I'm new here...why does every fixed blade knife have to be a star at batoning?

Arathol said:
How so?
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For starters, there isn't always a perfect stump out there waiting to be utilized for laying the wood horizontally to do the "split and twist", which means vertically splitting kindling with your hatchet. I've never warmed up to the whole thing to holding the wood steady with a split of the wood, so I usually just hold it by hand... which from my experience makes it more dangerous.

Again, for me personally... batoning is easier, safer, quicker and more controllable. Wood is held steady by the same knife that splits it. To each his own :)
 
SwissHeritageCo said:
For starters, there isn't always a perfect stump out there waiting to be utilized
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Not trying to convince you to use a hatchet. If you prefer a knife, that is fine.

However, I just want to say that you don't need a perfect stump to make firewood with a hatchet. A log, or another piece of wood, will do.
Nor do you need squarely sawn pieces of wood to split.
Just want to point these things out, because they get repeated as reason to avoid using an ax.
 
dogstar said:
Not trying to convince you to use a hatchet. If you prefer a knife, that is fine.

However, I just want to say that you don't need a perfect stump to make firewood with a hatchet. A log, or another piece of wood, will do.
Nor do you need squarely sawn pieces of wood to split.
Just want to point these things out, because they get repeated as reason to avoid using an ax.
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I love my axes and hatchets, but when I'm trying to start a fire in semi-damp conditions (which is often when I go out) or fill my stove, I'm going to need a fair bit of finely cut kindling. The accuracy of a knife and baton serves this purpose best for me. I'm not trying to discourage anyone from using an axe, any real splitting is going to require an axe and I would agree that you do not need a "perfect stump".

There is no one tool option, everyone is different. I have very specific purposes for my current preference to batoning.
 
Sometimes beer is consumed. Batoning with a blade the right size for the material and nice leather gloves has always been safe. My brother in law proved that to me with his thumb and trusty hatchet. No he didn't loose it but it sure did bleed.

Baton responsibly my friends.
 
I just can't understand why anyone can't see that they don't have to wildly swing a hatchet or axe to split kindling or swing a hatchet at all to do the job, when gravity is your friend. Refighting the Battle of Stamford bridge isn't required to split wood. If you're doing it right with an axe, you're more likely to hurt yourself swinging a mallet or piece of wood at the back of the knife and hit yourself in the hand. In any case some people shouldn't be practicing this for the first time in remote locations, far from the emergency room: axe or knife.

I don't know if there's anyone else out there who shows how to use axes in the bush quite as straight forward as Ray Mears does in this video. I'm sure that somewhere down in the bowels of the comments is some whack-a-doodle demanding to know why he isn't wearing safety goggles when using an axe...


This guy has some mad skills, and also has videos working with knives and saws:

 
That's some pretty easy wood to split in Ray's video. That method does not work very well with the very stringy and tough Mesquite we cook with often.

I used to use a hatchet but it's just not as effective as using a big, thick chopping knife. You have to strike very hard, and the wood does not want to separate.

I actually learned the batoning method from the locals here years ago, who use large blades to split firewood to cook or make fires with.

I am by no means saying a hatchet is not effective, it's just much safer to baton in my neck of the woods.
 
SwissHeritageCo said:
For starters, there isn't always a perfect stump out there waiting to be utilized for laying the wood horizontally to do the "split and twist", which means vertically splitting kindling with your hatchet. I've never warmed up to the whole thing to holding the wood steady with a split of the wood, so I usually just hold it by hand... which from my experience makes it more dangerous.

Again, for me personally... batoning is easier, safer, quicker and more controllable. Wood is held steady by the same knife that splits it. To each his own :)
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The Grendels said:
I just can't understand why anyone can't see that they don't have to wildly swing a hatchet or axe to split kindling or swing a hatchet at all to do the job, when gravity is your friend. Refighting the Battle of Stamford bridge isn't required to split wood. If you're doing it right with an axe, you're more likely to hurt yourself swinging a mallet or piece of wood at the back of the knife and hit yourself in the hand. In any case some people shouldn't be practicing this for the first time in remote locations, far from the emergency room: axe or knife.
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You don't have to wildly swing an axe or hatchet any more than you need to wildly swing a knife to split kindling. In fact, you don't need to swing it at all.....
 
Arathol said:
You don't have to wildly swing an axe or hatchet any more than you need to wildly swing a knife to split kindling. In fact, you don't need to swing it at all.....
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I mean you can baton with a knife without using a mallet or log as a hammer to hit your hand with, but it's not typically how it's done. There tends to be an object being swung. The longer handle of an axe allows you to use gravity more as a friend.
 
The Grendels said:
I mean you can baton with a knife without using a mallet or log as a hammer to hit your hand with, but it's not typically how it's done. There tends to be an object being swung. The longer handle of an axe allows you to use gravity more as a friend.
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I fully understand the concept of batoning, but the point is you don't need to swing a hatchet to make it work. Some people just can't think outside the box, and can't seem associate a hatchet with anything but swinging it to chop a piece of wood. If you can't manage to split something by swinging a hatchet, its pretty easy just to set it on top of the piece and baton it as you would a knife. Its just as easy and just as safe.....
Also, you don't need a huge axe or hatchet either......
I've had this GB for years, got it when they were first introduced. I find it works very well for many things as long as you keep it good and sharp.
MWq9Abs.jpg
 
I've never batoned wood. I was taught to use the right tool for the job. But it is nice to have a knife that can handle the job should it ever be necessary for me to baton some wood.
 
Arathol said:
I fully understand the concept of batoning, but the point is you don't need to swing a hatchet to make it work. Some people just can't think outside the box, and can't seem associate a hatchet with anything but swinging it to chop a piece of wood. If you can't manage to split something by swinging a hatchet, its pretty easy just to set it on top of the piece and baton it as you would a knife. Its just as easy and just as safe.....
Also, you don't need a huge axe or hatchet either......
I've had this GB for years, got it when they were first introduced. I find it works very well for many things as long as you keep it good and sharp.
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I actually said you don't need to swing a hatchet to make kindling. I've never needed to do so for kindling. A simple, very short, controlled, bump drop is all that is required with a hatchet.

The Grendels said:
I just can't understand why anyone can't see that they don't have to wildly swing a hatchet or axe to split kindling or swing a hatchet at all to do the job, when gravity is your friend.
Click to expand...
 
MolokaiRider said:
That's some pretty easy wood to split in Ray's video. That method does not work very well with the very stringy and tough Mesquite we cook with often.

I used to use a hatchet but it's just not as effective as using a big, thick chopping knife. You have to strike very hard, and the wood does not want to separate.

I actually learned the batoning method from the locals here years ago, who use large blades to split firewood to cook or make fires with.

I am by no means saying a hatchet is not effective, it's just much safer to baton in my neck of the woods.
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Excellent point, mostly oak around here.
 
afishhunter said:
There always seemed to be enough dry to rotting deadfall for firewood. I don't recall ever having to split the firewood when camping.
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Therefore, NOBODY needs to split firewood????

Just because you haven’t done something is not a reason it shouldn’t be done.

Just because you haven’t needed something, doesn’t mean that others might not need it.

afishhunter said:
using nothing but a folding knife, as small as 2 7/8 inches closed, proving beyond a shadow of a doubt the old adage: "Finesse beats brute strength. Finesse is also easier on you tools/equipment, and you", and that a fixed blade is not necessary for survival, IF you have the knowledge and skill set.
So, yes. The gentlemen you mention are mistaken.
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Come on… Really?

You can say that about literally any piece of gear - right up until you DO need that thing because of the ENVIRONMENT that you’re in.

With the right “knowledge and skill set”, you don’t need ANY gear to survive, IF you happen to be surviving in a tropical paradise.

A fixed blade MIGHT be required for survival however, regardless of how smart and skilled you are, depending on your SPECIFIC SITUATION.

Just like a firearm might be required, or heavy clothing might be required.

Maybe those “mistaken” gentlemen just traveled to more diverse environments than you…
 
scdub said:
Therefore, NOBODY needs to split firewood????

Just because you haven’t done something is not a reason it shouldn’t be done.

Just because you haven’t needed something, doesn’t mean that others might not need it.
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Are you surprised? This entire thread is people using the fallacious argument from ignorance (not calling them ignorant, that is the actual name of the logical fallacy). It basically goes, if I haven't found a use for something that use doesn't exist.

Additionally no actual metric has been set for what the users doing and where they are doing it. Someone who has 20 miles a day to trek isn't going to be carrying the same gear as someone setting up a weeks camp an hour from the car.
 
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