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I just don’t understand!

Discussion in 'General Knife Discussion' started by vwb563, Nov 27, 2020.

  1. vwb563

    vwb563 Gold Member Gold Member

    Jun 29, 2007
    Why do companies like Kershaw keep using cheaper and cheaper steels. This morning as I was looking at some of the Black Friday specials at one of the online retailers sites I saw a Kershaw that caught my eye. I really liked what I saw as far as design goes. It was called the Airlock I believe but as soon as I started looking at the knife’s specs I quickly became disappointed when I saw the blade steel. It had a 4Cr14 stainless blade! I mean really??? I’m not the greatest fan of 8Cr but I will usually not let that stop me from buying a knife if I like the design well enough but now they’re using 4Cr stainless! I think I’ll pass Kershaw. Anyone know what 4Cr14 stainless is equivalent to? 420J2 maybe or something worse?
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2020
    Ben Dover, Smaug, Chronovore and 2 others like this.
  2. spoonrobot

    spoonrobot

    May 1, 2004
    Accelerating race to the bottom. Companies will stress test ideas to meet lower price points or cost targets, 4cr14 is one of those ideas. If it doesn't effect sales, expect to see it in more products.
     
    jstrange, Smaug, XL883N and 2 others like this.
  3. abcdef

    abcdef

    Oct 28, 2005
    Curiosity aside, does anyone care?
     
    Bigbobg, NorthernSouthpaw and vwb563 like this.
  4. comis

    comis Gold Member Gold Member

    939
    May 17, 2013
    Kinda curious whether that's targeted to non-enthusiasts, where most probably would only care about whether the steel will not rust and easy to sharpen?
     
    Lesknife likes this.
  5. Lesknife

    Lesknife Platinum Member Platinum Member

    Mar 31, 2018
    Now a days a lot of people are more interested in looks, shapes, name brand or gimmicks rather than performance or function. Never mind knives were made for cutting or slicing. It’s become an accessory fashion statement for some kinda like their clothes or jewelry and makers are willing to satisfy their wants.
     
  6. Yo Mama

    Yo Mama

    Sep 25, 2011
    I think I see another reason Civivi is taking the share of the market that Kershaw used to inhabit.
     
  7. skyhorse

    skyhorse Gold Member Gold Member

    Jan 30, 2010
    You nailed it in this category of knives. I believe they are targeting customers that likely don't even sharpen their own knives if at all.
     
    mwhich50 and Lesknife like this.
  8. skyhorse

    skyhorse Gold Member Gold Member

    Jan 30, 2010
    I think what we are seeing lately is Chinese companies cutting out the middleman. It's not just knives either.
     
    Lesknife, Zulus and mdrgn79 like this.
  9. dirc

    dirc

    Jan 31, 2018
    I've posted all the junk from kershaw... it's here:

    https://www.bladeforums.com/threads...8600-model-4cr14.1638507/page-3#post-18735271

    knifecenter carries them all...

    they list these models as 3cr13:
    1306BW Filter
    1301BW Starter

    4cr13 or 4cr14:
    1319 Grinder
    1365 Misdirect
    1324 Cathode
    8600 Portal

    and mystery 'stainless steel' models
    1338
    1318

    Personally, I'll stay away from all of the above, Kershaw does sell 8cr13 blades in the injections and many other low cost models which are a great value


    vote with your wallet, 3cr13 and 4cr13 only belongs in the handle/liner... NEVER a blade
     
  10. vwb563

    vwb563 Gold Member Gold Member

    Jun 29, 2007
    That’s exactly what I did. As soon as I saw the blade steel I totally lost interest.
     
    mdrgn79 likes this.
  11. unwisefool

    unwisefool Gold Member Gold Member

    Jan 22, 2007
    New blur with m4 if you want an upscale blade steel
     
  12. Billy The Hungry

    Billy The Hungry

    527
    Aug 11, 2020
    I had a Kershaw Filter. It was a damn good knife. I could get it shaving hair effortlessly, easily. It would not hold an edge long at all. However, it did better than my Spyderco Tenacious with 8CR13MoV. That knife would not get sharp, or keep an edge.

    Easy to sharpen steels is great for non knife people. Kershaw caters to both non knife people, and also enthusiasts.

    I am not defending Kershaw, or the steel in question. I am only stating my own personal experiences.

    The Filter was the knife that got me into seriously collecting knives.
     
    Hal, zomik and willc like this.
  13. colin.p

    colin.p

    Feb 4, 2017
    Hopefully it doesn't become a pandemic:

    Buck Kingsman Folding Knife

    FEATURES
    • Buck Kingsman Folding Knife is a durable work knife for a variety of tasks
    • Features a ***3CR13*** steel blade and nylon glass fiber handle
    • Drop point, satin finish on blade
    • Pocket clip and liner lock
    • Blade Length: 2.75” (6.98 cm)
     
  14. herisson

    herisson Apple slicing rocking chair dweller Platinum Member

    Mar 11, 2013
    This is not really true. 3Cr13 makes for very usable blades... in the kitchen : you appreciate the ease of sharpening (a stone or kitchen steel is always at hand, anyway), the high stainlessness and the low buying price. All good things in that context. I admit I would not be excited by this steel in a pocket knife (a stone is not always available and you'd appreciate not having to sharpen in the middle of a task). This said, if I really like the knife, I'd still buy it because my pocket knife uses are mild. Context.
     
    evilgreg and Billy The Hungry like this.
  15. knarfeng

    knarfeng senex morosus moderator Staff Member Super Mod Moderator

    Jul 30, 2006
    4Cr14 is equivalent to 420HC.

    3Cr14 is equivalent to 420J2.

    So Kershaw has some knives in 420HC. Lotta outfits do.
     
  16. craytab

    craytab Gold Member Gold Member

    Jan 26, 2012
    Every year, around this time, we see big brands like Kershaw, put their budget blades with low end materials on sale, often in gift packs. Wonder why that is?

    Kershaw has been selling budget knives with low end steel for cheap longer than most of us have been members here. Civivi wishes they could have a 10th of the profit Kershaw, or buck, or Gerber, or crkt, etc will make selling knives in big box stores this Holliday season, 4cr steel or no.

    The sky is not falling chicken little...
     
  17. DocJD

    DocJD

    Jan 29, 2016
  18. 000Robert

    000Robert Gold Member Gold Member

    Mar 28, 2020
    I googled it and a website said that it's similar to T5MoV steel - used mostly in cutlery and scissors.
     
  19. MarkN86

    MarkN86

    506
    Sep 3, 2012
    Like many others, I thought that the 3cr13 blades were going to be abysmal and I questioned why anyone would ever bother with it in a knife. I have a friend had one with a broken tip, so I had the opportunity to work with it. I ground the spine down to a nice looking clip point and sharpened it up, I wouldn't put it in any edge holding contests but it was usable for every day stuff.

    Frank's comparisons above are pretty accurate, there are minor differences but heat treatment makes a bigger difference than traces of steel. Unfortunately there's only so much you can do with a small amount of carbon, and when saving money is the name of the game you aren't likely to get a world class heat treatment.

    Overall, great steel for a non knife person who has a tendency to break a tip, chip an edge, or otherwise ruin something more valuable. Once you learn which end of a knife to cut with you're better off moving up to something better.
     
  20. vwb563

    vwb563 Gold Member Gold Member

    Jun 29, 2007
    I was under the impression that 8Cr was the equivalent to 420HC. Maybe I’m misinformed.
     

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