I am not a knife snob

tonycap said:
like the guy who made all those knives with his cad milling machine--wtf is that. its not knife making-its not art.
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If a person is making knives, then they are involved in KNIFEMAKING.
Simple as that.
 
well let me start off by saying ive had 4 knives ive tried really hard to make. they came out like crap. im so frustrated and i guess i really fouled things up with this thread. Im sorry. I been following the forums tutorials and its hard.i wish i had the money for a real grinder and could learn how to do a stick tangg.some of the cooments i made were ungentlemanly. I apologize again. im a hot head and yes i have trouble with wanting instant gratification. i went about this in a really unclassy way. again please accept my apology. TONY--i didnt mean the whole walmart thing
 
"Originally Posted by tonycap
like the guy who made all those knives with his cad milling machine--wtf is that. its not knife making-its not art.


stabman said:
If a person is making knives, then they are involved in KNIFEMAKING.
Simple as that.
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I'm pretty sure he is probably talking about me.

People come into this with different personal histories and experiences and different approaches to their art. I like to think that the art in my work is present in the finished work regardless of my approach to it.

I always figured a dentist might make a really good engraver.

I'm a machinist and a product designer. I design in a computer and using milling machines as a regular part of my normal day. I think it is really cool when folks can tap their existing abilities, regardless of how ill suited they may be, and create works they care about with their own skills. If I come across as "full of myself", well, I probably am. I am proud of the things I have created and would never describe my efforts as "crap". And I feel bad for anyone who feels that way about their works.

Some people in this world try to achieve excellence in their work and other people want little more than cheap entertainment.

I'm sorry if something I did, or my approach to knifemakeing made you feel bad, but I'll wager the issue is more in your head than anything I've done.
 
David Stifle said:
well Heck, Saint, I'm not trolling. Thought he was serious, howbeit misguided. I'm always ready to give a guy a break, but he does seem too aggressive, too manipulating. Too bad. So much a serious(and that includes primative), knive-makers can learn here.

Dave
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Dave, et al. - sorry if I was unclear in my post, I intended it to mean that the original poster, Tony, was sounding a bit like a troll in the last couple posts. That being said, I see that he posted again and shared his frustration on his first knives and the tooling required. So, I wish to concede that I may have been mistaken about his intentions in the thread.

Tony - have you considered trying to contact a local maker? Sometimes just one weekend in a shop can help. You don't need a fancy grinder, but my personal opinion is that you're spinning your wheels unless you're using a good file or a good grinder. $30 - $50 will get you all of the files you need to cut out a knife, a lot less than even a cheap belt grinder.
 
tonycap, I started not knowing the first thing about knifemaking and have learned a great deal just here on this forum. In my line of work we try to get guys a little wet behind the years, cause the ones that have a little bit of experience think they know it all. Don't be one of those guys. I made my first knife out of some steel with files and sand paper. It sucked and it looked like crap, I was like what the heck am I doing, but I kept at it and I have learned alot.

-frank
 
Also, for what it's worth, I've seen some of Nathan's work and spoke with him. It's pretty cool stuff and a pretty cool guy making it.
 
I am a noob as well. I understand the frustration, but I realize that much of the frustration comes from no other source than me. These folks can provide all the help you need if you have the right attitude, but they can't make miracles. You are the one that has to make it happen at the end of the day. BTW the Walmart comment was beyond the pale. Just sayin.:D
 
tonycap said:
well let me start off by saying ive had 4 knives ive tried really hard to make. they came out like crap. im so frustrated and i guess i really fouled things up with this thread. Im sorry. I been following the forums tutorials and its hard.i wish i had the money for a real grinder and could learn how to do a stick tangg.some of the cooments i made were ungentlemanly. I apologize again. im a hot head and yes i have trouble with wanting instant gratification. i went about this in a really unclassy way. again please accept my apology. TONY--i didnt mean the whole walmart thing
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There is a lot of help (and sometimes materials) here offered for nothing but the asking...for those who are honest and sincerely wish to learn.

Best of luck on your next knives! Very few makers were satisfied with their first attempts. I know I sure was not and I am still learning, and will continue to do so until the day I die.

-Todd
 
Tony, I am a full time maker and still struggle on some of the procedures and wish I had better machines and tools. My first knives looked like crap and didnt have the right heat treatment either. I didnt have the internet to help me solve my problems. These guys are humble people, If we appear full of our selves its because we are among brothers. We all need constant encouragement believe it or not. I wish I was made smarter instead of so good looking.
 
tonycap said:
again please accept my apology. TONY--i didnt mean the whole walmart thing
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Apology accepted. Take a deep breath and have a cool drink before posting in frustration or anger.

It may help if you shape a few wooden paint sticks before working on steel again. This may sound silly, but it can help you learn about the geometry involved. Hang in there, everybody started somewhere, and no one is born knowing this stuff!

What exactly about your first attempts, are you dissatisfied with? Pics always help.
 
James_Terrio said:
everybody started somewhere, and no one is born knowing this stuff!
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Except Me! . . . :foot::eek::D j/k It can be frustrating to say the least, Tony. but hang in there make some toy wooden knives and hand em out to needy neighborhood kids... you'll get much needed practice and make a kewl toy for a kid who might need it.

Jason
 
Tony, there are a few knife makers around Tall, FL that get together regularly. They are part of the Florida Blacksmith Association and used to meet in Monocella (spl?) at Ray Roberts' shop but he has pasted. I think they meet in Havana now and possibly a few other shop locations. Good group of guys! Check em out!
 
tonycap said:
well let me start off by saying ive had 4 knives ive tried really hard to make. they came out like crap. im so frustrated and i guess i really fouled things up with this thread. Im sorry. I been following the forums tutorials and its hard.i wish i had the money for a real grinder and could learn how to do a stick tangg.some of the cooments i made were ungentlemanly. I apologize again. im a hot head and yes i have trouble with wanting instant gratification. i went about this in a really unclassy way. again please accept my apology. TONY--i didnt mean the whole walmart thing
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Well... most of that probably should have been in your second post to this thread, but it's a solid step in the right direction. I've only been making knives for about two years and I'm still very much an amature at this. I started with basic hand tools and known steel. Many of my first attempts ended up in the bucket for various reasons. Seven of my first 10 knives were never completed. Last fall, my girlfriend expressed an interest in knifemaking. When it came time to work the bevels, she became very frustrated and was probably considering giving up. I dug out some of those old bucket knives and showed them to her. I think it helped her realize that this is something you grow with, and if you keep at it, you will get better. People here are more than willing to help if you allow them to. I can not think of any better source of information on the subject. If you decide to stick with it, be humble, accept the possibility of failure and strive to do better each time.
 
Nathan, anyone who says you are not making aart is a nut. I love your knives and your dagger is absolutely killer. I don't care how you remove the metal from a billet to make it into a knife. It is the finished product that counts. You must understand the steel, the wood, the assembly , the finish.
 
ok for the record i am not a dentist but was a dental hygienist. i changed jobs a few times but now ive been accepted into university of georgia in athens. Marekz maybe i can come by and watch you do some knives. thank you for the encouragement-BR-TONY
 
also i havent the funds to buy good material yet and its frustrating. im hoping to save up some cash for some steel and handle material as well as a drill-TONY
 
tonycap said:
well let me start off by saying ive had 4 knives ive tried really hard to make. they came out like crap. im so frustrated and i guess i really fouled things up with this thread. Im sorry. I been following the forums tutorials and its hard.i wish i had the money for a real grinder and could learn how to do a stick tangg.some of the cooments i made were ungentlemanly. I apologize again. im a hot head and yes i have trouble with wanting instant gratification. i went about this in a really unclassy way. again please accept my apology. TONY--i didnt mean the whole walmart thing
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Thanks for coming back and setting the record straight Tony. It takes a big man to admit when he's let frustration get the better of him. The best thing you can do is find the group Don posted about and go to a meeting ready to learn.

Now, speaking as a guy who has taught a lot of folks at my blacksmith guild meetings and knifemaking classes, let me give you a few bits of advice. First off, don't expect to jump right into knife blades. You will probably be taught to make hooks, basic firetending tools, etc. It's not just because they only like to show you how to do general blacksmithing. These basic projects teach you how to tend a fire, basic forging operations (drawing, upsetting, twisting, etc), hammer control, and other little things that will help your knifemaking. Trust me, there's nothing more frustrating than forging out a blade only to ruin it in grinding because that ONE hammer mark won't come out. Work on your hammer control first and you won't have that kind of issue.

Also, be ready for the fact that not every blacksmith is going to want to show you how to make knives. Some guys just aren't into it. That's OK, just remember that EVERYBODY has something they can teach you. Odds are there is a guy there who will show you some bits about knifemaking, every blacksmith guild has at least one of us ;)

Oh, and try to keep your initial knifemaking projects on the small side. I know that the urge to make a giant chopper or sword is strong, but if you concentrate your efforts initially on a small piece, you have less to worry about and you're more likely to have success.

If you're ever going to be in the MD/PA area, let me know. You're more than welcome to come up for a day and I'll show you what little I know.

-d

P.S. Tonycap, send me a PM with your address and I'll send you some good known steel to start with. I can't help you with tools, but I've got some nice bits of steel laying around here I'm happy to share.
 
Here's a quote from an interveiw I did on another forum, is an answer to a question.

The single most important thing a new maker can do, is make 100 simple using knives. Test them, sell them, give them away and get feed back on how they work. After 100 simple knives, a maker should have a good handle on heat treating, grinding and fit / finish. I see too many new makers trying to doing embellishment and using high-end materials before they know how to make a good knife.
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