Knifenews reports about Amazon and counterfeits

[Yo Mama]

Direct from Amazon is pretty damn safe.
I've had great luck with it.

Just got a Byrd Robin 2 G-10 in the mail from them yesterday.
I guess I could have bought it somewhere else, and paid $12 shipping on a $33 knife that I was buying for my upcoming trip to Chicago, where I wanted a cheap knife in case the cops there decide to take it despite it being under their length limit.

Or, I could do like I did, and get a genuine knife, plus a movie for less than it would have cost for the knife plus shipping from elsewhere in Canada.

If you're buying a $500 knife, then the $12 shipping charge from somewhere else isn't that big of a deal.

Only problem I have with direct from amazon is that people can order, and then return a fake, Amazon has no clue and sends it on to the next purchaser. Where as bladehq for example I would hope they have the knowledge to look over the knife that gets returned before sending on to the next order.

In the end, I started my knife buying on Amazon only, now it would take a whole lot for me to still use them for blades.

Be safe in Chicago land my friend!

 

[GrReaper]

So let me get this straight... the study had nothing to do with knives, the study was on third party marketplace... and yet you're hating on amazon? I always find it pathetic how this forum seems to hate on amazon. It also mentioned other companies, why not list them? I've bought about 10 knives from amazon directly, sold and shipped by amazon themselves and never received a counterfeit. There is a difference between the amazon third-party marketplace and buying from amazon themselves. When ever there is a return policy, there is a risk that you can get a counterfeit... that is just the fact of life, no matter the website. For Americans, this may be hard to understand, but Amazon is one of the few places where we can actually buy decent knives. We don't have a lot of good options. Frankly, I feel like this is an Amazon bashing thread without much substance.

It's not amazon bashing, at least not without some merit. There were news stories recently about how amazon was co-mingling items in its warehouses. Items being sold by third party sellers with shipping by amazon were being mixed up with items sold directly by amazon. So even if you buy direct from amazon, and not from a third party seller, you could end up with a fake, according to those news sources. I have not had any bad experiences from amazon so far, but I do limit knife purchases now to authorized dealers, unless amazon is the only place to get what I'm looking for.

 

[Gideons]

Deleted.

 

[Misthailin]

You would have to know it’s a fake... but if you did happen to get a fake, either of the places mentioned would take care of you. I have not received any fake or off quality items myself.

 

[craytab]

What you are saying is like, if you hire a local electrician or plumber to run some pipe or wire up your new garage, and they screw you... you deserve what you get for hiring the guy who screwed you, instead of the guy who did the job correctly.

If you didn't do your research on the plumber or electrician to make sure they are certified or insured or whatever then you deserve what you get and the hassle of getting the law involved to take care of the issue.

Yes, I did, but I felt it was important to dispel the notion that 'direct from amazon' was somehow safe.

A fact most people here already know.

...Also, if you want to make a comment about something I explained on another thread, then make that comment on the other thread. Trying to dredge it up here is poor form

It is pertinent to your posts in this discussion because perhaps you are not the most trustworthy source of information on the topic of this thread: buying counterfeits.

Direct from Amazon is pretty damn safe.

Pretty safe but less safe than buying from an actual knife dealer. I've had good luck on Amazon as well but I would never buy the more counterfeited knives like a PM2 or a DF2 H1.

It's good to know that some amazon purchases work out without a hitch. For me, personally, I just don't trust they have done enough to correct the situation at a systemic level (esp. as it relates to knives)... and they are on Trump's sh*t list now, so that must make them bad right? ;-p

Most Amazon purchase work out fine, not just some. No need to be hyperbolic. The problem with Amazon for our niche market is they don't just deal with knives so they don't really know any better. It is not worth it for them to invest the time to know how to deal knives safely. Much less costly to just pass off a counterfeit and deal with the consequences if caught down the line. The knife dealers that support this forum know their products and know what they are doing. And with many companies going to a MAP type pricing, you really don't save money buying from amazon. For most of us it is worth the few bucks more to have peace of mind and buy from our supporting dealers.

Also, read the rules. This is not the place for political crap.

So let me get this straight... the study had nothing to do with knives, the study was on third party marketplace... and yet you're hating on amazon? I always find it pathetic how this forum seems to hate on amazon. It also mentioned other companies, why not list them? I've bought about 10 knives from amazon directly, sold and shipped by amazon themselves and never received a counterfeit. There is a difference between the amazon third-party marketplace and buying from amazon themselves. When ever there is a return policy, there is a risk that you can get a counterfeit... that is just the fact of life, no matter the website. For Americans, this may be hard to understand, but Amazon is one of the few places where we can actually buy decent knives. We don't have a lot of good options. Frankly, I feel like this is an Amazon bashing thread without much substance.

There is a lot to hate on amazon about, them passing off counterfeits and clones is indeed one of them. This forum is anti counterfeit and clone. Amazon sells counterfeits (unkowingly perhaps) and sells clones (knowingly). That is not good for this community and hobby. That bad outweighs the good you claim. If you can't see that I feel sorry for you. Sorry you can't get a reasonably priced wide selection of knives where you live but that is not a reason to give Amazon a pass and call the way this forum denounces Amazon for selling clones/counterfeits as "pathetic".

Only problem I have with direct from amazon is that people can order, and then return a fake, Amazon has no clue and sends it on to the next purchaser. Where as bladehq for example I would hope they have the knowledge to look over the knife that gets returned before sending on to the next order.

In the end, I started my knife buying on Amazon only, now it would take a whole lot for me to still use them for blades.

Be safe in Chicago land my friend!

Exactly the reason to buy from a legit dealer like the ones that support BFC. Chances of getting a returned counterfeit from them is near zero.

 

[rje58]

Really? That is an incredibly broad and sweeping statement, one to which you added no qualifiers. What about people who purchase a "New in Box - Catch and Release" off the Exchange, from a fellow Gold or Platinum member? What about people who are lucky enough to have access to an authorized dealer at a brick-and-mortar shop that isn't a Bladeforums supporting dealer? You think that those transactions could never possibly go wrong, or encounter a problem of any kind?

I feel sure that there are forum users who sold a knife here on the Exchange that was counterfeit or misrepresented or otherwise compromised and didn't even know it. Just as I feel sure that at one time or another, a brick-and-mortar authorized dealer took a compromised return from someone and resold it, unaware of what had happened. Yes, it could even happen with a Bladeforums supporting dealer! Is it less likely than from a big box, like The River? Sure - but your sweeping statement was unconditional.

I agree that Bladeforums users should consider supporting dealers first when purchasing a new knife, but to say that, quote: "... anybody here who buys from anybody other than one of our supporting dealers deserves what they get..." in case that they encounter any kind of issue seems pretty outlandish to me.

And, yes, push comes to shove anybody here who buys from anybody other than one of our supporting dealers deserves what they get.

 

[Misthailin]

If you didn't do your research on the plumber or electrician to make sure they are certified or insured or whatever then you deserve what you get and the hassle of getting the law involved to take care of the issue.

In this instance, your contractor is licensed, bonded, and insured. Amazon 3rd party sellers have reviews, and Amazon is your insurance.

Many people wouldn’t have a clue if a plumber or electrician were doing stuff to code... and they wouldn’t find out until next guy came through and said, “what joker did this?”

 

[craytab]

In this instance, your contractor is licensed, bonded, and insured.

And it is your responsibility to make sure you higher some one who is all of those things, like buying from a reputable knife dealer.

Amazon 3rd party sellers have reviews, and Amazon is your insurance.

And there is the problem. Amazon knows as much about spotting counterfeit knives as the average person who hasn't done any research on the subject. Reputable knife dealers, like the ones who support this forum, don't pass on fakes. Buy from a reputable dealer and you your self do not have to become an expert on spotting counterfeits.

 

[Misthailin]

My main point on the issue, is that it doesn’t matter if you research, don’t research, the possibility of being ripped off always exists, and that anyone paying for a good or service, regardless of where they buy it from... when someone is paying for something, NOBODY deserves to be ripped off. This whole you deserve what you get attitude Is not a good one.

You have good feedback cray... if you started shipping out only fakes tomorrow would these people deserve what they got? No.

 

[benchwarmer380]

My main point on the issue, is that it doesn’t matter if you research, don’t research, the possibility of being ripped off always exists, and that anyone paying for a good or service, regardless of where they buy it from... when someone is paying for something, NOBODY deserves to be ripped off. This whole you deserve what you get attitude Is not a good one.

You have good feedback cray... if you started shipping out only fakes tomorrow would these people deserve what they got? No.

I agree wholeheartedly that nobody deserves to be ripped off.

They are basically saying, "fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me". New folks to the hobby don't know what they don't know so they have much less control and lack the knowledge to avoid stepping into situations like this. Folks that have been around the block are generally more knowledgeable about the products they are purchasing and places to purchase from. If you are in the latter group and decide to use a place that is known to occasionally (purposefully or accidentally) sell you an improper product because you'll save a few bucks instead of spending a little more for the assurance that that will be far less likely to happen, then while you may not be at fault or deserve blame (because you should get what you pay for), you don't deserve as much sympathy or have much ground to stand on to complain than the new person that doesn't know any better.

 

[craytab]

My main point on the issue, is that it doesn’t matter if you research, don’t research, the possibility of being ripped off always exists, and that anyone paying for a good or service, regardless of where they buy it from... when someone is paying for something, NOBODY deserves to be ripped off. This whole you deserve what you get attitude Is not a good one.

You have good feedback cray... if you started shipping out only fakes tomorrow would these people deserve what they got? No.

And my point is that if you don't want to get ripped off you need to protect yourself by doing research. You can reduce your risk of getting ripped off in this hobby to near zero if you buy from reputable sources and/or members. Combine that with using your various financial institutions as you should and you are 100% covered. Some people don't care to do research or use paypal correctly and then are shocked they get ripped off. Sorry, but I have very little sympathy for these folks.

 

[Misthailin]

And my point is that if you don't want to get ripped off you need to protect yourself by doing research. You can reduce your risk of getting ripped off in this hobby to near zero if you buy from reputable sources and/or members. Combine that with using your various financial institutions as you should and you are 100% covered. Some people don't care to do research or use paypal correctly and then are shocked they get ripped off. Sorry, but I have very little sympathy for these folks.

Having little sympathy for and saying people deserve what they get are two different things.

Criticism is given freely, with extra portions, but when someone who has no sympathy for others gets ripped off they have sympathy for themselves... “why me? I did all of my research. How could I have gotten ripped off?”

Have sympathy for your like minded knife enthusiasts, you never know when you may need sympathy yourself.

 

[jbmonkey]

In this instance, your contractor is licensed, bonded, and insured. Amazon 3rd party sellers have reviews, and Amazon is your insurance.

Many people wouldn’t have a clue if a plumber or electrician were doing stuff to code... and they wouldn’t find out until next guy came through and said, “what joker did this?”

credible, licensed and insured contractor pulls permits. county or city inspector checks the work to code. fails it if it doesn't meet code.

amazon does nothing like this. there is no local govt checking amazons work. y'all should drop this bad analogy of contractors comparing it to amazon. its apples to oranges.

amazon doesnt check returns and that makes them fail and continue to fail. i wont buy a knife from them anymore. too many fakes and swapped boxes with the wrong knife in it. plus the good dealers almost always match or best their prices.

 

[Misthailin]

Seller sells items on Amazon (every individual seller has their own rating for credibility), you check the quality of the product, Amazon covers you if you want a refund.

I’m not saying go buy your knives from Amazon. At this point I’m just debating, the analogy is fine.

 

[craytab]

Having little sympathy for and saying people deserve what they get are two different things.

Criticism is given freely, with extra portions, but when someone who has no sympathy for others gets ripped off they have sympathy for themselves... “why me? I did all of my research. How could I have gotten ripped off?”

Have sympathy for your like minded knife enthusiasts, you never know when you may need sympathy yourself.

Cry me a river. They aren't like minded to me if they find themselves getting ripped off by amazon. Sympathy for myself? Good grief... If I do get a bad knife during my transactions it will not be my fault as I will have done my proper research. I need no sympathy from anyone. I'll look at rationally and take the proper steps to rectify the situation which will most likely be to fall back on paypal protection. No need to get all "woe is me" and emotional about this.

Seller sells items on Amazon (every individual seller has their own rating for credibility), you check the quality of the product, Amazon covers you if you want a refund.

I’m not saying go buy your knives from Amazon. At this point I’m just debating, the analogy is fine.

The analogy does not apply. It is clear you are just arguing to argue now. I have no further reason to keep responding to you.

 

[craytab]

credible, licensed and insured contractor pulls permits. county or city inspector checks the work to code. fails it if it doesn't meet code.

amazon does nothing like this. there is no local govt checking amazons work. y'all should drop this bad analogy of contractors comparing it to amazon. its apples to oranges.

amazon doesnt check returns and that makes them fail and continue to fail. i wont buy a knife from them anymore. too many fakes and swapped boxes with the wrong knife in it. plus the good dealers almost always match or best their prices.

Exactly.

 

[jbmonkey]

Seller sells items on Amazon (every individual seller has their own rating for credibility), you check the quality of the product, Amazon covers you if you want a refund.

I’m not saying go buy your knives from Amazon. At this point I’m just debating, the analogy is fine.

no it isnt. not the same at all. dont pull permits which amazon doesnt.....and fail code over and over or not call in for inspection and leave permits open and eventually youll be in front of the licensing board and lose your contractors license. amazon wont lose anything but valuable customers like me. it is a terrible analogy and not even close. i get it you like amazon for knife buying. have at it. no ones stopping you.......but the analogy to contractors isnt even close.

 

[Mo2]

I think this just goes as a warning to the knife community. Its not to say everything you buy from them will be a clone.

It would be idea if you considered the forum vendors.

And as always do your research.

 

[emjay4248]

It seems that many of you have a blind trust in the big box knife vendors that support us. Please be advised that you are sorely mistaken. I ordered an expensive knife from from one of the vendors that support us and when I opened the box it became obvious that the knife was used. Things like this can happen from our trusted vendors too. You have to be wary and perform due diligence and be familiar with what you are buying no matter from whom. In reference to the deserving what you get statement it is an idiotic statement, the price does not dictate what you get. Their many times that Amazon's price is the same as the dealers. This can mean that the other vendors are out of stock and Amazon still has some and even Amazon has vendors with a good track record. both the supporting vendor Ebay and Amazon Quickly took care of the situation and credited my account, in one case telling me too keep the knife and gave me a credit anyway.
We are in a place in time that even the clones have clones. Unless you know the knife well be advised that you are not safe in any of the buying venues including Bladeforum.Always Look at the vendors rating.
On eBay and Amazon their are trusted sellers that have 30,000 sales or more and still have a 100% rating.
Pearls of wisdom.
Don't buy knives that you are unfamiliar with from vendors without a solid reputation

Make sure that you check their ratings and amount of time that they have been around. No track record = no purchase..
Don't buy from new Bladeforum members that are new and have no track record
DON'T PAY FRIENDS & FAMILY UNLESS THEY ARE FRIENDS OR FAMILY. Even then beware. Their are so many instances when buyers will try to save 3% on a purchase by paying F.F. Don't do it.
The 3% is your insurance policy that you have recourse in case something goes wrong.

Contrary to the statements made in this thread you do not deserve to get screwed if you try to save some money, that is pure ignorance. You are not guaranteed authenticity just because you paid more.
You do deserve to get screwed if you did not pay with a protected form of payment. If you send M.O. to people without a track record such as the Apostle P or pay with FF then you do deserve what you get.

 

[JohnWE]

No one deserves what they get and no one really gets what they deserve.