupid. From this point on I wouldn't list an axe as "tight" or anything other than "old and used, take it or leave it" because even if it's tight, ya just never know. As a buyer I can look at negative feedback and read the stupidity in the comment, so it wouldn't stop me from buying from you, particularly when you have 400+ 100% positive transactions and one random negative transaction. In fact, that one bad egg makes himself look ignorant to me, which sort of reinforces all the positive feedback by suggesting that even when someone tries to make a problem, there isn't one. Besides, negative feedback goes both ways right? Can't you can leave poor buyer feedback? Can you comment on negative feedback on ebay?
 
cityofthesouth said:
. . .

Besides, negative feedback goes both ways right? Can't you can leave poor buyer feedback? Can you comment on negative feedback on ebay?
Click to expand...

I thought that was case with ebay. If a seller receives negative feedback they can state their position. In this case "Offered buyer full refund including return shipping".

From ebay:

"If you and the buyer can't reach an agreement, you can still tell your side of the story by replying to the Feedback. If the buyer hasn't followed our Feedback policies, you can request that the Feedback be removed."

Not allowed by buyers: "Demanding a partial refund or discount under threat of negative Feedback, low detailed seller ratings, or opening an eBay Money Back Guarantee request or PayPal Purchase Protection case."
 
Last edited:
cityofthesouth said:
People are stupid.
Click to expand...

Hey now, I resemble that!

Anyways ... in recently having to deal with a bad seller (I think*), I would also call ebay, explain the situation, and see if they can't offer to step in or remove the bad rating. Unfortunately a seller can't give a buyer bad feedback nowadays.

J - as a buyer of one of your auctions - a hatchet that included an old handle - the item arrived AWESOMELY packaged and JUST as described. Don't let this wear on your ego - you're a great and ethical seller and even if his bad feedback shows up your good feedback will overshadow it.

*bad seller - charged huge unwarranted shipping fees for a hatchet head once the auction ended (shipping charges showed as location specific). I asked him to reduce to a flat fee box but he would never communicate with me. I even got ebay involved. I can't figure out what happened, but he ended up shipping me the hatchet head without having been paid, leaving me good feedback, and although I tried to send him money, he would never send a new invoice. I guess we're good?!?!
 
So I have my first negative feedback. Based on what you know about what happened, how do you like this gem?

"Item arrived broken, would not refund even the shipping cost. Terrible!"

Good info for anyone else that sells on eBay, you can report a buyer that violates eBay policies. One of those policies is leaving abusive or dishonest feedback, and another is and I quote "Demanding a partial refund or discount under threat of negative Feedback, low detailed seller ratings, or opening an eBay Money Back Guarantee request or PayPal Purchase Protection case." There is a system in place for having eBay remove unwarranted feedback, you submit a form detailing why and they will make a decision. My form content was this-

"This feedback is a complete lie. The item did arrive damaged (but easily fixable). I offered a complete refund including return shipping. The buyer did not want this and would only be satisfied by being able to keep the item and getting at least half of his money back. The item was packaged as well as reasonably possible, and I could not have offered more than a full refund and pay for the cost of return shipping. What more could be expected? I was also helpful, apologetic and respectful in our communications. The feedback left in this case is malicious, abusing and completely dishonest.

My feeling is that this buyer was attempting to leverage me for an unfair return of funds without having to return the item, and was angry when I took that option away by offering to take it back for a full refund including both initial and return shipping. My feedback up until this point is a true reflection of my service to my buyers, and if I ever truly earn a bad mark I will accept it, but I in no way earned one here.

I don't know if you have access to our messages to each other regarding this matter, but I can provide all of them to you to back up my position. Thank you for looking into this matter."

Anyway, not the biggest deal in the world, but you do have recourse and I am confident that this will end correctly. It's one thing to have a difference of opinion, it is another to completely lie because you are an angry child.
 
That's too bad and totally unfair it ended like that. I've seen some of your axes on ebay since you have the same user name and I think your prices and shipping costs are fair and reasonable. I've bid on a couple and will continue. Don't let it get you down. Some people just are unreasonable.
 
I expected it would end like this. Be patient and see how ebay handles it. Paypal can hold up your receipt of payment based on negative feedback. I hope that doesn't happen to you.
 
I would bet it didn't arrive in the condition in the picture either. More likely he used it a few times and that was enough to get it moving which anyone buying an old axe with an unknown age handle should have expected. I would think ebay has a vested interest in protecting both the seller and buyer and your communication with the buyer should be enough to show ebay that his comment is dishonest.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top