Intro, First blade and grind question

D

DMIKEM

Joined
Sep 15, 2016
Messages
32
Hello all, I am new to this blade and knife making. I have made a couple small carving knives in the past and put new scales on an old machete I found broken in a junkyard. After removing the rust I found out it was heavily etched with Mexican writing and symbols. I'll try to get some photos up in the near future.

Today I have cut a blade out of a nice 10" circular saw blade. It is a deep rounded skinning shape with an S curve spine from end to end. My question is on a blade such as this do you grind an angle from spine to edge or just edge the blade and if you grind what would be the degree of that angle? I have a wen 4 inch belt and disk grinder and a few belts with more on the way. I do not have assess to a drill press and am wondering how I will be able to add the holes for the scale pins or would epoxy be strong enough to hold it together? I do not have any forging equipment but do have a torch, drills, saws, and wood shop equipment.

I would eventually like to make a nice cleaver for my kitchen as well. I will need to take my pieces to a local fabricator to weld the tang together for a full tang for that project.

Oh I do have several Katana swords, not the expensive Japanese ones but nice Chinese made ones. I believe my O'Katana is a TH spring steel. and I have one that is a folded Damascus type that I would like to enhance the etching on.

Not sure if I want to leave the teeth on the handle end yet.

ZaQYSBWkhAgypPCrfTmUoTyJKUvMZWXdBRndLf9GcGtjUPW-qbUCIaojxMschVMobB_EBjaBCrxzoMCzlhJzFfoAxbX6AJSIxPP8zaHWVym07wgnqTK6nY15PCRwF1IPGk7vE7z3fNq3DD5ngY_GLJM6QteZjnkuBt6E6eo1ZkEG_mh_bu_eECdkmkOYoV0NCTQjpWT-4pzAXIg4InLGvcOxAQUImL-u_3qg_Ir84KBz8A87RmSOthaEzEZAjgFM3i10YuEJTTfRkgigp0V5mXV0AwkiA_bwBtufZHyTbjqpXO_Se8RZ02MbDTjaFZcIkSqZ5753nUjOmGO_a1Sjx2hi9V2im_3TzHZX-Z4EY90kbjNTIM4TLWnJ_O1CSEzX5dhOzndd0K-6Tx3HHxquFkos8-kSHeKgwM8ulzGhGBp8m8ImlglkA2SzKFdzd0y0lM7uoTtiqhO53e7ftjKcJDbZG1RGuYHXWgWzsYwwZs7rTRJvtfH4QxRTf94FJOvjUOLdtZFyLaUDOsTIasHuR05n51QCsTUsOYNilctTVzTIomnGd1rkuLO4gLtn9id_kUfkwhmEAl-wlH0vZ-Ul-87CK7HoVpmeSG8vkmF9bo3SLs-H9g=w1640-h922-no
 
Definitely would drill holes, you might get away with just a hand drill there. The biggest issue is heat treating and tempering. I'd imagine you killed the temper when you cut it out (unless you used a hack saw) if the temper is still there You can try bevels. Just go slow and dunk in water often. If you try just an edge you'll find that the shoulders (where the angle of edge meets the blade) will inhibit nice cutting.
 
So maybe I should make a block with a 2 or 3 degree angle on it and grind the whole cutting area to that, then edge it? Maybe make an apple seed edge like my swords or would that be a convexed edge?

If I heat the handle area with a torch and let it slow cool will it make it easier to drill?

I have a little smoker that I have used to burn the carbon off my iron skillets when they need to be seasoned again. The grill became so hot it melted (I use oak and eucalyptus with coal) so I use extruded metal in it now. Maybe that could be used to heat treat the blade again? Then I could temper it in the toaster oven for 30 minutes?
 
I dont make knives from sawblades, and its hard to tell from the picture, but might want to make sure the steel is high carbon and doesnt just have high carbon teeth welded on.

A hand drill will be enough if you are careful. MAKE SURE YOU CLAMP IT DOWN. Nothing worse than having a drill bit catching on the steel turning your drill into a whirling blade of death (dont ask me how I know). I would definitely drill the holes for pins though. Epoxy is not build for resisting lateral force.

If you cut it with an angle grinder and there was any color change on the steel I would normalize the knife and reheat treat. Annealing prior to grinding will save you on abrasives too.
 
It didn't really change color I got a good grove in the steel then used the sawzall to cut it out.
 
I noticed the saw blade had carbide cutting thingies. I've heard that the main part of these saw blades is low carbon steel. I don't KNOW this as a fact, just passing on what I've read. It might be worthwhile to make a little Kiridashi style knife and see what heat treating does for it.

- Paul Meske
 
Ooh yeah lonepine good catch on the teeth.

If you are planning on actually carrying and using it the teeth on the handle will be hugely annoying.

If it's for looking cool, practice and you won't use it (most of mine I've made - how many can I use at once) then you could leave them if you want.
 
The only things I carry are a nice assisted folding tactical and my Schrade multi tool. I made a little carving knife from another saw blade I had laying around and I find it very hard to sharpen. Not sure if it's the steel or a bad grind and angle. Once I finally got it sharp it really seems to hold it's edge. Maybe I need to do the same to some of the scrap from this saw blade too just to test it out as suggested. I think I will remove the teeth though. I finally got some better belts for my grinder (the other ones were for wood working) but the weather and other projects have kept me from getting back to this blade. it was either too hot or now it's too wet outside.
 
Welcome to the forum.

Some basic advice and info;
1) A carbide tipped circular saw blade will not keep an edge. It isn't the type of steel wanted for a knife. Heat treatment will not likely improve things, as it is a low carbon high alloy chromium-moly steel.

2) The finger hole choil made a very thin area above it. With a wide blade and long thin handle, the knife breaking at that spot is very likely.

3) Best method to start learning knifemaking is to get some reliable and easy to HT steel, like 1084, and make a simple knife, like a drop point hunter.
 
Thanks for the comments Stacy. I don't plan on chopping or prying with this first try. More for learning, testing and accomplishment. I was looking at AKS knife supply and steel blanks don't seem to expensive but I do not see 1084. I do see 1080+ though. I am not sure what thickness to buy yet either. I guess I could look at some knives I like then see if they state the specs for reference.

Do you think the older straight blades (no carbide tips) are better or harder steel? I have a couple of them laying around.
 
http://newjerseysteelbaron.com/shop/1084hc/. 48" of 1084 at 1/8'' thick and 1.5'' wide. I wouldn't get anything over 1/8''. You can get 6-8 knives out of this and it is $17.51. It is a known good steel and you can find specific heat treat recipes for it. As for the "straight blades" I'm not sure. I know a lot of the old saw mill blades are solid and are usually some sort of high carbon steel. I would assume that if its a saw blade and doesn't have carbide tips then it should be something that can be hardened. You could always file test it and see if it is hardened.
 
Nice product, thanks. I think I would either send out or go to a local shop for the heat treat. I think these need to be heated higher than I can go with my charcoal fire.
 
Not true, I heat treat my O-1 with hard wood charcoal, found most places nowadays. And a little bit of forced air... Runs it up to 1450+ in just a couple minutes. Check for demagnetization, put it back in for a couple min after then quench. It's fairly easy.
 
Not at all. I'm sure you'll be surprised. If you want to test it just build your fire on the ground first... Use a metal pipe to put on the edge of your coals... Use something to force air through the pipe (creative as you want to be). You'll see the "hot spot", place your knife in with spine toward hot spot, take to non magnetic temp, then give a little more time watch color for dull orange. Straight to quench (oil) if 1095 or O1, (air) if A2. Keep in the oil for a few minutes. Take out and run file across the edge, if you got proper heat treat the file will skate across not bite. Then temper as soon as it's cool enough to handle with bare hand. Good luck! You'll get it!
 
My buddy told me to just use my Brinkman grill smoker. The bullet shape will build up enough heat in the middle to do what I need. I have lots of oak and charcoal so ill give it a try after I get some holes drilled into the handle.
 
Only one way to find out! May be starved for oxygen which is why we force air into it. The oak coals will be perfect!
 
Well haha, I melted the tip of it pretty badly. I loaded up the brinkman with oak and other small scrap wood and got a good set of coals going. Then I got my data vac, (small portable vacuum) attached a pipe to the hose and put the blade in the coals and shot some air into the coals with the data vac. Metal got red hot to I pulled it out to magnet test and saw the tip was full of holes. Went ahead and tested and it was non magnetic. So I quenched in oil and let cool. I broke off the tip and file tested the blade and the file just skates off. I put it in the oven for a tempering and will grind it to a usable shape just for the hell of it. Next time I'll pay more attention to the glow of the metal.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top