Is this a Schrade fake?

koldgold · Jan 30, 2015

The blue handled PH2 was not a Duck knife, they were a special order Schrade were working on in 2003.
My set is missing the American Flag in the square.
I have seen some unfinished Blue Bone knives, without the shield or etch.
Schrade were working on some nice knives in 2002, 2003;
The good ones were the 2004 Anniversary knives, that did not make it to production.
I have never seen one of those knives, in a box... Ken

Saddlebum · Jan 30, 2015

Opps! Yes, I have seen individual knives from that set. Very nice to have the set!! That is maybe my favorite Schrade shield.
I was thinking of this DU knife.

koldgold · Jan 31, 2015

That is a nice Duck, I like most of the Duck sets.

Saddlebum · Jan 31, 2015

As a side note about my earlier problems with myhostedpics.com, THEY'RE BACK! I just spent a couple of hours re-posting pictures through tinypic after taking Codger's advise. I went to a thread that I knew I had posted pics on and low and behold they were there. I checked to see if I could get on myhosted pics and it was there, for the first time in a week or so. They must have crashed and just got back up again. So I just spent a couple of hours re-posting pictures for nothing....

.....Pretty funny!

Saddlebum · Feb 2, 2015

I ran across this one in my ebay suggestions today. Any comments on this one? Whatever the reason for this, it is not desirable to me. Never mind the bad condition of this one.

thawk · Feb 2, 2015

Saddlebum said:
I ran across this one in my ebay suggestions today. Any comments on this one? Whatever the reason for this, it is not desirable to me. Never mind the bad condition of this one.

Ugly enough I don't care who ground off the tang and put on the ugly stamp, but I do think the blades are USA Schrades, maybe nothing more than that.

Saddlebum · Feb 2, 2015

thawk said:
Ugly enough I don't care who ground off the tang and put on the ugly stamp, but I do think the blades are USA Schrades, maybe nothing more than that.

It kinda looks like it might have been stamped over the double X that Schrade used on factory 2nds. Like whoever did this didn't grind out the XX all the way down. See the lines through the stamp. Why anyone would do such a thing is beyond me.

woseyjales · Feb 4, 2015

tongueriver said:
...There are 4 kinds of Schrades with Walden tang-stamps that I am aware of so far.
The originals, 1946 to 1973. In the later years they started putting it on a few special editions,
but I truly can't remember which ones, off the bat.

TR, one such S.E is the 1984 25th Anniversary 34 OT.
Tang has 'Schrade' over 'Walden' over 'N.Y. U.S.A.'

Saddlebum · Feb 12, 2015

Okay, is this guy confused or what? "Is it live or is it Memorex" He can't have it both ways. Pretty funny!

This is a new in original plastic tube with paper, vintage Schrade Walden N.Y. USA manufactured by Camillius for Schrade under license agreement with Taylor Cutlery, "Everlastingly Sharp" stockman folding pocket knife. The original plastic tube container is marked SWA834Y and is also in mint condition. This highly collectible American hand crafted knife is a great piece of cutlery history that will never be in production again since Schrade closed their doors over 10 years ago after nearly 100 years of great knife making.

koldgold · Feb 13, 2015

That knife is not a Schrade knife.
It is a knife made in the U.S.A. using the name "Schrade" and "Walden" and "N.Y." All trade marks owned by Toylor Brands after Schrade closed down.
Is it a Fake? No it is not a fake, it's a copy of a 1970s knife Schrade made.
It looks like a nice knive; but it is not a U.S. made collectable Schrade, most collectors would want in their collection.
Nice wording on that nice new tube:

The genuine Schrade Tube states, "GUARANTEE" Schrade Walden Pocket Knives are hand made by skilled American cutlers using the finest material.
Each knife carries a LIFETIME Guarantee against defects in materials or workmanship. Schrade Walden Cutlery Corp. Elenville N.Y."

thawk · Feb 13, 2015

Saddlebum said:
Okay, is this guy confused or what? "Is it live or is it Memorex" He can't have it both ways. Pretty funny!

This is a new in original plastic tube with paper, vintage Schrade Walden N.Y. USA manufactured by Camillius for Schrade under license agreement with Taylor Cutlery, "Everlastingly Sharp" stockman folding pocket knife. The original plastic tube container is marked SWA834Y and is also in mint condition. This highly collectible American hand crafted knife is a great piece of cutlery history that will never be in production again since Schrade closed their doors over 10 years ago after nearly 100 years of great knife making.

It was made for Taylor by Camillus Cutlery before the Camillus plant shut down as well.

It was not made overseas like most of the other Schrade patterns he has had made since. He had some others made by GEC and Utica too.

Saddlebum · Feb 13, 2015

I posted the picture and seller's description to point out how people get confused over these knives. Like the others I posted earlier. This seller tells the potential buyer that it is a Taylor made by Camillus and then goes on about how it's a piece of Schrade history since they closed down and it's collectable, as if it's an Ellenville knife. That's why I said, he can't have it both ways. I just thought it was funny and might help out someone who gets confused over these American made Taylors.

tongueriver · Feb 13, 2015

Saddlebum said:
I posted the picture and seller's description to point out how people get confused over these knives. Like the others I posted earlier. This seller tells the potential buyer that it is a Taylor made by Camillus and then goes on about how it's a piece of Schrade history since they closed down and it's collectable, as if it's an Ellenville knife. That's why I said, he can't have it both ways. I just thought it was funny and might help out someone who gets confused over these American made Taylors.

I thought when I read your post that you "got it." :thumbup:

Saddlebum · Feb 13, 2015

tongueriver said:
I thought when I read your post that you "got it." :thumbup:

Thanks. Thanks too for the info about the other knife makers that made 'Schrades' for Taylor. Earlier when I couldn't remember, I wanted to say Camillus but my brain is so foggy these days I thought it better left un-said. I didn't know about GEC or Utica. I have to admit that when I bought the Camillus made Taylor 881Y years ago, I did consider keeping it for a user because it was put together pretty good. But I returned it to the seller. I have no idea what I paid for it.

Codger_64 · Feb 13, 2015

I could be wrong. It happens all the time. But to the best of my memory this knife was not made for Taylor. It was made for Blue Ridge or more likely SMKW under rented TBLLC licensed trademark. Look back in your stacks of SMKW catalogs to see if you can find it there. Or ask in the Camillus forum. Some former employees, there to the bitter end, still drop in from time to time.

BTW, the Delrin covers and pinned bolsters are the tells that it wasn't made by Schrade.

Saddlebum · Feb 13, 2015

Codger_64 said:
BTW, the Delrin covers and pinned bolsters are the tells that it wasn't made by Schrade.

I didn't take my eyes off of the branded shield and the belly in the handle long enough to even notice the pinned bolsters. I guess SMKW doesn't have the same aversion for Taylor that I have. :barf:
Kinda makes me wonder who makes them for Taylor now, but I don't want to ask because this is starting to evolve into a Taylor thread and I'm really not that interested. My fault!

thawk · Feb 13, 2015

Codger_64 said:
I could be wrong. It happens all the time. But to the best of my memory this knife was not made for Taylor. It was made for Blue Ridge or more likely SMKW under rented TBLLC licensed trademark. Look back in your stacks of SMKW catalogs to see if you can find it there. Or ask in the Camillus forum. Some former employees, there to the bitter end, still drop in from time to time.

BTW, the Delrin covers and pinned bolsters are the tells that it wasn't made by Schrade.

I could be wrong too. When did Taylor get the rights to the Schrade naming rights? I did not realize (or forgot) after the closing, that anyone other than Taylor had the copyrights to the name. But now that you mention it Michael, I believe I do recall seeing those yellow knives in the SMKW catalogs.

Also, I think Schrade made some of the 881Y knives with Schrade Walden USA stamps, and the 100 YR etch were made by Schrade USA for the 2004 year. I may be wrong about this to. Much of that last year and the next few are still a mystery.

There were a lot of 2004 projects that never made it through production and there are many still showing up as unfinished pieces in various states of production, some of it which is still going on. This is a rerun statement, but there were boxcars full of parts that were sold in the auction.

Codger_64 · Feb 14, 2015

Stewart Taylor, representing Taylor Brands Limited Liability Corporation was the high bidder for the entire intellectual property package at the Imperial Schrade auction in October of 2004. That included all patents, trademarks, trade dress, logos and copyrights etc. IIRC the Schrade Walden marked knives were produced in either late 2004 or early 2005 to begin with. Some were placed in auction find packaging with new paper inserts (the tubes). I don't recall who made which patterns when but I seem to remember the rented trademark being applied to knives made by Camillus (first I think), and Queen, possibly Utica. One might search the archives here and find that information. As far as I know, that rented nostalgia mark was only put on American made knives. Some of these may have been retro-marked as anniversary knives, that I am not certain of. Also right after the auction, we knew here how many tractor trailer loads of knives etc. were bought in partnership (?) by SMKW and Blue Ridge. Perhaps someone who was there remembers exactly.

Saddlebum · Feb 14, 2015

thawk said:
I could be wrong too. When did Taylor get the rights to the Schrade naming rights? I did not realize (or forgot) after the closing, that anyone other than Taylor had the copyrights to the name. But now that you mention it Michael, I believe I do recall seeing those yellow knives in the SMKW catalogs.

I found this the other day when I was poking around looking for stuff related to this subject. It is the trademark info for Schrade Walden purchased by Taylor. I'm guessing that there may be more than one trademark filing for the stuff that Taylor bought? I didn't look up any other trademarks. The 881Y Schrade Walden Taylor I had was purchased in 2006.

On Monday, November 08, 2004, a U.S. federal trademark registration was filed for SCHRADE WALDEN by TAYLOR BRANDS, LLC, KINGSPORT, TN 37663. The USPTO has given the SCHRADE WALDEN trademark serial number of 78513068. The current federal status of this trademark filing is SECTION 8 & 15-ACCEPTED AND ACKNOWLEDGED. The correspondent listed for SCHRADE WALDEN is Robert O. Fox of LUEDEKA, NEELY & GRAHAM, P.C., P.O. BOX 1871, KNOXVILLE TN 37901 . The SCHRADE WALDEN trademark is filed in the category of Hand Tool Products . The description provided to the USPTO for SCHRADE WALDEN is pocket knives, hunting knives, collectors knives, survival knives, [ kitchen and utility knives, multiple tool pliers ].
http://www.trademarkia.com/schrade-walden-78513068.html

thawk · Feb 14, 2015

In particular this one. I had always felt this was made by Schrade USA for the 2004 Anniversary, but maybe not. I don't have any real solid information. I would be interested to handle one of these. It is hard to tell looking at the pictures if it has pinned bolsters or not. And I'd like to see the entire paper insert. I'd like to know who made it. I never purchased anything from 2004 or any of the replicas that have shown up from around the closing, nor anything I thought came from the reassembly of the parts purchased at the auction. Owning the end of days stuff never interested me.