Lock Strength - Kershaw Leek vs Cold Steel Hold Out III

Wow, I always knew the Leeks were pretty tough for such a seemingly delicate knife. I have reground 2 that had snapped tips for friends. For the guys pooping on this thread, why do you watch the videos/come to the CS sub forum if you don't like the company? Why waste your time telling everybody your opinion? "I can't stand these guys and I thought you should know! I'll tell you again after the next video is posted!"
 
crom said:
Wow, I always knew the Leeks were pretty tough for such a seemingly delicate knife. I have reground 2 that had snapped tips for friends. For the guys pooping on this thread, why do you watch the videos/come to the CS sub forum if you don't like the company? Why waste your time telling everybody your opinion? "I can't stand these guys and I thought you should know! I'll tell you again after the next video is posted!"
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Because it affects other companies and in a real way when they get sued.

When they were just making their stupid apocalyptic videos that was one thing. Even funny to watch then. but now the videos are much more to demonstrate that they are right in the lawsuit when in fact they're just avoiding proving their claim in any real way.
 
Yo Mama said:
Because it affects other companies and in a real way when they get sued.

When they were just making their stupid apocalyptic videos that was one thing. Even funny to watch then. but now the videos are much more to demonstrate that they are right in the lawsuit when in fact they're just avoiding proving their claim in any real way.
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Cool, at least you're honest about the trolling! I understand the frustration, but not the anger. I have owned knives by most of the major brands for close to 30 years, I don't have any real favorites, but these tests don't make me change my mind one way or the other. CS makes a tough lock, wants to show its capabilities, other companies are competition and fair game. If Snap On produced a video showing how the ratchet gear pawls in their wrenches held up to abuse better than Craftsman, I'm going to trust that tool and I'm sure not many people would think otherwise.
 
Does Ford go out and buy a bunch of Dodges and wreck them up?

Does any other business sell via this type of model?

I know for us we talk about our benefits and we definitely anti-salesman. I'd rather see someone not buy ours than buy one and be let down by it.

We're in a comparatively small sporting goods/outdoor equipment niche and are a decades old mid sized company. We never trash talk the competition. We let our produts stand on their own merits.
 
Danke42 said:
Does Ford go out and buy a bunch of Dodges and wreck them up?

Does any other business sell via this type of model?

I know for us we talk about our benefits and we definitely anti-salesman. I'd rather see someone not buy ours than buy one and be let down by it.

We're in a comparatively small sporting goods/outdoor equipment niche and are a decades old mid sized company. We never trash talk the competition. We let our produts stand on their own merits.
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Not sure if there's ever been a video showing Ford Motor Co. "wrecking up" a Dodge but the commercials sure do list their advantages over their competitors by name and it's been that way for as long as I can remember. "More pulling power than Chevy, more standard HP that Dodge!"
Edit, wow, can't believe I remember this commercial, getting old!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3j-qy1s1RIM
 
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crom said:
Cool, at least you're honest about the trolling! I understand the frustration, but not the anger. I have owned knives by most of the major brands for close to 30 years, I don't have any real favorites, but these tests don't make me change my mind one way or the other. CS makes a tough lock, wants to show its capabilities, other companies are competition and fair game. If Snap On produced a video showing how the ratchet gear pawls in their wrenches held up to abuse better than Craftsman, I'm going to trust that tool and I'm sure not many people would think otherwise.
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We can disagree but it's weak to name call and go to trolling. cs pissed off a lot of people. They deserve it and asked for it even with a "press release". Just because a manufacturer has a forum doesn't mean that they are immune from criticism.

It's my two cents that's all.
 
Mods, at what point do people start getting banned or at the very least given infractions for this constant thread derailing diatribe?
 
Yo Mama said:
We can disagree but it's weak to name call and go to trolling. cs pissed off a lot of people. They deserve it and asked for it even with a "press release". Just because a manufacturer has a forum doesn't mean that they are immune from criticism.

It's my two cents that's all.
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Many of us are upset with Cold Steel for their legal shenanigans. Going into an unrelated thread and regurgitating the issue all over is, indeed, trolling.
 
Danke42 said:
Does Ford go out and buy a bunch of Dodges and wreck them up?

Does any other business sell via this type of model?

I know for us we talk about our benefits and we definitely anti-salesman. I'd rather see someone not buy ours than buy one and be let down by it.

We're in a comparatively small sporting goods/outdoor equipment niche and are a decades old mid sized company. We never trash talk the competition. We let our produts stand on their own merits.
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The vast majority of the corporate world? Literally every pharmaceutical company? Ever heard of a thing called the Pepsi Challenge?

Many companies are loathe to bring up direct competitors because then they have to back up exactly what they claim instead of relying on puffery. If, however, they have a demonstrable and empirical advantage in one aspect or another they usually bring it up almost ad nauseam.
 
The Pepsi challenge or the big 3 truck commercials are still nowhere near as strident and negative as these particular tests.

While youtube is full of opinionated fanboy tests of everything those are third party players.

The tests in these videos are less real world than any mainstream ad. They're lined up to play out one way. No one even needs to watch them because you know what the results will be. A smart guy at Cold Steel will take competing products and study them for an easy way to ruin them.

Every time they win that rigged game the boss must love it but everyone else is watching with the traditional facepalm.
 
Danke42, that post makes no sense, literally. Ford and Pepsi, like CS are corporations. They all put out a challenge to their rivals. Of course you know going into it that Ford is going to be on top, it's their corporate produced commercial. No different with CS. Now, if you are saying that CS takes the other guy's knife and study it for failure, well that sounds a bit of a stretch. There's a pivot, a locking mechanism, and the blade. What's to study, really?
 
Let's explore the comparisons...

It's more like: Do car makers in their advertising show in house tests of competitor's cars being wrecked and destroyed.

It's more like: Does Boeing crash Airbus jets for public consumption.

It's something like: a PC company showing a competitor's laptop in a comercial overheating.

It's sometig like: Nike showing a busted Reebook with the sole coming off in a basketball shoe commercial.

It's not like: Canon showing inferior pictures from a Nikon.

It's not like: Samsung demonstrating their screen's superiority in a head by head comparison in a commercial.

It's not like: The Pepsi challenge at all... That sort of thing is not what turns people off.

What many do not appreciate is what they perceive as a tasteless below the belt tactic.
 
Well I guess the real questions are these tests meant to validate Cold Steel's current fans? If so they're a resounding success.

If they're meant to bring new customers to the fold though I don't think they're getting the desired result.
 
No offense intended, just pointing out:

Insipid Moniker and Crom are the main guys in these tests videos that are in full support of it so don't take it personal guys. They want this to keep going and will respond to criticism accordingly.

Don't even respond, there is no point.
 
Danke42 said:
Well I guess the real questions are these tests meant to validate Cold Steel's current fans? If so they're a resounding success.

If they're meant to bring new customers to the fold though I don't think they're getting the desired result.
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TBH, I think the fans, and haters will stay the same but there's a demographic of prospective knife buyers out there (especially easily influenced beginners) that these are targeted to much like the proof videos.

Then, there are those who are fans of their knives but are turned off by these recent actions. You know, those who don't care for the ninja products and proof videos but like the knives...
 
Stays Sharp, but none of that applies because those products aren't hand tools. Knives are hand tools, there's a certain expectation that they should be durable in every regard. Pretty sure I've seen car commercials touting their crash tests against others, maybe not in visuals but in the star ratings. Ugh, Danke42, what are CS's "current fans"? You do realize the company has been around since the early 80's right? They have been a success based on their product, not the marketing. For years the videos, yes, that's VHS, were advertised but I never saw one or knew anybody who had.
 
Stays Sharp said:
No offense intended, just pointing out:

Insipid Moniker and Crom are the main guys in these tests videos that are in full support of it so don't take it personal guys. They want this to keep going and will respond to criticism accordingly.

Don't even respond, there is no point.
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Stays Sharp, please cite. All I try to do is stay objective, I know that's hard for you to do. But, please, show me how I am a "main guy". Thanks.
 
Stays Sharp said:
TBH, I think the fans, and haters will stay the same but there's a demographic of prospective knife buyers out there (especially easily influenced beginners) that these are targeted to much like the proof videos.

Then, there are those who are fans of their knives but are turned off by these recent actions. You know, those who don't care for the ninja products and proof videos but like the knives...
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I am neither, I don't use the silly Millennial word, "mall ninja" nor do I take the videos as gospel. I have had a knife in my pocket for about 35 years, so I'm no beginner. I know a good product when I see one.
 
Stays Sharp said:
Let's explore the comparisons...

It's more like: Do car makers in their advertising show in house tests of competitor's cars being wrecked and destroyed.

It's more like: Does Boeing crash Airbus jets for public consumption.

It's something like: a PC company showing a competitor's laptop in a comercial overheating.

It's sometig like: Nike showing a busted Reebook with the sole coming off in a basketball shoe commercial.

It's not like: Canon showing inferior pictures from a Nikon.

It's not like: Samsung demonstrating their screen's superiority in a head by head comparison in a commercial.

It's not like: The Pepsi challenge at all... That sort of thing is not what turns people off.

What many do not appreciate is what they perceive as a tasteless below the belt tactic.
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How is it different other than testing a different aspect of performance? Heck, this aspect is honestly less integral to the performance of the end product than most of the head-to-head testing that goes on, so it can easily be seen as much less offensive to the opposing companies.

You also claim what it is and isn't like without providing any objective criteria. In what way is it unlike the Pepsi Challenge?
 
Stays Sharp said:
No offense intended, just pointing out:

Insipid Moniker and Crom are the main guys in these tests videos that are in full support of it so don't take it personal guys. They want this to keep going and will respond to criticism accordingly.

Don't even respond, there is no point.
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This is a logical fallacy called poisoning the well. Please try to argue with logic, not fallacies and ad hominem.
 
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