Like A Rainbow in the SNARK.

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I like guns!! Shoot as many as you can before you buy. 22's are good cheap fun and great to start on. Find a good gun forum and start reading I'll suggest the high road or the firing line.

The last two weeks of weather have been odd. We went from rain to snow, back to rain again. Then fri/sat we got 9 inches of snow and today its 36 and raining. Hoping the temp stays above freezing otherwise its gonna be a fun drive tonight.
 
Someone more skilled than I, I would like a new sig pic. I was thinking just tweaking my current one a bit. Something like a BK4 and an M-18 silhouette with my number. Please?
 
daizee said:
If you want to hurt yourself, shoot a high-powered rifle. They operate at 65,000psi and the recoil is SHARP. Shotguns operate at lower pressures and it drops rapidly since the bore is so large, thereby increasing the volume more rapidly as the payload travels down the tube.

You may have had a 20ga with a youth stock. That would definitely feel small to you. A normal 20ga isn't much smaller than a 12, but the action should be somewhat slimmer. Clays, birds, and deer don't take much killing. A 20ga is a substantial hunting tool. Also, you may have been shooting mild target loads - I forgot to mention that in my original post. Shotguns will run on a large variety of fodder. Throw a full-length 'magnum' shell in that 20 and it will be a different animal.

Also, if your stance was 'wrong' it would have hurt. That it didn't suggests you're either doing it right, or a giant cyclops. The butt must be snug to your shoulder (ideally not on the joint...) and cheek welded to the stock. If you give the gun room to move it will hit you at high velocity instead of just giving you a shove. Don't let it wind up.
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I don't share your assessment of rifle recoil, at least in how it pertains to me. A rifle's recoil advances more gradually than the shotgun. ie it ramps up to full recoil quickly, whereas a shotgun just mule kicks on discharge. I can take more rifle recoil in a day's shooting than from a 12 gauge. Again, its just how I perceive the difference in the two types of guns.

Doc
 
crimsonfalcon07 said:
K-9, have you ever shot an M82? That's gotta have a mean recoil...
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I have not. That's after my time. M-79 Grenade launcher (pre-dates the M203 combo) and 7.62 are about the highest they'd let me play with. From TV shows though, the M82 is an absolute bear.
When you think that a P-47 fighter in WWII firing 8 .50 cal guns from it's wings could knock a locomotive off it's tracks, that is some serious energy.

I have a .458 SOCOM upper on an AR platform, and that recoil is not unlike a healthy 12 ga. shotgun. But it will chew up a concrete block wall, and put a serious hurt on an engine block! :rolleyes:
 
oXide said:
I have the best contest prize ever. As a matter of fact, I probably have 6 of them. I might do a contest just for the hell of it, with these mystery items as the prizes.
I can guarantee that even the ever awesome Moose, Biscuit, and Bladite don't carry them. I'm even willing to bet all my knives and my BH# that even Uncle E doesn't have a physical one.
Who can guess what the items I speak of are?
I'll speak with them about this contest idea after I distribute some of them to my local friends, so I'll go from my current inventory to my projected inventory of 6, maybe down to 5.
And no, I am not talking about restraining orders.
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well, that's a tall order.

if it's a Becker knife, i have a lot. in some cases, i have many more items than even Ethan currently has. note: i don't have them all; probalby more than Guyon, but he was a contender. there's someone out there who had DEEP POCKETS and was is buying up a LOT of Becker knives. even then, there's a ton of items that just never saw the light of day, and well, nobody wants :)

so, if it's a Becker knife, that nobody but YOU has, and six of them. well.

if it's a pocket protector, or a flyer / catalog, well, shoot. just share already.
 
Doc_Savage said:
I don't share your assessment of rifle recoil, at least in how it pertains to me. A rifle's recoil advances more gradually than the shotgun. ie it ramps up to full recoil quickly, whereas a shotgun just mule kicks on discharge. I can take more rifle recoil in a day's shooting than from a 12 gauge. Again, its just how I perceive the difference in the two types of guns.

Doc
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I'll leave both the 12ga and .30-06 alone in either case. :-)
However I wouldn't mind trading my 20ga up to a nice semi-auto to reduce the anticipated beating when hoping to shoot at deer.
 
oXide said:
Ok, point taken. I still don't like the thought of being on the receiving end without a way to defend myself (really no desire to tackle someone who has me at gun point). Not that I wish to be on the other end at all. And I found that there are a few states that allow you to own (not purchase) handguns at 18, VA being one of them.

As far as carrying at goes, do you think things like the VT shootings could have gone different if there were one or two responsible people legally carrying at the time? I understand not carrying at a highschool (well, no student or faculty carrying, but maybe a properly trained guard, not sitting at a metal detector), but most people who go to college are considered adults by the law, and most of those are more than eligible to carry. Even if it requires written permission from the head(s) of the school who want a couple letters of recommendation before they approve it, that would be better than none at all, and have the added benefit of keeping idiots who get drunk all the time from having one.

Ah well, my point was defeated, and rightfully so.
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VT has very interesting gun laws. legal adult citizens don't NEED a permit. many carry. comparing to NH, a few incidents have NOT occurred because people were carrying.

that said, i believe a legal adult should be able to carry anywhere. some laws say otherwise. in NH, we can nearly carry *anywhere* not proscribed by land-owners which translates to chicken shit malls, and certain properties. i *think* schools are exempt, as NH has a pre-emption law. a state college imho cannot proscribe carry. just be *unbelievably* discrete, the least of which, i'll be watching YOU :)

if you can "get away" with carrying a pocket gun, and you never have to use it, imho, doing so is better than being dead. even being in jail a couple years is better than being dead. IMHO.

but here's a thought: until you are 18++ and esp 21 or over, and you have the names and phone numbers of at least *two* lawyers for your state specializing in gun, knife, and force law, don't think about it. in particular, you NEED TO KNOW the law on justified use of force, be that touching someone, holding them, punching, stabbing, or shooting. for realz. get the education and training. when i was your age, i was still a better shot statistically than most cops in the USA, i was NOT ready to kill anyone, nor did i know the law. nor do i know it now ;) study. don't be stupid. i don't want my taxes going up :D
 
Murphnuge said:
Someone more skilled than I, I would like a new sig pic. I was thinking just tweaking my current one a bit. Something like a BK4 and an M-18 silhouette with my number. Please?
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I got you man. Here you go.

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oXide said:
So much knowledge. I must learn more! Thanks for the info. And the laws... I guess I really do need to wait until I turn 21 to get a handgun. Oh well. Any recommendations on a good rifle/shotgun? I would prefer large-ish caliber/gauge, mostly because so far every gun I've shot has almost 0 recoil, 20 gauge shotgun for shotgun shooting merit badge having the most recoil, which honestly wasn't much.

What are the federal restrictions on "assault rifles" as far as builds like the AR 10 and 15 are concerned?
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okay. for frak's sake... i'll say this only once :) recoil don't me dick. there are many rounds and systems that reduce recoil to stupid low levels. 5.7 rounds out of an AR57 feel like an air-soft. yet, you could have nearly 3000 FPS and armor piercing quality. pop pop pop. just means it's more accurate to deliver more lead poisoning to your body :D even .22LR has nearly zero recoil. supposedly, historically, MORE PEOPLE have died from .22LR and certainly MOST DEER. in the history of man. okay, a large claim, but it's one of the older, more prevalent rounds. no recoil. sure, fun? FUN? it's supposed to be fun?

#1 - masaad ayoob (sp) has said that while he advocated 12 gauge for years for self-defense, he NOW feels 20 gauge is *more* than adequate. i have a VERY nice 12 gauge, and shooting 3 inch MAGNUM turkey rounds actually has MORE PUNCH at my shoulder than a Finnish Mosin (7.62x54R) does, guess what? you'll still be more than dead with a 20 gauge with no recoil.

as a note: if you can get up after a couple 20 gauge slugs to the chest mixed with 6+1, you go for it. even if you ARE wearing armor. it's going to ruin your day.

*any* milsurp rifle, like a Mosin (and good luck on getting a quality sub 1 MOA carbine ;>), or a Mauser (8mm) or hell, right on up to an M1 or any AK types? cheap, good, killed LOTS of people, and generally, esp the Russian stuff, with surplus milsurp ammo, will punch through cars, armor, and zombies... cheap... *plenty* good.

one last word. there is NO legal definition imho on what a "assault rifle is". forget the term. ignore it. joke! they made funny! it's a scare tactic.

so:

recoil? bah

AR10 and AR15s are just low power rifles when you get down to it. compromises even. get a real gun :) that's a joke kids. if you get it.

nobody wants to be cut, and nobody wants to be shot, even by a .22LR.

so, you want a gun? buy a .22LR rifle. a fungun like a SIG 522 or M&P 16-22, or go for something like a Savage .22LR target rifle or go milsurp and get a Mosin *and* LEARN TO BLOODY WELL SHOOT. forget about pistols or shotguns for now. don't even THINK about other guns until you can group under 1 inch at 25 feet, and then 50 feet :)
 
as mostly usual, Bladite is spot-on.

The 10-ring of a 50ft smallbore indoor rifle target is about 1/4" in diameter. That gives you about a 1/2" diameter area in which you can break the line for a 10. Prone, no bags, open sights, 10 scoring targets per page, one shot each. 100's are common, 99's disappointing. Offhand position you gotta break 90 to be competitive... *practice* as the man says. .22 good.

-Daizee
 
I'll have to agree that the smaller the caliber you start with, the better your accuracy will be. Get the accuracy then you can move up in the calibers if you want. If it is an option for you, try to get some professional firearms training from a trained instructor. Find out their background while you're at it and make sure that they have a reputation for being a good instructor and not just some jack@$$ with a certificate.
 
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A 22lr rifle and an Appleseed class would go really well together. It's one of the best classes around for rifle training and marksmanship. You even get some good history lessons while your at it.
 
When having a crappy day, coming home and making a rib-eye and asparagus and linguini in a butter lemon pepper sauce just makes everything better.
 
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