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Is the .22LR the most versatile caliber for urban/wilderness survival.

LOL, this .22 thread turned into a "wild animal versus human" thread.

Lions, tigers, and bears, oh my!

We all have to admit that there is not a single animal professional among us.:jerkit: Am I right? Either way, the animal discusion needs a seperate thread.

.22's kick ass!:D
 
LOL, this .22 thread turned into a "wild animal versus human" thread.

Lions, tigers, and bears, oh my!

We all have to admit that there is not a single animal professional among us.:jerkit: Am I right? Either way, the animal discusion needs a seperate thread.

.22's kick ass!:D

Well, I used to be a professional animal, but I'm retired now.
 
LOL, this .22 thread turned into a "wild animal versus human" thread.

Lions, tigers, and bears, oh my!

We all have to admit that there is not a single animal professional among us.:jerkit: Am I right? Either way, the animal discusion needs a seperate thread.

.22's kick ass!:D

Well, Joezilla is a Zoologist. So... no, we've got at least one among us.

Oh, and I watched Animal Planet this morning, so... basically, I'm a step under Joe. :p:D
 
Thank gawd! Finally a thread about the best caliber to carry in the woods.

Now, if only someone would start one about the best sheath and belt knife combo.

:)


Kis
 
I'll chime in with some of my limited experiences.

If we are talking about VERSITILITY for both urban and wilderness honestly my vote goes to a handgun. Less accurate and powerful... yep. But I can carry it anywhere without anyone being the wiser. It is MORE likely to be on me when disaster strikes and instantly available. I favor the .357 for woods walking. I usually load the first chamber with a wad cutter and the rest with powerful handloads. I have shot everything up to deer with a wad cutter and have gotten many a one shot kill. When I am hunting in INTL border country and worry about drug smugglers and large groups of illegals I carry a .45acp handgun in addition to my hunting rifle/shotgun. For the weight/capacity/versatility/reliability/ease of use under stress/power/accuracy/ deployment. I prefer a wheel gun. Would I go into combat with one. Nope.

I think both the .22 and 12 gauge are fine tools. If I was going to do a sustained walkabout for any length of time it would definitely be a strong choice for food procurement. The 12 gauge is powerful and very versatile and if I was walking around my property or going from A to B in a vehicle or such would be a strong choice.

Figured these experiences may be interesting:
I had a run in with a pack of wild dogs on a trail run about 6 miles from any help. It ended with me shooting one with a .38 airweight and running a fast 6 mile time back to my truck. In my opinion a pack of dogs is NO joke. Anyone who thinks they are should play with my 120lb pit. Remember a dog doesn't need to kill you to render you permanently damaged and/or damaged to the point of impending death especially where medical help is limited.

I recently shot a wild hog who came into my camp with my wife and kids and several other couples around. He was nearly 150lbs and I would consider him a little one. He came in pissed as hell and started pawing and snorting and looked like he was going to charge so I shot him with my service pistol (.40). The round was an issued self defense round and it took him right below his shoulder. He tore through the camp and took off and died about 100 meters down the road (I had fired twice more and missed, he was moving quick). It really opened my eyes to the stopping power of a pistol cartridge. I had a 12 gauge rem 1100 loaded with slugs in my truck for just this but there was no time to deploy it.

I think UDT guy said it best. I think that most people believe that a firearm will solve all of their problems. It's only part of the equation. In the military my first squad leader emphasized three things: Fieldcraft/marksmanship/tactics. He would preach that a lack of one would bring certain failure to the mission. Keep under the radar, don't fight unless you have too. If you do use deception, speed, and accuracy to eliminate the threat.

Slightly off topic but what the heck. my .02.
 
I just broke into a local Zoo and killed a Mountain lion with my maglite and and then punched out the biggest chimp they had in captivity.

They both tasted great followed by a dessert of feral dog.

I like the 12ga!
 
Sounds like a great Pay Per View: Gimp vs. Chimp!
A shotty is more "versatile" than a .22, just look at the range of game it is effectively used on, from squirrels and rabbits to game birds and waterfowl all the way up to deer and black bear. It may not be more practical than a .22, depending on the situation. I know the only time I carry a shotgun on me is when I'm hunting. I almost always have an Airlight .22 and 100 rounds in my bag, though, and I CCW a snubby .357. In a SHTF scenario I would love my 870 and a myriad of ammo, but I doubt I would have it with me.
 
I think in the real world, short of being attacked by loins tigers and bears, not to mention Chinese paratroopers, blood sucking zombie hordes, a good .22 rifle you are very familiar with can be just as good as any other gun. It's all a matter of taste and what you are used to.

For the business of urban survival, the .22 may be out ahead, because of the low report, you may get away with small game hunting of pidgons and squirrels without having everyone in the nieghborhood hearing your shots. For defensive use, I seriously doubt someone getting shot with a 22 in the breadbasket will continue to make trouble for you.

When I read the autobiography of Audie Murphy, I was surprised at the poverty he came from. His father had run out on the family when he was a little kid, and by age 12, young Audie was feeding his family with a single shot .22 rifle. He took small game, and now and then a deer with a head shot.

A .22 should do well if used within it's range.
 
If a deer decided to attack you, it could kill you. Humans are more dangerous because they are smart, aggressive and use tools. Physically, we are weak compared to wild animals.

I read once that deer were major league killers of humans, worse that bears or mountain lions. I know a deer can be dangerous if one attacks a single human. But that statistic seemed odd to me.

I just asked Google. According to this site, http://www.ftthomas.org/Deer.html

More people are killed as a result of deer/vehicle collisions each year than by dogs, snakes, sharks, mountain lions, bears and alligators combined. On average 130 people are killed in deer/vehicle collisions each year, making deer the most deadly animal in the United States.

That’s not quite the same as commando deer stalking hunters and taking revenge for all those venison roasts.
 
I think in the real world, short of being attacked by loins tigers and bears, not to mention Chinese paratroopers, blood sucking zombie hordes, a good .22 rifle you are very familiar with can be just as good as any other gun. It's all a matter of taste and what you are used to.

For the business of urban survival, the .22 may be out ahead, because of the low report, you may get away with small game hunting of pidgons and squirrels without having everyone in the nieghborhood hearing your shots. For defensive use, I seriously doubt someone getting shot with a 22 in the breadbasket will continue to make trouble for you.

When I read the autobiography of Audie Murphy, I was surprised at the poverty he came from. His father had run out on the family when he was a little kid, and by age 12, young Audie was feeding his family with a single shot .22 rifle. He took small game, and now and then a deer with a head shot.

A .22 should do well if used within it's range.

Interesting quote about Audie. I grew up with my grandparents in northern New Mexico very primitive. The go to gun was a pump 22 gallery gun. I never remember my grandfather missing. Pick the shot, head shot only, one shot one kill. From ground squirrels, hawks, deer, dogs, hogs, sick sheep and cattle one shot drops. Hard to believe with the pray and spray crowd. We never had a shot gun. Beware of the man with only one gun, he probably knows how to use it they say. He may not have had enough gun for everything by most people, but in the hands of an expert, quarters can be shot out of the air. You could cripple something to increase your odds in defense to get away or slow it down for follow up shots. You don't have to play fair if your life depends on it. As said before, I do like the 22/20 guage camper Savage. A choke would be nice. I believe the gun is cylinder bore, works for slugs. I have two so one threaded for chokes might be nice. From birds to deer, just pick your shot carefully. If you miss, you can follow up with the shotty. Know your quarry, know your gun, know your limitations and practice. I would feel just fine with my Savage but that's just me.
 
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For survival, I would grab my Browning 22 pistol. Easy to carry the gun and ammo and it has a log enough barrel to make it shootable.
 
For survival, I would grab my Browning 22 pistol. Easy to carry the gun and ammo and it has a log enough barrel to make it shootable.

I still have a colt woodsman on the back shelf that I haven't shot for awhile, the ruger mark II target pistols take the abuse in stainless. Had one scoped and didn't like it. A red dot seems to work fine but harder to pack in a large shoulder holster. One goes into a regular leather holster with extra mag.
 
Versatile survival guns. It's always an interesting question, no matter what website it comes up on. I like a lot of different guns, for different applications in different areas, and for different things.

If I'm looking at a gun for a long-term survival situation, I have to think about what that could mean for where I live. Hunting isn't likely to occupy too much of my time, because I'll probably spend more time working on growing crops. I'll hunt, sure, but ... probably not every day. Unless forced from home, I'll be here, so I can continue to do what I do now with my guns, and that is use the appropriate one for the application, whether that is a .22 or something else.

I hunt birds now for recreation. It never really bothers me to spend a morning hunting and only take home one or three birds, because I'm doing it for fun, exercise, to get outside, and to work my dog. If I was doing it for a survival reason -- to get as much meat as possible in as short a time as possible, I wouldn't do it the way I do. I would be going for nets, traps, and possibly snares. The shotgun and dog would definitely still work, but it's a low-return method, honestly, for time, calories expended, and cost of shotshells. Even if I shot every bird I saw.

My only gun for years was a .22 Ruger semiauto. It did everything from defense to hunting to emergency preparedness, and is still one of my favorites. It is the one gun that always goes to the range, and usually gets shot the most by everybody I shoot with.




Oh, and about lions. The earlier discussion was entertaining.

There are at least a couple of contributing factors to the attack statistics quoted earlier: there are more lions now than there were in majority of the 20th century, and that is partly due to decreased predation by humans on them, and partly due to the fact that there are a lot more deer nowadays (their primary prey species). The fact that there are more of them increases the probability of increased interaction between the species, and the fact that they are hunted less than they used to be, up to and including not at all in some areas like California, means that there are going to be more aggressive cats out there, ones that are more willing, or at least desperate enough, to try taking a human. Doesn't mean that they will always succeed when they try.

I live in an area where there are a lot of them. I don't worry too much about it, but I do carry a gun when I hike, year-round, mostly to protect my dog from them and from the coyotes -- which I see a lot more often.

Wild animals area concern in these kinds of scenarios, but I don't think that they are going to be the primary problem most of the time.
 
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