KMG's next level ???

greatlakeswaterjet said:
Just wait till you see the new grinder(s) we will have out soon:rolleyes: Cad is done. Probally start producing the prototype next month. 10 are already pre-sold. All I will say is you will never need to buy another attachment or another grinder.;)
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Me I have more info about that?
 
When I looked for a new grinder I had narrowed it down to between the KMG and the Dozier. I spoke with both, loved what both offered but went with the KMG and the Map arm in the end. The KMG isn't on a stand or portable by any stretch of the imagination but portable is not something I needed or wanted. With my limited space the pedestal would take up valued room where the KMG sits on my existing table which is also holding other equipment I need it for.

Personally I find that the Map arm is quite nice but its easier for me to leave it set up at a specific angle for either dovetailing or making a lock contact on a frame lock blade rather than move it to different settings before finishing all my needs at the setting its on. So normally I try to make sure I do all I need to do at any setting its at for a specific job before moving it to a new one. If there is one draw back with the MAP arm in my opinion it is that I do find its a bit harder to manipulate than I'd prefer at times. I do seem to have to 'wrestle' it at times to get it to a new setting and since it requires repeated checking and rechecking the pitch angle setting to make sure its where you want it because turning the wrench to tighten a screw can sometimes move the table moving it can sometimes take longer than other times. I love the table and the versatility of it and I do feel its a fine add on to the KMG though so don't get me wrong I just find its not a quick thing to move it to a new setting at times. It was well worth the money paid though and I do think it makes the KMG more complete.

If there was something to 'step up the KMG' that would make it more complete its a more easily maniuplated adustable table than one Mike already came up with. One with a built in dial of some kind to take away having to use a manual pitch angle reader, or some quick release type levers instead of needing a wrench come to mind. Its a tall order to fill though, and what Mike offers is the best available currently based on what I've seen.

Speaking of the flat work table that is made by KMG, I will say I find reason to use it often enough. In cases where I need a flat work surface at zero pitch I leave the MAP arm where its set at for the reasons mentioned above. What I do is I simply pull the MAP arm out and store it in the tool rack still set at the pitch angle its at and in a few secs finger tighten the original KMG work table down using the wing screws I got for it and use that easier than changing the angle of the MAP arm to a zero setting.

Bob Dozier's grinder is a nice grinder. I know some guys that love it and the KMG and have both in their shops and you hear mixed feelings about both. Course these are the older grinder by Bob though. Dan is the only person I know to have one of the new ones. No one machine does it all I don't think.

Ok, lastly. Why did I buy the KMG and not some other grinder???
Well, its like this. For me the decision on which machine to get was finally decided over one little thing that stood out to me like a single star in the heavens on a clear night and that was the number of guys that supported it over any other grinder when I asked them for their thoughts. During my search I lost count of how many times I heard from other makers mouths or keyboards things like, 'don't waste your time with anything else, buy the KMG' and I can't say I heard but a handful of other names about other machines from a handful of other makers. One maker recommened Bob's machine but said the air hose was a bit of a draw back for some, two said get the Bader or the KMG and one said a Square Wheel if I could find an older one. The rest were all KMG recommendations and there were many.

STR
 
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Would a vertical buttress-threaded rod work better than a spring for tensioning because you can adjust the tightness?
 
NickWheeler said:
I am with my good friend Fitz on this... Kanter and Caffrey are offering these options, so I see no need for Rob to tool up for them.

I do appreciate people's suggestions though.

Also, keep in mind that anything you might think of WOULD affect the cost of the machine.
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Good point and price had something to do with my decision also. I can't tell you exactly what I paid but I can tell you that what I got from KMG and what I got from Mike in the purchase from him on the MAP arm still ended up being less than other machines I was pricing.

I like the way it is now and can use the crap out of it for many years. I'd like to see Mike and Ed and KMG come together on some kind of arrangement to bring them all in one place for one bill but thats not the way it has to be to get it all. The fact that they are available is all that really matters in the end.

STR
 
Rob,

Your comments on the tool rest and the Burr King litigation issue hits pretty close to home.
A company I used to work for had a Burr King in the shop. I was using it to clean up the business end of a screw driver when it was caught between the tool rest and the contact wheel. It pulled my hand down against the tool rest (pinching it betweeen the screw driver handle and the tool rest) smashing my left index finger, breaking it several places and literally exploding the flesh from the middle knuckle forward.
I thought I had lost half my finger. The doctor at the hospital thought so as well when he first looked at, but managed to put most of it back together.
I never considered sueing Burr King as I figured it was my fault (brain fart), but I guess I could have.

As to taking the KMG to the next level....

I've had a KMG for several years and find precious little to complain about. It is a GREAT machine.
Ed Caffrey's opinions pretty well mirror my own.

-Mike-
 
fitzo said:
Caffrey sells the platen and Kanter sells the MAP arm. So, why is it so terrible if Rob elects not to make them? They're available in the aftermarket.
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In no way do I want to be disrespectful but to me the platen is way over priced. They are well over $600 with tooling arm & shipping. That's $100+ more than the rotary platen which is a much more complex tool. If Rob could make the rotary platen for about $480 w/arm. He sure could make this platen for a lot less but those are the breaks. Ya win some and lose some. Never said life was fair. :grumpy:
 
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Not trying to start any argument, but in my mind I wouldn't say the rotary platen is more complex than the MAP arm. From a builder's standpoint, if I were going to attempt a project build, I would (almost did) complete a rotary platen over the MAP arm. There are several more custom machined parts going into the MAP arm vs. the rotary platen is basically bolt-together that can be done with a minimum of machining. I remember when Michael was attempting to put together prices for a production run. He checked out several sources and put the best price he could for the amount of work/profit he was expecting.

If I had a "want" on the list for the KMG, I would also like a more versatile work rest. Even simply a rest in which the angle to belt can be easily adjusted like suggested earlier as opposed to the rotation in horizontal.

From all I see, all the machines mentioned here are wonderfully built tools which perform very well as supplied. I like the KMG for the versatility it offers with a somewhat cheaper tag. AC vs. DC doesn't make a difference to me, nor does belt vs. direct drive. I actually like the freedom of a belt drive. If the belt is slipping, it's time for a new belt or a tension adjustment. It's my thought that the work rest on the KMG could be easily modified if one set their mind to it.

To everyone out there producing tools for us nutto knife makers....thank you! Oh, and I'm also curious to see what David at GLWJ has up his sleeve. Spill the beans!!

--nathan
 
silver_pilate said:
Not trying to start any argument, but in my mind I wouldn't say the rotary platen is more complex than the MAP arm. From a builder's standpoint, if I were going to attempt a project build, I would (almost did) complete a rotary platen over the MAP arm. There are several more custom machined parts going into the MAP arm vs. the rotary platen is basically bolt-together that can be done with a minimum of machining. I remember when Michael was attempting to put together prices for a production run. He checked out several sources and put the best price he could for the amount of work/profit he was expecting.

If I had a "want" on the list for the KMG, I would also like a more versatile work rest. Even simply a rest in which the angle to belt can be easily adjusted like suggested earlier as opposed to the rotation in horizontal.

From all I see, all the machines mentioned here are wonderfully built tools which perform very well as supplied. I like the KMG for the versatility it offers with a somewhat cheaper tag. AC vs. DC doesn't make a difference to me, nor does belt vs. direct drive. I actually like the freedom of a belt drive. If the belt is slipping, it's time for a new belt or a tension adjustment. It's my thought that the work rest on the KMG could be easily modified if one set their mind to it.

To everyone out there producing tools for us nutto knife makers....thank you! Oh, and I'm also curious to see what David at GLWJ has up his sleeve. Spill the beans!!

--nathan
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My post has nothing to do with the MAP arm. My opinion on that is that it is super tool at an AWESOME price. Hopefully I can swing one in the near future.
 
DOPE! :foot: Sorry, read the quoted text and got the ideas confused in my head. On better news, I was able to grind out a couple of blades in the shop this evening. :)

--nathan
 
I've owned a KMG for about a month.

1. It needs to come assembled. You should be able to unpack it and plug it in. It's kind of annoying to spend a few hours assembling your new grinder, when all you want to do is make sparks.

2. Paint it. After a week, the whole unit rusts. This is one of my main issues with the KMG.

3. Direct drive.

4. Proper tension arm; it's hard to get leverage.

5. The tool rest needs to be redesigned.

6. Upgrade the hardware. Quality washers on everything, and speed knobs on commonly adjusted points.
 
I get what Rob is saying on the tool rest. That being said, here is what I did on mine. I have some long studs threaded into the tool arm and use wing nuts to tighten it up so I don't need a tool to adjust it in or out of the way. If I want to adjust the rest down I loosen up the wing nuts and install shims I made with slots to match the studs. I have a couple shims of 1/2", 3/8", 1/4" and 1/8". I can drop the height of my tool rest by over 2" if I want and it only takes a minute. If for some reason I wanted the rest higher I could turn the tool arm over and then shim up to what ever height I want.

Also by having a slot about 2 1/4" wide and about 1/4" deep in the contact side of the rest lets it nests around the platen or wheel and about all you can get stuck between the belt and the rest is a blade tip. I guess you could get the belly of a blade stuck in there if you ground edge down.

On the tension arm I added a pivoting extension made out of 2x2x 1/4" thick angle that attaches and pivots on the hole where the old handle went, the handle to the angle the old handle is attached to the angle and it all flips over to give me way more leverage to push down on the spring to change belts.

On the tracking knob I welded a 4" piece of 1/4" round stock acrossed the knob head so I can grab it and turn it easier when I want to change tracking.

You could take about 8 lb off an 18" arm assembly by making them out of 3/8" walled 2" tube instead of square stock. I should have thought of that before I bought 12' off solid sq stock and cut it up for arms. I did have to clean them up a bit with a 9' grinder to get them to slide in and out easily.
 
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I think it is kind of funny that "ElectricZombie" brought this thread back from the dead.
Stacy
 
ElectricZombie said:
I've owned a KMG for about a month.
6. Upgrade the hardware. Quality washers on everything,
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I have to say, I thought the same thing for about a second. You'll notice that all the bolts are grade 5, but all the washers are grade 8. The harder GR8 washers offer a great continuous bearing surface, the bolts will wear before the washers do and they work nicely to keep the bolts from wearing out and galling the machine bits. Also using GR5 bolts on everything, you run a much less chance of stripping out the holes drilled and tapped in the machine itself. All the bolts are coarse thread for speed of putting them in and out also.
 
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