Knife authenticity

I think they knowingly leave the flaws in place because it's not cost effective to make them better. They're trying to sell the fakes to the uninformed masses, not folks like us who know what a real CRK looks and feel like.
 
It is generally not the sellers that can make the choice how the "product" is made. But, it is their revenue from selling these things we can stop. The more it is made public, the less the general population gets screwed. If people can counterfeit money to the point we have to keep changing/adding methods to prevent them from doing so, CRK paperwork would be a breeze if they cared that much. Copying the specs of a knife isn't that hard.

If I can get a 3D printer to make a perfect fit high capacity magazine for a an AR-15 or AK-47 rifle possible (and we know it is) is making an almost perfect copy of knife really that difficult.

I think they put just enough imperfections in to a consumer product to make it distinguishable from a high dollar Gen. Why not point it out?

I am probably not going to convince anyone that has been doing the same thing over and over again and likes things to work a certain way. I am just trying to make this valuable knowledge readily available to almost everyone who cares before that lose their hard earned money.

It's always good to practice the how's and why's different forums do things. Not every suforum on this site does the same as the CRK forum..The choice to point it out or not is largely a personal choice that some people have made..Validity be damned, there isn't a large leap from some of the clones to the real thing and it's the little mistakes that are giving them away. It really wouldn't matter if there was a side by side comparison in the stickies above along with a description..People by their nature will come in and ask "is this a clone", "is this a fake" "what do you think about MY knife".
I personally am not going to give out the reasons I believe some of these are clones, fakes etc on an open forum. In my opinion, there is no reason to help anyone make a better copy.
Yes, the technology exists to copy something exactly and they will get to that point, but without my help.

The biggest problem I have with some of this argument is my money requires my research. For example, If I don't want to buy a counterfeit knife, I will go to a reputable source rather than off the auction sites or some of the seedier sides of the internet. I will ask questions from those that know more than I on the subject matter.. If I have to send a pm..whatever; It's a pm that takes me no more time than to type it out if someone is willing to share for my ~$500.00 investment/purchase/splurge.

There is a world of difference between a 3D printed part and a machined part..a very big world. Not even sure how that fits?
 
I just want to point out, most of the fakes on the big auction sites do not try to pass themselves off as the real thing. They say they are Sebenza style or similar. There is a massive market for knock-offs. There are even whole community sites for the fake watch lovers. People want the status etc without the bill.

It's easy to filter them out in a search, set a minimum price to $200 or $250. You won't see many fakes in that range. It's not worth time worrying about.
 
I just want to point out, most of the fakes on the big auction sites do not try to pass themselves off as the real thing. They say they are Sebenza style or similar. There is a massive market for knock-offs. There are even whole community sites for the fake watch lovers. People want the status etc without the bill.

It's easy to filter them out in a search, set a minimum price to $200 or $250. You won't see many fakes in that range. It's not worth time worrying about.

That is true, but as I cruised the CRK offerings on the auction site yesterday, I was caught off guard when I noticed a blatant fake with a buy it now price of $795... Seriously ? As I looked at it, I wondered, will someone really pay the price for this thing ? I hope not.

My knowledge of CRK's is still very limited, so I won't buy except from an authorized dealer, or a reputable member here on BF's.
I'm no different than most people, I like to save money, but I would rather pay a little extra and know for certain I got exactly what I thought I was buying.
 
Just last week I seen a small annual for $450 on ebay. I have seen fake annuals, so had to check. I went through the pics and seen it was genuine, when I hit buy it now, it said it had just been sold. Missed a deal by seconds. But I would rather have missed it than get stuck with a $450 piece of garbage. Gotta check always these days, ask for lots of pics if unsure and as always, you can ask many of us here on Bladeforums.
 
Just last week I seen a small annual for $450 on ebay. I have seen fake annuals, so had to check. I went through the pics and seen it was genuine, when I hit buy it now, it said it had just been sold. Missed a deal by seconds. But I would rather have missed it than get stuck with a $450 piece of garbage. Gotta check always these days, ask for lots of pics if unsure and as always, you can ask many of us here on Bladeforums.

Another one last week? Damn, I need to pay more attention over there! :eek:
 
Just last week I seen a small annual for $450 on ebay. I have seen fake annuals, so had to check. I went through the pics and seen it was genuine, when I hit buy it now, it said it had just been sold. Missed a deal by seconds. But I would rather have missed it than get stuck with a $450 piece of garbage. Gotta check always these days, ask for lots of pics if unsure and as always, you can ask many of us here on Bladeforums.

I've done the same thing before. It was on Benchmades, not CRK's, but I feel your pain :D I always kick myself after the fact, but if I have any doubt at all, I wait.
I did make an exception yesterday though. A Benchmade I have been looking for came up with a decent buy it now price, crappy pictures, and almost no description, but the seller has great feedback and it just felt right, so I jumped on it. I don't think it was on there for 5 minutes...
I guess we will see in a few days if I did good, or if I have a new paper weight :D

That's one of the great things about BF's, there are some very knowledgeable members in each of the manufacturers subforums, and I've always found them to be more than willing to answer questions...
I've spent quit a bit of time here learning about CRK's and enjoying the pictures. One of these days I will shock everyone and actually buy one lol...

Another one last week? Damn, I need to pay more attention over there! :eek:

No you don't... Nothing to see over there :D
 
No you don't... Nothing to see over there :D

:D :D :D :D :D :D

Sebenza_zpslehpns6r.jpg
 
That is exactly what I mean. I have been doing this a LONG time across knives, watches, high dollar collectibles, etc.

If they REALLY wanted to, you would not be able to tell the difference between a Gen and a clone. They are not that stupid (even if you think they are). I have seen them make a REALLY close copy of a $7K Rolex. So much so that you almost need to take the casing off of the back to make sure it was a fake. Why couldn't they do it with a sub $500 knife???

We are not telling them something that they already don't know (the manufactures of these fakes) . The ONLY thing pointing out the flaws does is keep dishonest sellers from scamming innocent people out of their hard earned money.

Other forums do this for items that cost $7K or more. Here it is a close secret for items that cost less than 1/10th of that. I guess I just don't understand. It is almost like secret that only the elite die-hard CRK fans think they know and will share if you send them a private IM. Screw that, put it out there for everyone to see. That would stop so many of the questions I see on this forum. Make it a sticky post and that would stop most of the slimy sellers from even trying to pass of fakes as gens.

They have more low cost per hour engineering talent than we could even begin to shake a stick at. If they can copy some of the most sophisticated computing equipment and software we have, they can copy a knife.

I couldn't agree more... I guess some people like to think they are crime fighters you know... I'm always amazed that there are people who think other people are better off with less information... It was the same thing with sold knives posts here on BF replacing the selling price with SOLD, and many argued it is better for everyone else not to know what the price was... What can I say...

Gaston
 
Interesting topic.
I can understand both ways to deal with it.
Maybe the original price of the product influences how much effort is laid in the copy.
 
I don't worry too much about fakes. Simply buy from authorized sellers or trusted forum members and enjoy.
 
I couldn't agree more... I guess some people like to think they are crime fighters you know... I'm always amazed that there are people who think other people are better off with less information... It was the same thing with sold knives posts here on BF replacing the selling price with SOLD, and many argued it is better for everyone else not to know what the price was... What can I say...

Gaston

Careful with the words you choose..Someone may take offense to them.


Here is an idea for you and anyone else that needs it. Nobody is saying YOU cannot educate yourself and post the information that you have obtained. I have stated it before and I will state it again. It's a personal choice for everyone. Calling members that make the choice NOT to post, names or otherwise, is really uncalled for..Most of the members here share their information freely..Respect their choice if they have chosen not to post what you want them to in a public forum and they will respect the choice of those that do want to post the information.
 
Careful with the words you choose..Someone may take offense to them.


Here is an idea for you and anyone else that needs it. Nobody is saying YOU cannot educate yourself and post the information that you have obtained. I have stated it before and I will state it again. It's a personal choice for everyone. Calling members that make the choice NOT to post, names or otherwise, is really uncalled for..Most of the members here share their information freely..Respect their choice if they have chosen not to post what you want them to in a public forum and they will respect the choice of those that do want to post the information.

Thank you!
 
I have to assume that anyone counterfeiting a Sebenza, for example, has a genuine Sebenza in their hands to copy from. Are you really going to point out something from a few internet pictures that they can't already see from holding the REAL one and their COUNTERFEIT example in their own hands and comparing them? I doubt it. It really only serves to keep info from those of us who are new to the brand and have not handled dozens or hundreds of CRKs already, and may not pick up on the tiny details as yet.

I may be new to BF but I am a long-time member and a Moderator at CPF and I have seen many such threads on clones or copies of Surefires, McGizmos, SPYs, you name it. As enthusiasts, we have to help protect each other, and that is by freely sharing information and expertise.

While I don't necessarily like it myself, of course people may choose to share info as they see fit. If it is generally accepted that such info will not be posted openly, and should be shared via PM, I guess that's how it will be. If so, then I would propose a service we had on CPF, which was a "Yellow Pages": a sticky where modders and builders listed things they could do or were willing to give information about to those who had projects they were struggling with. In this case, it could be a sticky where there would simply be a list of members who are CRK experts and are willing to be contacted privately by PM or email to assist with purchases on questionable knives. If they are especially knowledgeable on a specific model or vintage, note that as well. Then instead of these threads, which it appears people don't care for, members could simply look at the list, and quietly contact a member on the list to get the help they need.

Seems like something like that might be helpful to all involved.
 
I can see both sides of this. But to me there are so many fakes already out there I personally feel like it would help to clearly point out why a fake is a fake. Just my opinion.
 
I think everybody who is able to point out the reasons one of these knives are fake has been willing to share the information privately. There is no question about restricting any information.
If a forum member prefers to share the information privately, then nobody should have any problem with that.

I am not going to ask anybody to post information that they would not be comfortable posting on an open forum.

Like the price thing, I like seeing prices, so I tend to leave them after I sell my knives and close my threads, but it is not my place to tell others how to run their threads.
 
Just like nbp, I'm new here but have been a member of CPF for over 12 years. I agree with all he has said and have seen my share of fakes there. That said, I also agree with others who don't want to give details here that could help counterfeiters. I want to help those who need help buying genuine CRK's, but not help the counterfeiters.

I guess I just don't know what is best to do except to say that I also only buy CRK's from authorized sources or trusted BF members. I might find better deals or better finds elsewhere, but I'm not willing to take that risk.
 
That is exactly what I mean. I have been doing this a LONG time across knives, watches, high dollar collectibles, etc.

If they REALLY wanted to, you would not be able to tell the difference between a Gen and a clone. They are not that stupid (even if you think they are). I have seen them make a REALLY close copy of a $7K Rolex. So much so that you almost need to take the casing off of the back to make sure it was a fake. Why couldn't they do it with a sub $500 knife???

We are not telling them something that they already don't know (the manufactures of these fakes) . The ONLY thing pointing out the flaws does is keep dishonest sellers from scamming innocent people out of their hard earned money.

Other forums do this for items that cost $7K or more. Here it is a close secret for items that cost less than 1/10th of that. I guess I just don't understand. It is almost like secret that only the elite die-hard CRK fans think they know and will share if you send them a private IM. Screw that, put it out there for everyone to see. That would stop so many of the questions I see on this forum. Make it a sticky post and that would stop most of the slimy sellers from even trying to pass of fakes as gens.

They have more low cost per hour engineering talent than we could even begin to shake a stick at. If they can copy some of the most sophisticated computing equipment and software we have, they can copy a knife.

It is a sad state of affairs that fakes are everywhere. As a watch collector, the few times I have purchased rare used pieces, I immediately go to my watch maker and have him open it up and check it out. I have seen fakes of Rolex, Patek, Breitling, Omega, Cartier etc. I am sure there are plenty of knife copies out there but the profit is lower. Sad part is that some fakes are really good and cold stand on their own if they had good branding and weren't an exact copy.
 
to quote Justice Louis Brandeis - "...Sunlight is said to be the best of disinfectants; electric light the most efficient policeman."

What is obviously wrong with this knife:
1) the blade grinds
2) the screw heads
3) the box
4) the leather slipsheath
5) the printing on the warranty card
6) the lanyard knot

There a few minor details that look "odd" but these are what jump out at me right away.

It's too bad that all we can do is report this stuff, and maybe it will get taken down before someone less skeptical gets scammed.
 
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