INFI in 2018

ATJ999 said:
I have quite a few INFI, CPM 3V, A8mod, Cru-Wear(family), Z-Finit, etc. steels. I like Infi because it is tough, easy to sharpen/gets SHARP with ease, and good corrosion resistance. That said, it does not hold a great edge for cutting, but does hold a good edge for chopping. Also, when taken down to 20 DPS edge, I get edge deformation. So I convex the edge, or keep it at 25DPS, and it still performs very well.
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At around 17 dps this is INFI vs 5160 at a similar thickness (5160 definitely thinner overall, but with very slightly more open micro): Same chopping on same Maple wood:

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Quote: "As a specific example, in Cook's book (1921) you will see the edge angles of a swamper axe at 17.5 dps. If you scan modern small folders, 17.5 dpi would be considered a low angle - however this is a full size swamping axe, and these were the utility axes used to cut limbs roots."

Below: CPM-3V vs Chinese 420J (420J2: 0.3% Carbon, 420HC: 0.4-0.5%), same edge thickness, same angle (about 20 dps w/no micro-bevel), some careless twisting on the Chinese knife (the one folded spot grabbing nail fuzz), every motion otherwise kept dead straight on the GSO-10 in CPM 3V :

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Gaston
 
I would say both are excellent steels. As far as i know INFI is tougher but has less wear resistance. I havent had the opportunity to test INFI, but i have used ZTUFF, which i assume is similar in toughness.

3v has better wear resistance and is still basically indestructible. 3V is my personal favorite steel, followed by Zwear and zfinit.

In my uses 3V is essentially indestructible at 59-60HRC with full cryo. Ive made machetes and choppers with it at that hardness and its exellent.

Either way you will have a super tough knife that will last a lifetime.
NiceNife said:
Nice info. Got any good convex 3V knives around or under 5”?
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I would be glad to build one for you.
HT by peters.
 
Beyond the indestructible steel (marvel/dc time o_O:confused:), how bout the guarantee that comes along with said indestructible steel?

Plenty makers type up page long guarantees for hard use, and then they refuse to honor them. They play semantics and explain to you their vastly superior metallurgy knowledge. Think, 'You damaged the knife by unwrapping the box' -- I know many of you have heard this one just as I have many times over. :D

Pretty sure Jerry ain't one those guys! :thumbsup::thumbsup:
 
Yeah getting an infi knife you want is a huge pita without paying thru the nose on the secondary market.The Swamp Rat line is much easier if you like SR101.You can order one online.
 
Gaston444 said:
At around 17 dps this is INFI vs 5160 at a similar thickness (5160 definitely thinner overall, but with very slightly more open micro): Same chopping on same Maple wood:


Quote: "As a specific example, in Cook's book (1921) you will see the edge angles of a swamper axe at 17.5 dps. If you scan modern small folders, 17.5 dpi would be considered a low angle - however this is a full size swamping axe, and these were the utility axes used to cut limbs roots."

Below: CPM-3V vs Chinese 420J (420J2: 0.3% Carbon, 420HC: 0.4-0.5%), same edge thickness, same angle (about 20 dps w/no micro-bevel), some careless twisting on the Chinese knife (the one folded spot grabbing nail fuzz), every motion otherwise kept dead straight on the GSO-10 in CPM 3V :


Gaston
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Quotes don't do much good unless you provide the source. Also, please stop with the 420j crap.
 
Phixt said:
Beyond the indestructible steel (marvel/dc time o_O:confused:), how bout the guarantee that comes along with said indestructible steel?

Plenty makers type up page long guarantees for hard use, and then they refuse to honor them. They play semantics and explain to you their vastly superior metallurgy knowledge. Think, 'You damaged the knife by unwrapping the box' -- I know many of you have heard this one just as I have many times over. :D

Pretty sure Jerry ain't one those guys! :thumbsup::thumbsup:
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I haven't used the Busse warranty, so I can't speak to it. But I have experienced what you refer to with other supposed "no questions asked" warranty.

skyhorse said:
Yeah getting an infi knife you want is a huge pita without paying thru the nose on the secondary market.The Swamp Rat line is much easier if you like SR101.You can order one online.
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I liked SR101 in the knives I've had with it. Better edge retention than INFI afaict.
 
L.H.S said:
I haven't used the Busse warranty, so I can't speak to it. But I have experienced what you refer to with other supposed "no questions asked" warranty.



I liked SR101 in the knives I've had with it. Better edge retention than INFI afaict.
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Sr101 is a great steel, takes a very sharp edge and cost is much more reasonable
 
ShannonSteelLabs said:
I would say both are excellent steels. As far as i know INFI is tougher but has less wear resistance. I havent had the opportunity to test INFI, but i have used ZTUFF, which i assume is similar in toughness.

3v has better wear resistance and is still basically indestructible. 3V is my personal favorite steel, followed by Zwear and zfinit.

In my uses 3V is essentially indestructible at 59-60HRC with full cryo. Ive made machetes and choppers with it at that hardness and its exellent.

Either way you will have a super tough knife that will last a lifetime.

I would be glad to build one for you.
HT by peters.
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I’ve never really considered a custom knife, but I haven’t found any production knives that match what I’m looking for. I’m returning the Bark River Gunny, because the 3V steel rusts and pits after I put a drop of water on the blade and leave it there for 30-60 minutes. People here think that I may have gotten the wrong steel/labeling. Can you please send me some details and pricing for your knives?

Sorry for the side conversation here.
 
FortyTwoBlades said:
The 20° per side convention perplexes me. I never do anything thicker than 15° unless we're talking cold chisels and similar.
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15º INFI would probably warp like metallic play-doh. There are some pictures around of a thinly ground Busse. I flattened the tip of my B11 by accidentally hitting a floor tile, so I'd say INFI's toughness comes from ductility.
 
DPC said:
15º INFI would probably warp like metallic play-doh. There are some pictures around of a thinly ground Busse. I flattened the tip of my B11 by accidentally hitting a floor tile, so I'd say INFI's toughness comes from ductility.
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So it's basically soft S7? :D :D :D

I find it curious that they claim that their knives are hardened to 58-60, which is a measure of resistance to plastic deformation, but then claim that it remains ductile at that high of a hardness and people indicate that when it's made thin it's prone to rolling/deforming. If it's that hard it should do fine with a 15° per side edge. A Tramontina machete can chop hardwoods with an edge that thin. You should only be getting rolling with a high-hardness, high-toughness steel if the forces exceed the yield point. At 15° per side, 52 RC 1075 holds up just fine.
 
NiceNife said:
I’ve never really considered a custom knife, but I haven’t found any production knives that match what I’m looking for. I’m returning the Bark River Gunny, because the 3V steel rusts and pits after I put a drop of water on the blade and leave it there for 30-60 minutes. People here think that I may have gotten the wrong steel/labeling. Can you please send me some details and pricing for your knives?

Sorry for the side conversation here.
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Pm inbound
 
I started by reprofiling this to 15° per side, then pretty aggresively thinned the primary. Have used it a bunch since, no issues here, no "warp like metallic play-doh" :rolleyes::

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I buy their fixed blades because I like the designs better than everyone else's, the steel choices appear to be sensible and well-executed, and the warranty is really good. Most of my Bussekin are SR-101 though, only a few in INFI.
 
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Larrin said:
Since Infi is a name created by Busse the level of discussion is related to the amount of interest in Busse knives.
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Only to the extent that people let it.

Metallurgy is what it is. The only relevant discussion is the science and engineering involved, along with the real-world experiences that go along with it. I recall reading an article about Carbon V and INFI; and the author spoke of metallurgical issues, not who's interested in Cold Steel or Busse. His conclusion was that both steels were excellent cutlery steels, given the parameters and compromises that that kind of classification entails.
 
My understanding is that Infi is very close to A8 (mod), which is an extremely tough steel often used for chipper blades. It's a low carbon (somewhere around .55 C) steel with about 5 percent chrome and a few other elements. It's not going to be as tough as S7, but it will have better wear resistance.

Some knife makers use it, too. Fredrik Haakonsen, a PhD metallurgist and knife maker, likes it because of its toughness. It will bend before it breaks. It also doesn't like to chip, but it will roll.

I've found that Infi is roughly as tough as 3V, but will less wear resistance, but I was comparing different knives and heat treats, so it's difficult for me to know with any certainty.

It's an interesting issue about the proper balance between toughness and strength and wear resistance. That balance will be different for various cutting applications.
 
"Metallurgy is what it is. The only relevant discussion is the science and engineering involved, along with the real-world experiences that go along with it. I recall reading an article about Carbon V and INFI; and the author spoke of metallurgical issues, not who's interested in Cold Steel or Busse. His conclusion was that both steels were excellent cutlery steels, given the parameters and compromises that that kind of classification entails."

Larrin would be a great one to discuss metallurgy with as he is a metallurgist. A knifemaker before that. There was never really anything secret about Carbon V or Infi or what they are. IMO in the case of Busse knives the lengths they go to to keep the quality levels up is what is important not what steel they use. There really isn't anything unusual about those. For whatever reasons people have really bought into the marketing as much as the steel used in their knives.

joe
 
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