Karambit Question

If you want to make folders... you'll need at least one vertical machining center.



I hope you have 3 phase!
 
Krissig12: Also, I think the real point of that handle on the Dart is just for retention, knuckledusting, and glass breaking.

That Dart was something I like the idea of & want to add to my collection, but I figure I'd need something a bit longer to reach the "quick-ending" stuff if I was using a straight blade. My reasoning is that, outside of the brain or spine, I would need to reach the kidneys, lungs, or heart (which is not necessarily something I could reach with a short blade to begin with, never mind if they're wearing thick clothes or have a lot of fat on them- they could even be wearing some form of body armor). A lot of people say that they thought they were just being punched when they were actually being stabbed, so ending the fight from pain might be tougher with a straight blade.

The same is true with the pain potentially not being enough with a slash. That slash might not even work because of not having a solid cutting platform (ex: clothing, fat, relaxed muscle- like when someone's NOT flexed-up solid like a statue). So, at the end of the day, I need to be able to end the fight with whatever I can hit from either pain or injury- somewhat like the idea of a shotgun. The karambit suits this & is something I could access with either hand. Plus, I don't have to worry about the blade closing on my fingers with the Spyderco.

Just wish I could find a video where someone's comparing the Fox & the Spyderco together, that way I could tell which one cuts better. Oh, we;;
 
Charlie Mike: Why on Earth would I need something like that?! Can't someone just forge the parts & rivet them together? I hope I can do it with less. Maybe I'll be able to get someone that does a lot of metalwork to make it.
 
[video=youtube;pnfm1oZ4MOs]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pnfm1oZ4MOs[/video]
 
Wolfeye said:
Charlie Mike: Why on Earth would I need something like that?! Can't someone just forge the parts & rivet them together? I hope I can do it with less. Maybe I'll be able to get someone that does a lot of metalwork to make it.
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There's a lot more to it than that. When I make lockbacks it's 10% forging (or less) and 90% filing and fiddling-and as a maker I will not touch a liner/framelock design with a ten foot pole-they're not very handwork friendly lockup wise (yes, it can be done but it's not time efficient). There are a number of previously offered production k-bits, and plenty of fixed blades production and custom to choose from.
 
Charlie Mike: Good idea on the mod, totally get what you're talking about. Why don't you like the Spyderco?
 
J W Bensinger: Really? Wow, I thought it was just a bit of assemble with some small parts. What about a lockback? For argument's sake, what about the design I mentioned way earlier? What would that be like?
 
Wolfeye said:
Charlie Mike: Good idea on the mod, totally get what you're talking about. Why don't you like the Spyderco?
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Same reason I don't like the Emerson. The finger ring is empty. Not even a spacer.
 
Charlie Mike said:
Same reason I don't like the Emerson. The finger ring is empty. Not even a spacer.
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as someone who owns a S-kbit from emerson...while the emerson looks like it'd be more forgiving in comfort with the empty finger ring, it's still not ideal and could definitely be better in that regard. Eventually I'll probably have pete gray or nath framelock mine and put a backspacer/punchring on it.
but yeah the spydie looks a lot more uncomfortable for that reason
 
Wolfeye said:
Krissig12: Also, I think the real point of that handle on the Dart is just for retention, knuckledusting, and glass breaking.

That Dart was something I like the idea of & want to add to my collection, but I figure I'd need something a bit longer to reach the "quick-ending" stuff if I was using a straight blade. My reasoning is that, outside of the brain or spine, I would need to reach the kidneys, lungs, or heart (which is not necessarily something I could reach with a short blade to begin with, never mind if they're wearing thick clothes or have a lot of fat on them- they could even be wearing some form of body armor). A lot of people say that they thought they were just being punched when they were actually being stabbed, so ending the fight from pain might be tougher with a straight blade.

The same is true with the pain potentially not being enough with a slash. That slash might not even work because of not having a solid cutting platform (ex: clothing, fat, relaxed muscle- like when someone's NOT flexed-up solid like a statue). So, at the end of the day, I need to be able to end the fight with whatever I can hit from either pain or injury- somewhat like the idea of a shotgun. The karambit suits this & is something I could access with either hand. Plus, I don't have to worry about the blade closing on my fingers with the Spyderco.

Just wish I could find a video where someone's comparing the Fox & the Spyderco together, that way I could tell which one cuts better. Oh, we;;
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What makes you think you don't have to worry about the Spyderco closing on you? It's just a lockback folder.

If that is really a huge concern to you then you should probably look at a fixed blade.
 
[video=youtube;Nvf4WZs3wJ4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nvf4WZs3wJ4[/video]
 
Charlie Mike,
Just coming to the forum but it seems that there is no quality out of the box folding K-bit that is user ready. It seems that most everything needs to be worked on to be effective. It would seem that the only solution would be to get a fixed blade or spend the time in modifications.

Chuck
 
^yep. You lose a lot of k-bit technique with the folders anyway, IMO. I haven't met a lock yet I'd use for trapping on a non-compliant opponent
 
Wolfeye said:
XxFULLPOWERxX: Sounds interesting. I'm actually looking for a folder, simply for legal issues (I'm in New York, one of the biggest ball-breaking states I know of with that). Still, I'll take a look at it. What's the name on it?
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RSK Deadman's Hand. Bought it from Karambit.com. It was a Blade 2015 exclusive. I had to pull some strings to get it, too. The blade is 2.5" on the cutting edge and single edge. It is a handful of knife, quarter inch thick carbon steel stock. The thing is a tank on the ring, and has ripping teeth on the spine. Posted it in the Exchange a few days ago. Check the pictures out there.

But to keep the conversation together, I agree that there aren't many good folders out there that can wave and yet still function as a good karambit. That is what drew me to fixed blades in the first place. It seems like one has to compromise something in order to gain functionality elsewhere.

The wave is a decent feature, but you have to ask why you feel you need it. If you want it to avoid having to drill deployment, you're already set to fail. With a karambit, you must have footwork, timing and conditioning. Situational awareness is better than any tool you might have.

Don't get me wrong, I favor karambits over most other knives because of my skill set, but I implore you, don't force something to fit your needs. It will only take longer and will frustrate you in the process.
 
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KBar666: Well, yeah- the lockback CAN fold onto your fingers, but I'm looking for something that isn't LIKELY to close just from your grip or from various forces moving it against your hand while using it. It's also got that blunt spot so it wouldn't cut your fingers if it did.

XxFULLPOWERxX: The wave is simply so I can get it operational quickly. No other reason, really. I just figure if you NEED it, you need it quickly. The multi-tool is more of a general tool, the karambit is like an all-around "escape knife." Seatbelts, dive straps, climbing rigs, getting out of a group attack- whatever. I imagine it wouldn't be too bad if a dog were to start locking & shaking, either. All these things happen when & if they happen, so I just figure it's good to have something that's useful for this on me- especially since a lot of things happen unexpectedly. So, if a situation seemlessly shifts this way- I can seemlessly handle it.
 
Wolfeye said:
XxFULLPOWERxX: The wave is simply so I can get it operational quickly. No other reason, really. I just figure if you NEED it, you need it quickly. The multi-tool is more of a general tool, the karambit is like an all-around "escape knife." Seatbelts, dive straps, climbing rigs, getting out of a group attack- whatever. I imagine it wouldn't be too bad if a dog were to start locking & shaking, either. All these things happen when & if they happen, so I just figure it's good to have something that's useful for this on me- especially since a lot of things happen unexpectedly. So, if a situation seemlessly shifts this way- I can seemlessly handle it.
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I maintain that whatever you get, drilling deployment and familiarity with it is better than anything flashy on YouTube. Much respect to Kuya Doug, but remember that he is there for advertisement.

It is extremely unlikely that anyone or anything will let you wave your knife open off of them. If you try it on yourself in an altercation, you risk cutting your wrist with your own knife. The wave was meant for pockets, even if it works with other clothing. For your situation, I would suggest the Fox 599 (since you seem to like it), Fox Chiroptera FX-590 (very useful and underrated karambit, IMO) and Emerson Combat Karambit (if the others won't do).

For what it is worth, I have owned the first two and have gotten rid of the 599 in favor of the 590. The ergonomics were nicer, I prefer the aluminum ring on the Chiroptera and orientation divots in the scales for grip changes. The 590 was created by Rich Derespina, a martial artist in collaboration with Fox. The knife overall is small and easy to carry, and probably closer to a reasonable price for you.

Fixed blade is still best and if you can get away with carrying one, I recommend that and frequently drilling deployment and adopting a situationally conscious mindset. A disclaimer: I do not know you personally and I mean no offense to anyone. I am not a Super Tuhon Ex - Deus Machina of the 8th trans-dimension of Mars, but if you don't have the footwork, training or intestinal fortitude to actually use it, don't waste your money and invest in some New Balance running shoes and/or a can of Sabre Red.

Best to you.
 
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Wolfeye said:
Hey, everyone. I've got a question: I'm looking to get a karambit, but I have a hard time picking between the Spyderco Kerahawk & the one from Fox Knives (whichever one is more portable, I don't remember the number). A major point is that I want to be able to flick it open against my sleeve like Doug Marcadia did in one of his videos. I'm leaning toward the Spyderco, but haven't been able to find much in the way of video comparisons. I was hoping for at least one cutting demonstration against a ham or something.

I know I can get them custom-forged at Karambit.com, but I don't have that kind of money right now & was looking to test out a couple that are already around for inspiration anyway. I think I'd really like the general style of the Spyderco, but would like a solid ring & dull metal. Maybe even a straight blade like the Dart.

Either way, I want a karambit for my collection & I'm not entirely sure which way to go. The Spyderco is about $50 more, but seems to be the better design. Anyone got experience with either or both?

P.S.- If anyone has any tricks for making that wave on the back of the Spyderco perform like I mentioned above, please let me know. That's a handy trick that I don't think you could get as reliably with a cable tie through the thumb hole (although that IS a useful trick).
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I went through a few to find the Karahawk. I had a Fox 599 (too big and a liner lock isn't nearly as safe), then lucked out on a cheap Bastinelli Kalinou fixed k-bit, which is also made by Fox and a beautiful piece. Very simple. However it was so curved that I couldn't use it as an every day knife. Didn't want to get the smaller version of the Fox folder because of the wait time and the only source they were available from. Lastly, the Cold Steel Tiger Claw isn't out yet and seems to have an even larger handle than the Fox.

That being said, the Karahawk is freakin awesome. Smaller blade, but then that is what you want in what amounts to a quick, concealable self defense knife. The wave is even more intuitive than a Fox or Emerson. Catches every time. The blade, which I thought looked stubby and almost blunted in pics, turned out to have a needle tip. The curve is just enough to make it useful as a slashing implement as intended, but I can easily use it in day to day tasks like a hawkbill, and it is quite easy to sharpen. The handle allows for both big mitts and small, since there is only a single indention for a finger besides the ring. The flat profile means that whether your hand is small or large, the knife is locked in place, like most spydercos, and won't twist or roll. The back lock instills a lot of confidence that the Fox was missing with the liner lock.

The only issue, which isn't really an issue, is the ring. It can be pushed together, but I highly doubt it would warp or anything similar unless put into a typical steel bending or breaking situation that would be bad enough to break the handle anyway. For me, it's just an aesthetic thing that I am going to work on by ordering something from spketch, either a spacer or standoff. I've modded mine a bit; ground down some areas to fit the profile of my hand better, but it was extremely comfortable to begin with. Buy one, don't even think twice.

Edit: I'm getting mine acid and stone washed by MMans0311. His work is in the Custom Shop section of this forum, as is the custom scale thread for spketch. I saw the $500 custom Karahawks and said f**k it, I'll grind it the way I want it, polish it back, and have it all tumbled into a dark stonewash finish. So, if you're brave, you can customize it yourself with the help of those two gentleman mentioned above.
 
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