knives close to CRK

I actually think this thread has been handled pretty decently considering, everyone has and opinion and experience. I own and use CRK's regularly and pull them apart and service them all the time, inspecting all parts for wear and change etc. I honestly believe a huge part of CRK's success in build quality has been very good choices in no nonsense structural design. The way that the stand-offs, pivot and stop pins are precisely machined and designed specifically. Once the handle slabs are screwed together the design of the very large stepped spacers adds a very good amount of structural support and there's just no messing about with the way it all screws together. Other companies really do skimp on the hardware if you take the time to look closely. Tiny T6 screws, tiny stand offs with hardly any flat portion to add rigidity, some with no stepping that actually seats into the handle slabs, threads too fine or too thick and short, liners too thin and flimsy being poorly machined in regards to flatness. These shortfalls don't make the knife unusable or overly weak, but still it's nice to have the extra tool-like build quality. I'd personally love to see CRK do a really well made and tough back-lock folder but keep it elegant and streamlined. CRK always had a good balance of making a knife with a tank build but smaller form factor.
 
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Plenty of knives come close to CRK. Lots of customs, a couple of semi customs, and so on. Heck, some are even more comfortable in hand. Problem is that they are all copying (to a large degree), one of the most simple and ground breaking knives of all times.

Chris Reeve took an idea, put it into production at incredible tolerances, and close to 30 years later, most companies are still playing catch up. It’s a super design and it just plain works.
 
SeppukuSamurai said:
So much so that I can't even bring myself to purchase another CRK because why would I? Dated steel (CTS204, CPM20CV, and M390 being the superior option), plain jane handles, and stagnant models have left me, as a routine consumer of high-end knives wanting in almost every arena.
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CRK is a fairly small company and demand for them is very high. From what I understand they can't keep up from the demand. It's harder to introduce more and more models and various different steel types. Let alone the tooling to do them all. keeping quality up on multiple models is very stressful.

It would be great to see more. I'd want a integral sebenza with nitrobe77 or vanax superclean. One in ti and another in cf. People want them to do a bearing flipper too. I want these ideas from many brands though.

Maybe they'll grow larger and figure it out in the future.

They definitely aren't for everyone but they have no problem flying off shelves.

And steel wise, I like using my sebenza to really care about it. Sharpen it more often but... But I also already have lots of other knives in various steels for various tasks. The sebenza as a user is one of my favorites.
 
Comparing CRK to WE knives is for lack of a better word, laughable. Perhaps the differences are too nuanced for some to pick up on.
 
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kniferbro said:
Comparing CRK to WE knives is for lack of a better word, laughable. Perhaps the differences are too nuanced for some to pick up on.
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Allow me to raise my hand and declare myself an idiot in need of an education.

Small Sebenza 21 vs WE Rectifier. Which is going to give me the most positive ownership experience?

Please be specific so I can follow along.
 
RBid said:
Allow me to raise my hand and declare myself an idiot in need of an education.

Small Sebenza 21 vs WE Rectifier. Which is going to give me the most positive ownership experience?

Please be specific so I can follow along.
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I'm confused about your "idiot in need of an education" comment...?
I'd say the Small Sebenza 21 would have the most positive ownership experience between the two. Every day people post about the small Sebenza, I had no idea what the WE RECTIFIER was. And since we're on this subject, "positive ownership experience" is the metric for quality?
 
kniferbro said:
I'm confused about your "idiot in need of an education" comment...?
I'd say the Small Sebenza 21 would have the most positive ownership experience between the two. Every day people post about the small Sebenza, I had no idea what the WE RECTIFIER was. And since we're on this subject, "positive ownership experience" is the metric for quality?
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I’m comparing CRK to WE, and am having a difficult time understanding why that is laughable. I could use some help. You seem to have insight that I must not have.

To be clear, I’m not saying that positive ownership experience is “the metric for quality”. I’m saying that enjoying owning a thing actually matters, and that “quality” matters exactly as much as it effects how much we enjoy owning a thing.
 
kniferbro said:
I'm confused about your "idiot in need of an education" comment...?
I'd say the Small Sebenza 21 would have the most positive ownership experience between the two. Every day people post about the small Sebenza, I had no idea what the WE RECTIFIER was. And since we're on this subject, "positive ownership experience" is the metric for quality?
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How can you claim a laughable comparison and then say you lack any idea what one of them is? I am firmly a CRK user and lover, but I will absolutely stand by my comparison of the WE produced Keen as being every bit comparable to any CRK I have (or have owned).
 
RBid said:
I’m comparing CRK to WE, and am having a difficult time understanding why that is laughable. I could use some help. You seem to have insight that I must not have.

To be clear, I’m not saying that positive ownership experience is “the metric for quality”. I’m saying that enjoying owning a thing actually matters, and that “quality” matters exactly as much as it effects how much we enjoy owning a thing.
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You're absolutely right. I'm sure just about everyone who owns an Opinel is extremely satisfied with them. But the topic of this thread isn't which knives satisfy you, it was which knives are similar to CRK. WE knives simply are not at the same level. They tick boxes on a spec sheet, yeah, but not the meaningful attention to detail you find in a CRK. They have cool colors and handle milling and cool opening holes and what not but its all just flair. I don't think CRK is the end all be all, I've posted on these boards knives that I think are at the same level or better than CRK. WE is just not one of them. Checking boxes off a list of features doesn't mean quality to me. Its immediately apparent when I pick up a Sebenza vs a WE.
 
Officer's Match said:
How can you claim a laughable comparison and then say you lack any idea what one of them is? I am firmly a CRK user and lover, but I will absolutely stand by my comparison of the WE produced Keen as being every bit comparable to any CRK I have (or have owned).
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Sorry OM, I'm confused about when I said I lack any idea of what one of them is? Maybe I'm missing something.
 
Officer's Match said:
My only WE experience is the Keen in my rfp. It IS very comparable to the Umnumzaan it kicked out of said rfp. Gotta' experience each to compare each.
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Sorry if it came across like I haven't handled a WE. I have one sitting on my desk at home. It flips well and the blade falls shut, the lock isn't troublesome or worrying. Yet it still lacks that which CRK has. I think I should do a little disassembly/photo shoot when I get home from work to highlight what I'm talking about between the two knives.

Edit: Just looked up the Keen. Interesting that that particular example is a Laconico design mass produced by WE rather than 100% WE from conception to production.
 
kniferbro said:
Sorry OM, I'm confused about when I said I lack any idea of what one of them is? Maybe I'm missing something.
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He’s referencing your Rectifier comment.

The Rectifier is regular price $144.50, holiday sale priced at $129.99, is comparable in size to the small 21, has a .10” thick, hollow ground S35VN blade, ti framelock with G-10 show side scale, and quality torx hardware. Even has a milled ti pocket clip.

The WE vs CRK comparison is actually very sensible, because it’s easy to point out many similarities.

There’s also the matter of what it means for a thing to be like a CRK, which I and others brought up very early in this thread. Materials, design, prestige... there are many areas of comparison.
 
kniferbro said:
Sorry if it came across like I haven't handled a WE. I have one sitting on my desk at home. It flips well and the blade falls shut, the lock isn't troublesome or worrying. Yet it still lacks that which CRK has. I think I should do a little disassembly/photo shoot when I get home from work to highlight what I'm talking about between the two knives.

Edit: Just looked up the Keen. Interesting that that particular example is a Laconico design mass produced by WE rather than 100% WE from conception to production.
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I have not been this impressed with a knife in quite a while, and NEVER at this price (OK, the GB1 is at least in the ball park).
 
RBid said:
He’s referencing your Rectifier comment.

The Rectifier is regular price $144.50, holiday sale priced at $129.99, is comparable in size to the small 21, has a .10” thick, hollow ground S35VN blade, ti framelock with G-10 show side scale, and quality torx hardware. Even has a milled ti pocket clip.

The WE vs CRK comparison is actually very sensible, because it’s easy to point out many similarities.

There’s also the matter of what it means for a thing to be like a CRK, which I and others brought up very early in this thread. Materials, design, prestige... there are many areas of comparison.
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This is exactly what I'm getting at. You just listed a bunch of features, checking off boxes, which IMO does not guarantee supreme quality in the final product. A lady can send you her measurements which could say to you "wow she's attractive!" slim waist nice hips and DD cup breasts but at the end of the day the woman you see in front of you will determine if you think she's attractive. It "even has a milled ti pocket clip!" how, in any way, is that indicative of quality? I hate milled pocket clips and some people take clips off completely. If two knives use the same materials and are the same size then they are equal? I don't agree with that. Like I said in my response to OM, it is immediately apparent to me the difference in quality when I pick up a CRK vs a WE knife.
 
Officer's Match said:
I have not been this impressed with a knife in quite a while, and NEVER at this price (OK, the GB1 is at least in the ball park).
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I don't want it to come off like I'm saying WE knives are shit. I personally don't like them, I think they are quite soulless. But I could pick up your Keen, play with it and I'm pretty sure I'd like it (honestly the most appealing WE I've seen). That doesn't mean I still can't believe that WE and CRK are not a worthy comparison. Now I could much more easily make a comparison between the GB1 and a CRK.
 
kniferbro said:
This is exactly what I'm getting at. You just listed a bunch of features, checking off boxes, which IMO does not guarantee supreme quality in the final product. A lady can send you her measurements which could say to you "wow she's attractive!" slim waist nice hips and DD cup breasts but at the end of the day the woman you see in front of you will determine if you think she's attractive. It "even has a milled ti pocket clip!" how, in any way, is that indicative of quality? I hate milled pocket clips and some people take clips off completely. If two knives use the same materials and are the same size then they are equal? I don't agree with that. Like I said in my response to OM, it is immediately apparent to me the difference in quality when I pick up a CRK vs a WE knife.
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I don't know much about the said knives but a lady with a slim waist, nice hips, and DD boobs is attractive to me, seeing her in person or not.;)

Got pick a different analogy.
 
kniferbro said:
This is exactly what I'm getting at. You just listed a bunch of features, checking off boxes, which IMO does not guarantee supreme quality in the final product. A lady can send you her measurements which could say to you "wow she's attractive!" slim waist nice hips and DD cup breasts but at the end of the day the woman you see in front of you will determine if you think she's attractive. It "even has a milled ti pocket clip!" how, in any way, is that indicative of quality? I hate milled pocket clips and some people take clips off completely. If two knives use the same materials and are the same size then they are equal? I don't agree with that. Like I said in my response to OM, it is immediately apparent to me the difference in quality when I pick up a CRK vs a WE knife.
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The disconnect here isn’t that I don’t understand quality. It’s that you’re only thinking in terms of one comparative (quality), and not acknowledging how subjective even a thing like “quality” is.

“Quality” in common use is a sliding scale comparative, relative to points of greater and lesser value/benefit. Without more/less desirable ends, we’re not talking about a thing that is better or worse than another, we’re just talking about different things.

So, if you were to go home and record a video showing Sebenza internals side by side with WE internals, I would nod at what I already know to be inside of them, then pose the question,

“To what end?”

If there’s no value/benefit... that’s not quality, it’s just different.
 
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