importance of locks

Cliff, my full tang fixed blade is in no way more likely to "close" on my hand than any folder ever made all time period.

It will not close on my hand. It cannot. It is a fixed blade. Period. Nothing to close. It can break. It cannot close on my hand.

I'm ready to spine whack my fixed blade and we can compare notes to whatever folder you choose to put against my CRKT STIFF KISS. Then we can do the torque test, etc.

Has anyone here ever had a fixed blade's "lock" break and close on your hand?

Am I the only one that finds this a strange debate?
 
That's a pretty top drawer responce from Sal.

Bet it makes all you spydie fans, warm all over knowing theres that much care given, it does me.

Thanks

WR
 
Them fellers from the University of Alabama don't like 'locks' on knives. They can't seem to find the keys to 'unlock' 'em with.:p War Eagle!
 
I have lived in 5 states so far in my life. I cannot speak for every state but I have reviewed the laws of the ones I have lived in and the one I currently live in to be sure just before posting this.

The argument that you can't carry a fixed blade is really irrelevant for any of the states I've lived in. It is not a crime to carry a fixed blade in any of the states I've lived in unless the blade length is above that of the legal limit for that particular state. There is no distinction in the laws for a folder or fixed blade at least not where I have lived. The only exception would be where it is clearly written that carrying a "Bowie knife" is illegal. Other than this the law clearly defines what is legal and what is defined as illegal such as a dirk or double edged knife or switch blade or cane club or knife, brass knuckles and whatever else. No where did I see mention of a fixed blade or folder distinction. Intent is mentioned many times; for example, it is not illegal in Illinois or Tenn. to carry a hunting knife but if you do so with illegal intent then it is. Carrying a dirk or double edged blade is illegal in most states whether it is a fixed blade or a folder. Bascially, if you can carry a Buck 110 on your belt you can just as easily elect to carry a fixed blade there instead so long as it is one that is within the maximum limit for blade length; at least in any of the states I've been a resident in.

I think people just generally like folders more because they are more convenient and more 'sheeple' friendly or politically correct but little of that choice would be because they 'can't' carry a fixed blade. They simply don't want to would be my guess or there is more to choose from in the blade length limits with folders perhaps but really I have to wonder about that.

I do a lot of work for forum members and have noted on more than one occassion when I recieved a knife to work on from out of state that their everyday carry folder exceeded the legal limit for blade length in their home state. I wonder sometimes if they know or not. Sometimes I ask them about it. I find it interesting that many don't want to carry a fixed blade because of "the law" but apparently many others don't hesitate to carry a folder that has a longer blade than is legal.
 
STR, california prohibits fixed blades of ANY length, and has no length restrictions on folders.
 
Runtime. California is of little interest to me personally but I did review the laws there after reading your post and if it is illegal to carry a fixed blade of any kind or length there I do not see it in writing.

Some major cities have their own city wide ordinances but Los Angeles is on line and there is nothing there that I see that indicated to me that a fixed blade is illegal there. All I did find was this section:

"A nonlocking folding knife, a folding knife that is not
prohibited by Section 653k, or a pocketknife is capable of ready use
as a stabbing weapon that may inflict great bodily injury or death
only if the blade of the knife is exposed and locked into position.
(24)(d) Knives carried in sheaths which are worn openly suspended from
the waist of the wearer are not concealed within the meaning of this
section."


Key words to me here are 'if the blade is exposed' meaning if it is sheathed it is not illegal.
But even (24)(d) is not specific to a fixed blade as a folder can still be carried in a sheath.

For more you can see the California statute where I reviewed it here; http://pweb.netcom.com/~brlevine/ca.txt

If you can show me where it says in writing that fixed blades are illegal there regardless of length I'd like to see it and the statute number it is listed under.

Don't get me wrong. I'm not an attorney or one to take quotes from on the law. Just passing on what I understand. But I'd be curious to see the law you speak of just to see it. I can't say I looked over the CAL laws with great focus or time spent so it is possible I missed it but scanning over it I didn't see anything indicating that a fixed blade is illegal there.
 
runT1ME said:
STR, california prohibits fixed blades of ANY length, and has no length restrictions on folders.
Click to expand...

This is true for concealed carry. You can open carry a fixed blade.
 
I may be wrong but the way the law reads to me it sounds like carrying a Buck 110 or any other sheathed folder under your shirt would be considered an illegal carry method in CAL also, not just a fixed blade. It looks to mean that if a knife is clipped in your pocket and the clip can't be seen indicating that you are carrying a knife that you would be guilty of concealed carry even for a small folder.
 
In California, folders of any length may be carried either concealed or open. Fixed blades of any length must be carried open.
 
Artfully Martial said:
Cliff, my full tang fixed blade is in no way more likely to "close" on my hand than any folder ever made all time period.
Click to expand...

It is far easier to break than many folders which have a much wider scope of work.

STR said:
I have lived in 5 states so far in my life.
Click to expand...

There are more than 5 states in the US and not everyone lives in the US.

The point remains that the arguement of "carry a fixed blade" in regards to durablity is moot, because a fixed blade is in every way superior to a folder, The only reason you carry folders is because you can't carry fixed blades.There are also specific laws, work related for example.

And of course if you have problems with locks on folders you don't need to simply carry a fixed blade, you can just carry a folder with a stronger and more secure lock, they do exist. I have several that I can use with no concerns and the blade will break long before the lock will release.

-Cliff
 
No really? There are more than 5 states here? DUH! Who'd a thunk it?

Seriously, I realize where you live Cliff and I didn't say there were not more than five states. Just can't speak for more than the ones I know about is all.

Fixed blades can be carried in Canada can't they? I saw them when I was up there on more than a couple belts. More than I have noticed here in the states actually. Of course that was a number of years back. Still though many people don't hesitate to carry a folder with a blade length that pushes the envelope for legality and many people don't hesitate to carry a fixed blade either on their person or in their vehicle. My thought when I bring up a fixed blade should have been "use a fixed blade" instead of just carry one because in some jobs I think a fixed blade is paticularly better.

Of course this is not possible in a crisis or if all you have on you is your folder and I realize that. But your points on lock strength are noted and these days if one has the money it is possible to get a good strong lock. I realize there are strong locks I never argued against that. I simply feel any lock can fail and that if you are doing tasks that do in fact push the envelope for the locks strength you should plan accordingly.

In many, if not most situations the users know full well when they will be pushing the envelope or when a job is coming up that will make is so they are going to be pushing the envelope for strength with their folder lock so why not use the proper tool? In those cases it is a good idea to be safer in the way you work and also maybe consider a better tool for the job, ie, a fixed blade, which as you pointed out is in every way superior to a folder in ability. I mean, if you are trying to split some kindling with your folder just because you think it has a strong lock you have come to trust securely and end up cutting yourself good and busting the lock too when all along you had a Camp Tramp under the seat of your truck you have nothing else to blame but your own lazyness for not getting the proper tool for the job. Of course in some cases even a fixed blade may be the wrong tool where a pry bar or some other tool would be a better choice.
 
Artfully Martial said:
Breaking is different than folding on my fingers. That's what this discussion is about.
Click to expand...

The thread is about the importance of locks in general on a knife, what they offer and how it influences the scope of work of the knife, including topics such as batoning which has no danger of the blade contacting your fingers but can damage lesser locks. As noted the fixed blade you mentioned isn't stronger or more durable than various folders which thus have a wider scope of work.

STR said:
Fixed blades can be carried in Canada can't they?
Click to expand...

The only knife restrictions we have are idiotic ones like no balis, no autos, etc. .

...in some jobs I think a fixed blade is paticularly better.
Click to expand...

A fixed blade is always better for a multitude of reasons, however when someone complains about a folders poor ergonomics, one area where they compare really badly to fixed blades, you don't see "get a fixed blade" you will get recommendations on other folders with better grips. It is no different when problems with locks are brought up, get a folder with a better lock.

-Cliff
 
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