Las Vegas Antique Arms & Knife Collector's Show

Thanks for the comments from all. Glad I spent my time at the SHOT show. Hope the knife show in Pasadena in 2 weeks will be a better experience.
 
This was my first time at the LVCKS and I have to agree with a lot of the comments here.

The line to get in was ridiculous. Nowadays you have to be used to standing in line anywhere for anything. The lines here were way beyond even that annoyance.

The look of the show was just sad. It looked like a swap meet in a warehouse.

Checking your knives. I had a particular annoying experience with that. Having done some shopping at the show in the morning, I decided to not starve to death and went out of the room to eat (just around the corner near the aquarium). Since I hadn't eaten all day, I figured this was a good idea. I flew in to Vegas that morning (and back out that night). When I wanted to go in they asked me about the knives I had with me. I told them that I bought them there. The guy wanted to see "the releases" and I told him that the makers didn't even know about them when you asked. One guy did know - he said he had been handed three and he had dozens of knives with him to sell - what a joke! Anyway, the guy said that I wouldn't be able to take them back out. Rather than risk that, I walked all the way to the hotel lobby to stick my morning's purchases in my suitcase. So I did that damn walk twice back-and-forth. On top of that, it turned out that I walked for nothing. As Pontiaker said, they never even checked (unless you bought a firearm).

The walk - I did it with my kids last year to see the aquarium. It is ridiculous. Had I known that the taxi could drop me of near the show, I would have definitely taken advantage of it, but I didn't know where the show was with respect to the lobby until I was in the lobby.

The lottery - I can't complain about that one. I was picked as one of the lucky five by John Young. Even though I was last of the five I actually ended up getting what would have been my second choice of the five available knives.

Overall, I think lotteries are OK. First-come, first-served is best, but I think only if certain rules apply. I don't think it is OK to sell all of your knives to a dealer even if they are first at your table. What's the point? Just save your table fees, your airfare and your hotel bill and mail the knives to the dealer without ever attending the show! Seriously, I think the shows should be more for the collectors / users and not for dealer's business transactions, but that's just my opinion. So for the dealer-buys-all case, lotteries put a nice stop to that - unless they are rigged. I don't know John well enough to comment on his particular lottery and if it was honest and 2 out of 5 is strange. But after only spending some time talking to him and also a phone call after the show, I believe he is an honest guy :thumbup: . Since I have no reason to doubt him, I will just take this as a coincidence.

All-in-all, it was a successful show for me. Meeting John, Dusty Moulton, Bob Patrick and a bunch of other makers for the first time was great. Meeting Virgil England was an amazing treat. The guy's creations are truly unique and extremely creative. It may not float everybody's boat, but you certainly can't argue with him being imaginative. I even picked up a nice gift for my wife - her first custom knife (and it can pass as jewelry, imagine that :D )

Well, that's it for my impressions. Will I go back next year? Probably not. I think I'd rather save the airfare and put it towards a ticket for the ECCKS.

BTW - nice to meet you Win. :)
 
Sounds like you guys went on Friday and were disappointed. I went on Sunday and it was a joke! I won't be back either.
 
Screw lotteries.Do not need Anyknives that bad.Sorry,just my opinion.
Randy
 
I'm glad I held off to spend my energies THIS weekend in Napa CA, at the Collector's Show.

Open selling to dealers or collectors before the show: Not fair.
Holding off for just the door-breakers: Partly fair.
Holding a lottery: Partly fair.

Everything is a compromise.

One comment: Dan Delavan got two knives from John Young. Hmmm.... a dealer has two new knives for sale, which NOW gives an opportunity for just about ANYONE to purchase those knives. Showgoers or not. A collector will never move them.

Where's the beef? :confused: Sounds like win/win to me.

Coop
 
SharpByCoop said:
I'm glad I held off to spend my energies THIS weekend in Napa CA, at the Collector's Show.

Open selling to dealers or collectors before the show: Not fair.
Holding off for just the door-breakers: Partly fair.
Holding a lottery: Partly fair.

Everything is a compromise.

One comment: Dan Delavan got two knives from John Young. Hmmm.... a dealer has two new knives for sale, which NOW gives an opportunity for just about ANYONE to purchase those knives. Showgoers or not. A collector will never move them.

Where's the beef? :confused: Sounds like win/win to me.

Coop
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If he is selling them at the makers cost then it is a good deal for someone, but if he has them marked up over the makers price, then it is not such a good deal.
P. S. I know that John is a nice guy and I think that he is trying to do the right thing, but if you make one guy happy, you will probably make one guy mad.

Bobby
 
I used to call bingo...what you'd think unlikely can happen and sooner or latter will happen, just not that often. So the same family winning a lottery 2 out of 5 times is possible and it will happen. Just like calling 2 or 3 consecutive numbers in bingo, doesn't happen often, but can and will. If you think a knife lotter is rigged, sounds like sour grapes for not winning.

Why shouldn't a dealer sell a knife for what the market will bear? If you're a maker, it sounds again like sour grapes for not having the business savy to pocket the markup yourself. If you're a collector it sounds like sour grapes for not having the cash to buy it from the dealer. Most any maker can be had if you've got the dough. Dealer's have costs and risks in their investments and what looks like a huge profit can be eaten up in other ways.
 
I don't own or collect customs, at least no yet, but it sounds to me that the makers need to raise (maybe double) their prices. People who really wanted the knives would still pay, the makers would make more money, and the demand would be attenuated.
 
I was going to post, but as I have limited knowledge buying customs, and have limited funds for buying customs and am still wallowing in productions, I don't know if I'll have anything pertinent to add to the discussion. I will say that, as a collector/user, I think that dealers should not have first crack before John Q Citizen, before a show has even opened, to buy all the makers knives and sell them way above what the maker is charging. Even though I wouldn't like it if a dealer bought all of the knives, I think it would be fair for a maker to sell to whomever he wants, whether collector or dealer, during the show.
 
Thanks for some live and direct feedback on the show.

$90 admission!! Standing in line for an hour!! That's not the Vegas I was expecting... :jerkit:
 
Well, I didnt see any of you guys!!!!!!!!!!

As for the show, a lot of makers like it.......go figure


and I must agree that Bill Ankrom is one of the most under rated knife makers I know of..........he was making great knives when I started!!
 
Since this thread has a sidebar (or two) I will add that every time I have photographed/handled a Bill Ankrom folder I do a triple-take. He is THAT good! Someday, one is not going to leave my studio. Instead there will be a phone call. :)

Coop
 
Frustrated. Didn't attend Vegas. NYC shows havn't had knife-checking. I mean, whats the point? Its a KNIFE show! Stupid.

It should be standardized or a set rule. No pre-show sales, at all. Whatsoever.

The NYC shows I've attended are notorious for this also. Last time I went first thing Saturday morning, (show opened Fri 1-7pm) there were dozens of empty tables, granted I was there a day later but I heard from alot of dealers/makers that some had sold out completely by Fridays opening.

Im not attending this year unfortunately, mainly because of this issue and the fact that I have found some shows to charge a good bit more for blades than they do elsewhere or not at show. IE: Paid $79 for a $59 TOPS scalpel.

Thanks for the Rant.
 
GFarrell3 said:
Im not attending this year unfortunately, mainly because of this issue and the fact that I have found some shows to charge a good bit more for blades than they do elsewhere or not at show. IE: Paid $79 for a $59 TOPS scalpel.

Thanks for the Rant.
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I mainly shop around for things that go boom at gun shows, I can get knives cheaper elsewhere, IE online. I realize that dealers have overhead they have to pay for, but I have bills too. The past few shows I've attended, have been to see several makers I know, and to handle what I have on my want list, and to look for a snub nose revolver.

Then again, most of the dealers shilling good production pieces and some Chinese junk aren't going to sell out first thing Friday afternoon.
 
My wife and I had a great time, walking is part of the deal in Vegas, drawing for knives is gonna stay, would do it again in a minute......:cool:

As for all the negative reviews, better luck next time, I guess. :p :D
 
Dawkind said:
My wife and I had a great time, walking is part of the deal in Vegas, drawing for knives is gonna stay, would do it again in a minute......:cool:

As for all the negative reviews, better luck next time, I guess. :p :D
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Gee, Dudley, thanks for that in-depth and incisive review of the show!:rolleyes:

Care to share exactly what it was the made it such a "great time"? If you read the other posts, it wasn't about walking, it was the needless amount of walking. If you had to walk SHOT, you wouldn't be quite so flip about walking the distance from the front door of Mandalay Bay to the exhibit hall.

For others, there may be a next time. For me, and about 10 makers that I know, there will be no next time. If I don't see Las Vegas again for another 5 years, that would be OK with me. I have gone there for work a lot in the last 5 years, and it takes its' toll.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
Hi STeven,

I did the SHOT thing, too, and had a great time there..... :cool:

I guess that hanging out and riding around Vegas with Ken Onion, having a few cool ones with Jody Samson and his lovely lady, hooking up with Neil Blackwood, Kit Carson, Warren Osborne, Mel Pardue, Ed Halligan, Allen and Valerie Elishewitz, Dexter Ewing, Jim Burke, Roberta, Les, and Jon De Asis, Vance Collver, Mike and Audra Draper, Tom Mayo, Jim Whitehead, Tayna and Todd Begg, and many, MANY more great folks who treated us with the greatest of hospitality and kindness.......THAT'S the great time I speak of.

I guess for me it's having fun.....not trying to get knives that I can turn a quick profit on or complaining about the show or when I don't get my name drawn, or......:rolleyes:

Yeah, I would have loved to have got a knife in the Emerson drawing, the Onion drawing, the Young drawing, etc., but it didn't happen THIS time.

How about NEXT time??? I'll be there to find out......sore feet and all.

Have a great day, STeven...... :)
 
Below is the reply from Wally Beinfeld the show promoter.

A.T.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
AT, thanks for the web words.
The comments follow three lines: auctions suck, the wait to get into the show was to long and security shouldn't try to stop knife thefts. That the walk to the show was to long will be fixed next year at the Riviera.

Auctions will not be at the show, they will be held in a private room across from the show.

Even though we had 7 computers working, we did not expect 2,000 people on Friday. Our error.

No one got in for $50 on Thursday and every exhibitor was advised that setup was Thursday. Ask Gil Hibben or D'Holder who came in at 11:00 AM and were well sold by noon.

We spent nearly $5,000 on busses bringing buyers from SHOT, $3,500 on a full color ad in SHOT magazine and color ads in BLADE as well as ads in most every knife magazine and local newspapers.

We always regret the probably that every maker doesn't sell out but the great majority did sell well and more that 100 have already signed up for January 5-7, 2007 at the Riviera Hotel.

We work hard at continuing to improve and welcome any constructive criticism. Wally Beinfeld ` `
 
Wow, doesnt seem to be much help, does not really deal with the concerns expressed in most of these posts. Auctions in a private room across the show? This doesnt really have anything to do with people liking or not liking auctions. Did not expect 2000 people on Fri? Was he not there last year? There were less than 2k people there last year on fri and it was still a freakin mess to get in. No one got in Thurs for $50? The problem was even the guys that paid the $90 and got in didnt have much to look at in the knife show because alot of the knifemakers didnt know people were going to be let in to buy, I know this beacuase I heard knifemakers say this at the show.If you would pre sell fri passes on thurs like I tried to do there wouldnt have been 2k people in line to buy passes on Fri. Not having to walk at the Riv next year? I was at the gun show 3 or 4 years ago and I did stay at the Riv, the walk was terrible and the hallways were half the size of the Mandalay and packed with people at all times of the day and night, has something changed there? Tagging knives at the door does nothing if your not checking people as they leave. I was in and out of the show several times every day and was never once checked when I went out the door.You will never be able to check every person and every bag or pocket a knife will fit in before and after they enter the show, its just not possible and pisses everyone off. I didnt hear any makers complaining about not selling out, and I didnt hear anyone complaining about the show not being advertised enough I think it was well advertised hence 2k people on fri.Again I had a great time at the show, with a few changes it would be even better. How about selling passes through the mail before the show opens?
 
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