KITH questions...

OK, that answers my questions. But I have to be honest and say it didn't reassure me very much.
BTW, you stated in your profile that your interest was "shredding the gnar", which is a skateboard term down here. BMXers probably use the same term.

All I can advise is - Make sure you get all the details worked out before you put it out for participation.....and KEEP IT SIMPLE!
I think many of us can remember the "Newbie Build Collaboration" fiasco.
I gave similar advise then, but they went with the plan anyway. It is probably a coincidence that the organizer was from Vancouver,too.

I'll just point out the possibility that some people may see it this way:
You are a new maker who has made three knives and designed seven knives.....which were built by other makers. You want to start a build project using your designs and have other, more experienced people build them. Then they will sell the knives and donate the money to a charity. Some may think this is a way for you to claim you are a designer - based on the work and efforts of others - and make claims like, "I designed the knives for the XYZ charity build-off where I raised $XXXX".
Again, I am not saying that this is the scenario, but some might think so.

The knife making community is a great bunch of folks, but when someone does something that gets a taint to it, the wrath can be really bad. A few years ago, a maker similar to you, ( with a lot more posts than knives he had built), made up a calendar with other folks knives. It was very well recieved....until they found out he had made a few bucks on the project. Now he is gone, and his reputation is sullied. I don't want this to happen to you, which is why I was cautioning an inexperienced person about such a project.

This is Stacy speaking now;
I would advise you to just set up a regular KITH and let folks have fun. I would not personally be interested in building a design that I had nothing to do with the development of.Also, anyone who actually makes knives knows that two weeks is a ridiculously short time to build a designer knife. I also think sales and KITHs are as far apart as you can get, and greatly dislike the idea of mixing them....even when charity is involved.

I'll step away as moderator and as Stacy now and let you do as you decide.
 
Perhaps I'm missing something, but I'll go out on a limb and say that this forum has never regulated an activity like this. Furthermore, I don't see any reason why it should. If Lorien decides he wants to start a project like this, that's his business. If it flops, so be it. Perhaps it will work out well! More importantly, I couldn't care less it a member started a project like this and turned out to have green teeth, voted for G. Gordon Liddy, or thinks that aliens abducted him. Who they are should have no bearing on whether or not they're allowed to start something like this! Why the hell should it make a single whit of difference if Lorien's a skateboarder, or a sun worshipper, or a frigging nudist?
Your comments here cast a far larger shadow than moderating, Stacy... last I checked, mods are supposed to moderate, not structure or regulate. Show concern if there's a fire, don't worry about one starting and hose the whole goddamn place down before someone gets the chance to strike a match!
 
I totally understand where you're coming from Stacy, I really, truly do.

All I can tell you is that I want to do this because I want to do it. I don't have any expectation for any reward other than that of accomplishing something interesting that other people might also benefit from, and enjoy being a part of. I greatly value being a contributor of community building, and I'll tell you straight up, that one of the reasons I want to do this is to become part of this particular community. Of course, in the long run, being a part of this community is going to be of benefit to me. Like it is to anyone already involved in it.

I don't do half assed; I either do something or I don't, there's no time for middle ground in any of my endeavours. The expression 'shreddin the gnar', well that's pretty much my mantra, when I'm out mountain biking or making a knife, or meeting an obstacle in life. I'm not a quitter, I enjoy work, and I'm no cheat. I'm an optimist, although Matthew felt it necessary to point out that I'm also a sun worshipping nudist:D. Thanks for letting the cat out of the bag, buddy!;):p

Because this has come up, I will not pursue it further without your blessing, Stacy. This is your forum, you have a lot invested in it and I respect that. I'm a newcomer and don't intend to disrupt the scene at all with my scene and I'll just back right off if that will keep the peace.:)

ps. the timeframe of 2 weeks is ridiculous by the sounds of it so 90 days or whatever is all good, shows how much I know!
 
Wait a minute - this is really starting to rile me up... this is NOT Stacy's forum. This is OUR forum!!!! There's no question that Stacy's contribution is considerable, and I respect that. However, the role of a moderator in this community is not to act as a program director. Christ, I've asked mods to take a role in threads that were spiraling into complete chaos only to be rebuked with statements of a "hands-off" policy of moderating. This is supposed to be an outlet for knifemakers to share and support one another.
Lorien, we've had this discussion before... you made as many knives last year as I did, give or take. My name appears in orange only because I opted to support this forum as a knifemaker. You've made knives, and you continue to make knives... by anyone's definition, that makes you a knifemaker, whether you elect to wear the mantel or not!

You have just as much right as ANY of us do to share on these forums, so long as what you're doing isn't abusive or illegal. If this was done for money it might be a different story, but your motives are clear. You just dig this stuff, and you want to share your passion with others that do, too.

If you want someone's permission, I suggest you bring it up with Spark - it's his forum that he graciously lets us call our own!
 
I don't want to talk anyone out of their idea but here is my $0.02...

I am interested in doing a KITH but would not like to be limited by an exact design. Maybe we could all do our take on the same "blank." A simple drop point or something most of us could pull off well could be presented in a printable silouette form. We could finish it however we want.
 
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Daniel Fairly Knives said:
I don't want to talk anyone out of their idea but here is my $0.02...

I am interested in doing a KITH but would not like to be limited by an exact design. Maybe we could all do our take on the same "blank." A simple drop point or something most of could pull off well could be presented in a printable silouette form. We could finish it however we want.
Click to expand...

I agree with Daniel, I am not big on "other peoples designs" at this stage in my knife making hobby. The one design example you gave would be something I would not personally spend time on. Not because it is not a good design, but because I am not interested in making knives with guards and hidden tangs. You will end up limiting the number of makers that would be willing to participate.

I can see where Stacy is coming from, If this is about you seeing your designs come to life by recruiting makers under the name of a KITH, it will probably not be a huge success (Participation wise). Why call it a KITH? Call it a "Charity Build Off" or something along those lines. Another concern is that you are providing the designs for this but the makers will be investing materials, shipping and a fair amount of time. When money is involved things tend to get muddy and feelings are easily hurt. Stacy is looking down the road, and voicing his concerns.

I Have read around the forums and there are a few that are dealing with Cancer, or other hardships, maybe these causes would be better received if the Charity remained in house. I would participate in this even if I had to make a Hidden tang and Guarded knife! :( If you do this "Charity Build off" Probably wouldn't be a good name.

If I am way off I apologize,
Ryan
 
I think the KITH idea is great. I would be interested in participating in something like this also, but lack the experience of alot of the other makers here. I plan on upgrading my account here this week, but still am unsure about how others would react to a "newbie" participating. I have no doubts about my abilities, but again....
 
I'm pretty sure this thing is not a KITH. I didn't really understand what a KITH was, which was why I started this thread. Stacy gave a great description of what a KITH is, and what I'm proposing is not that.

This is more of a 'build off'. I LOVE the idea of whatever funds the knives are able to raise, or a portion thereof, going to a community member in need. I do not specifically know anyone here who is in a dire situation, but if I did I think using an event like this to help them out is absolutely the right thing to do, as it might compel some of our more experienced makers to take part and really help someone out financially and spiritually:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:

Although I've stated that I'd prefer not to move forward unless everyone is cool with it, I have begun to draw the 3 patterns. Each will fit on a 1 3/4" wide surface and the overall length will be 9-10". The designs will be made to be interpreted easily using either full or hidden tang construction. In fact- the designs are made to be interpreted! The is no final judge who will say that what anyone did was wrong or right, but basing the finished knife at least closely to the design is something I'd personally like to see. I think we should think of this thing as being run by guidelines, not rules. If it gets run that is.

So far, the beginnings of a symmetrical boot dagger and a clip point hunter are coming to life on paper. Any suggestions for the third?
 
Matthew and Lorien,

I think you both are reading my posts wrong.

No One Need My Blessing to make a post ,start a thread, or start a KITH/group build/etc.

I was giving advise to a person who may be more eager than experienced.
Unless I typed a word different than I remember, I never said he couldn't do this. This is a public forum for those who join BF.
All I was trying to do was avoid a problem before one happened.

Over the years we all remember members who were very gung-ho to get things started, but didn't have the planning or foresight to see the pitfalls.
Least we should forget - pimpinsquee; JT; Scott
 
Ok, well, then I'm going to move forward with this. I do understand where you're coming from Stacy, and I guess I was more asking for your blessing. I know that I can do threads on pretty much whatever I want, wherever I want. That is the wonder of the internet. But for chivalry's sake, I don't want to go into this knowing that you are bothered by it.

If your concern is whether or not this will flop, then I can only assure you that I will do my best to ensure that it will not, and that it will be a benefit to those involved and to this forum.

Matt Gregory has already offered to help:D;)
 
I kinda like the idea of this. How about a necker for the third? I have built a few neck knives and rarely go hunting with out one around my neck and I'm sure there are quite a few hunters like me that usually wear one hunting.

PS I dig the design you posted first. A bit big for the style I like to build but I dug it just the same.
 
bladsmth said:
Least we should forget - pimpinsquee; JT; Scott
Click to expand...

If you have to dig back several months or years for examples, perhaps your concerns are overblown. On the other hand, if you're going to "call people out" you might consider using their full names, so they would know whether it's them to whom you refer, or one of the dozens of other rather common initials or first names that have come and gone. Just a thought.

EDIT: since I'm being all persnickety anyway, I'm pretty sure the phrase is "lest we forget." But I could be wrong... again.
 
madness522 said:
I kinda like the idea of this. How about a necker for the third? I have built a few neck knives and rarely go hunting with out one around my neck and I'm sure there are quite a few hunters like me that usually wear one hunting.

PS I dig the design you posted first. A bit big for the style I like to build but I dug it just the same.
Click to expand...

a necker, eh? Well I'm not opposed to the idea specifically, however I have it in mind that these three designs will be approximately the same size. If you used super thin stock and were aggressive with your drill press, you might come up with a neck knife....
 
I wasn't calling anyone out, I was giving examples of people that the regulars on this forum would know.

Pimpinsquee was J. McDonald - He had great plans, and lots of ideas.....but didn't get anything done. He hasn't posted in over a year. His last project was a floating bow hunting knife.....which I don't think ever got completed.

JT is known by all here who have been around for at least two years. He was going off in a different direction every two days. He didn't finished a lot of things. He hasn't posted in a year. He got over his head with orders and projects and things sort of fell apart.

Scott is Scott Ickes who ran the Newbie Collaboration. It fell apart not because of his mismanagement, but because it got too large and complex. I don't think he has posted in a year either. Scott is a great guy and caught a lot of flack for something that wasn't really his fault - but he was the one who set it up and ran it.
His build project was the most like this project, and there ended up being too many, " Hey, why don't we add this...and that...and this as well..." , until it got so out of hand that no one even knew where the three pieces being built were. That is why I cautioned against someone who hasn't run anything like this not to get too complex on a build project. The more that is involved, the more that can go wrong.

All these folks are nice guys, just victims of poor planning.

You are correct, the archaic form of least is lest....both are correct. Lest we forget is a preserved phrase that still gets modern use.

Lest we waste any more time, I am leaving this build project to Lorien and Gregory.
 
Well, I guess the best way to start this would be to begin with a poll... give Lorien a few days to discuss this with me, and we'll start another thread with a couple of pertinent questions.
 
Stacy, I'm glad we could clear that up.

Matthew and Lorien, I wish you the best. I doubt I'll be able to participate, but I'll watch with interest.
 
bladsmth said:
You are correct, the archaic form of least is lest....both are correct. Lest we forget is a preserved phrase that still gets modern use.

Lest we waste any more time, I am leaving this build project to Lorien and Gregory.
Click to expand...

Haha. I laughed out loud at the word archaic, that word is ruined for me! I could probably go knock on JT's door if anyone is interested, I believe he is in my neck of the woods! I have talked to him and seems to be a nice guy. I remember the Center Scribe overwhelming him a year or so ago.

I will also be watching this thread and may be interested in participating depending on what the designs are like...
 
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