Idealism and Survivalism

[lmalterna]

It seems really strange to me to defend McCandles actions but hear me out.

We here focus on "SURVIVAL"- how to get ourselves out of a jam alive. Why should we assume this should have been his focus as well? I am independent as hell. Many people would think me nuts for spending the night in a debri shelter boiling my water in a tin and going hungry. I do it to have the self confidence that I can get by if need be. It is MY experience and I do not care if others understand.
He did not have to live the way he did, he did it because he chose the life for himself. It was HIS choice and only HIS choice. He should not be held responsible for how the media may have romanticized him, nor should he be held responsible for anyone that mimics his actions.
His focus was to experience life the way he felt fullest. He died doing that- following a "personal" choice. He never wanted to be a poster child for survival living and should not be "dissed" for hic choices. Now Bear Gryhlls on the other hand...

If a lightning strike hits me in my debri hut, will I be cursed a fool for not having been in an RV??

2Door

 

[AfterTFD]

If a lightning strike hits me in my debri hut, will I be cursed a fool for not having been in an RV??

Probably, at least by some people.


There's a big difference between taking reasonable risks and just not having any idea what you're doing. There's nothing wrong with spending the night in a debris shelter. Charging around unprepared through the Alaskan wilderness is far lower than that on the common sense scale.

 

[Ravaillac]

Well, while he was alive he did not make anything public. He worked to pay his expenses. He only killed himself, without putting SAR teams at risk since no one knew where he was.

Now, what people did with his story is a different problem.

 

[batosai117]

If a lightning strike hits me in my debri hut, will I be cursed a fool for not having been in an RV??

2Door

LMAO....and if you had died from dehydration people would say,"he should have boiled his water even longer so he wouldn't have gotten the shits for so long, that's what killed him, arogant fool, didn't know what he was getting himself into." .

 

[blazink]

There's some great discussion here. I tend to be a defender of McCandless but I can usually understand his detractors' point of view. I admire (for lack of a better word) someone like McCandless more than some "keyboard survivalist" with the perfect plan left unfulfilled.

I won't respond to all the posts that I feel I could, but these two really touched a nerve.

"but they were both admirable for chasing their dreams. "

So following your dream is admirable, no matter what it is? John Wayne Gacy seems to have followed his dreams too...

You make a good point and I couldn't agree more.

Josif Stalin followed his dreams, too. And this one guy named Adolf.

Chasing one's dream is only admirable when the dream is of lofty morals, when the dream is reasonable and at least remotely possible. There are many dreams the chasing of which would be nothing short of despicable. Some dreams are simply stupid.

:jerkit: What tripe! "Following your dreams" is an act in itself, almost entirely seperate from the actions required to fulfill those dreams. And "lofty morals" are impossible to guage, everyone has their own morals. I'm sure StallinHitlerGacyBundyHusseinMao didn't see himself as immoral or unreasonable and their planswishesdreams where just as possible as many who are called heros.

Anyway, thanks for all the responses. Discussion is a good thing. I would much rather have an inteligent disagreement than the lip service of a fool.

 

[Liam Ryan]

Arrogant comes from the instances when he ignored advice from those who knew better. I also like how he tossed his family aside.

Hitchhiking from my understanding is not nearly as dangerous as we're lead to believe. I know several people who've done it, cross country even.

Oh, didn't know that.



I will say the "journey" was not all that unique, from my opinion, which is not to say I don't enjoy the story. However, his trip into the wilderness was still reckless, no matter how romantic, and his death could've been avoided.

So could lots of deaths, MANY deaths. Plain and simple, I think he was a really interesting guy, and a lot less wreckless then someone who jumps over 30 busses with a motorcycle, in front of millions of people and much fanfare I might add.

It's not even relevant to compare him to Dick Proenneke. Dick Proenneke was prepared, skilled, and familiar with the harsh terrain he was going to live in. He did not just wander into the woods believing it would sustain him like McCandles.

If you want to re read my post, I never compared him to Dick Proenneke, only that they both had the same idea, leaving to live in the wilds alone.
As far as his specific cause of death....it's worthless to debate what-if's concerning that. Yes, what if he didn't eat those berries but... What if he'd never found the bus? What if he broke his leg a few miles from the road? What if he got frostbitten feet from the inadequate footwear? ....see where I'm going?
Say you are out hiking, What if You'd gotten lost? What if You'd broke your leg a few miles from the road? What if you got frostbitten feet from the inadequate footwear? ....see where I'm going?

He took a phenomenal risk by going out there unprepared, thought he knew better than everyone else, and got what the odds called.

Did he think he knew better then anyone? You seem to be making this guy look much worse then he was to try and get your point across. Am I trying to make him look better? I don't think so, he just did something he thought he had to do.

 

[runningboar]

blazink,
I think I see your point, I have a sneaking suspicion that a lot of what you read about survival and woodscraft on the world wide web is written by people that spend less than 3 days a year sleeping some place besides their bed. Another huge percentage is written by people that hike the back lot, or well maintained trails with a pack full of the latest gear and enough freeze died yuppy food for a month. It is real hard to seperate the wheat from the chaff and real easy to look at someone like McCandless and say "Wow he really went for it and it is a shame it ended the way it did".

If Chris would have had a map and compass, told loved ones his plan and had some way to communicate, if nothing but prearranged flags for overflying planes, I would be agreeing with you. That is not the case, he was a very idealistic city boy that would not listen to people that have "Been there and done that" and it got him killed.

On a survival/preparedness oriented site Chris McCandless is the perfect example of what not to do. Chris

 

[Liam Ryan]

Runningboar, I believe Chris was a bit more then a little loopy, though this may be even less of a reason to defend his actions, it can also be a reason to defend them.
He could have just commited suicide and it would have been another statistic, Instead he decided to discover truth and fufill his ideals, and changed a lot of lives along the way.
I wish he had learned to survive better, and that he was still alive in the woods or even back with his family by now and that I had never heard of him.