Lock Strength Test Request - Extrema Ratio RAO vs the Cold Steel 4-MAX

The RAO II is much nicer:

extremaratio-rao-ii-knife-415.jpg


And should do better piercing than the funky tanto on the RAO.
 
Someone posted the vid on the CS pocket bushman vs ER Fulcrum 2. Same thing as how I earlier described how I busted it, the lockbar pivot pin sheared off. Seriously, for the price couldn't they have used a thicker pin?

Seriously, CS should put the Rao to the vice and load it up and I'll bet the aluminum will shear right off at lower loads than a pocket bushman. Both sides to fail if the additional locking pin is in place.
 
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Well my RAO clone arrived. I am impressed with the edge China put on it, I think its sharper than a brand new Kabar out of the box, no joke.

Sharper than my brand new American Lawman from the box that came today as well. CS's sharpness claim tested and beaten by random Chinese clone?
 
Impressive. But could the RAO II stand up to a Paul Bunyan spine whack test? And could you hang Babe the Blue Ox from its blade without the knife coming apart? I wouldn't be caught dead carrying a folder that couldn't do those things. ;)
 
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bld522 said:
Impressive. But could the RAO II stand up to a Paul Bunyan spine whack test? And could you hang Babe the Blue Ox from its blade without the knife coming apart? I wouldn't be caught dead carrying a folder that couldn't do those things. ;)
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I feel the same way, only serious. Never know what will happen when Murphy's Law is the only one. Though with the Ox remark, I can be lenient, the whacks is the more important test. The weight hang is just the fun part. Speaking of Paul, you could do Bunyan-like tasks with more reassurance i think with a TriAd lock, given it could take more. Though I wouldn't recommend attempting to fell even a small standing tree for risk of the edge sharking out on you.

Back to my Chinese clone RAO, it is pretty capable, the "440C" is a bit soft, but the edge can be rehoned fairly easily. I tell you, I'm digging the stop screw pin, it really does give you reassurance. I have no faith in the lock, its a flimsy backlock with mass blade play on the clone. I have no faith in the lock alone, the pin is needed here -- not to turn it into a fixed blade no no -- but merely to make it functional.

RAO owners would you have the same disturbing lack of faith if you lost your screw?

Important: You can disengage the lock while the stop pin is in on the Clone and the blade moves down a bit before hitting the screw: SOMEONE TELL ME IF THIS IS THE CASE ON THE REAL RAO. If the Axis fails on the tests, I wonder if Demko will consider the test over or will he continue and rest it all on the stop pin. If latter, I would like to see what the pin can take before a possible shearing on the threads.
 
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Hi well I dunno............ LOL! But seriously The only type of knife I trust my life with or those with me is a fixed blade with as few parts as possible......but we could go on and on here for another perpetual discussion LOL!
 
If the lock breaks or is disengaged the safety pin prevents all movement and besides that the blade is flush perfectly with both spine (also BTW in N690) and the safety pin (if it is of course inserted). Some clones of knives can be ok but I'd never trust my life with them or even depend upon them.
 
As I mentioned in the video, the scales are 6082 Aluminum alloy very very tough stuff used in aircraft industry (which I know nothing about) but also 6000 series used in rock climbing gear where steel alloys are mated against these Aluminium alloys, I trust my life and those who climb with me that no failures occur under big falls. I know the RAOII is not built to UIAA standards nor is it rated as some sort of safety apparatus but I seriously think in reality one would really need to apply a serious load to deform/ have those thick Al scales fail or shear/bend the roller bar.
 
FCCBCT said:
Hi well I dunno............ LOL! But seriously The only type of knife I trust my life with or those with me is a fixed blade with as few parts as possible.
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I'm with you. With an attitude like yours, of course, one hardly needs to carry a folder whose primary attribute is its lock strength.
 
FCCBCT said:
If the lock breaks or is disengaged the safety pin prevents all movement and besides that the blade is flush perfectly with both spine (also BTW in N690) and the safety pin (if it is of course inserted). Some clones of knives can be ok but I'd never trust my life with them or even depend upon them.
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I thought as much. Thank you for clarifying this.

I have heard some on here speaking of the Aluminum fracturing and warping under extremely heavy weight, in your experience, can you see this speculation happening? (interview lol)

Also I'm glad you tested the RAO II. I regret now not picking up a clone of that model instead. That tip would no doubt be better in all function. There is a video I posted back a few pages of the RAO's tantoish tip pretty much failing to do what it was designed for. I think they overbuilt that tip and nearly all effectiveness was lost as a result.

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The CS Mod guy is just an employee, who knows if his word carries weight. I think hes only here to bring news or something. Though some input on this topic would be nice.

And about your position, Mod, you can correct me if I'm wrong, I just wanna hear from ya. :D
 
Jonslaught said:
The CS Mod guy is just an employee, who knows if his word carries weight. I think hes only here to bring news or something. Though some input on this topic would be nice.
And about your position, Mod, you can correct me if I'm wrong, I just wanna hear from ya. :D
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I have no idea what is on the list for testing. I am not a member of the R&D team.
Sorry
 
Hi to be honest I usually don't carry a folder where I go as it's really in the middle of nowhere or in regions around the world where others around me are carrying knives and then no one bats an eyelid, if I have a fixed blade at my waist or strapped to my pack. That said of course I grew up with folders as a young kid in the 60/70's but soon was introduced to fixed blades by my dad. We were camping extensively in the tropics and having to be pretty much self reliant for distances of up to 40km sometimes more, we had folders but soon purchased local parangs for the tasks at hand as we nearly destroyed our folders. Trouble is you can't always of course carry a fixed blade as people in some places will be freaking out, like on popular "treks" hiking routes etc etc if you whip it out in a hut during kitchen duties it can get a few people worried.
 
I don't know anything about this. I know for certain ER are using 6082 for the scales. All data for 6082 Al suggests it is the highest ranking, shall we say of the 6000 series alloys, at being able to handle stress. Of course this is based on scientific tests of slugs of metal samples etc, not destroying knives. Where you see me twisting sideways i.e. laterally against that stub of fat wood, I was really approaching what I might call "abuse" of any folder including this one as I was really putting a lot of weight into it and the pivot is fine, no movement in the slightest and no deformation of the Al scales. Of course this was done many many times, you guys just see one selection of clips otherwise I'd really be boring everyone to tears LOL!

If one puts a high enough load on any knife even a fixed blade it might sucumb to deformation. As a rule I'm tying off at the lowest possible point on pitons (not so they just don't pull out under dodgy placements (that can't be helped sometimes) but because to reduce a bending moment, and that's even for rock climbing gear.
 
Jonslaught said:
I thought as much. Thank you for clarifying this.

I have heard some on here speaking of the Aluminum fracturing and warping under extremely heavy weight, in your experience, can you see this speculation happening? (interview lol)

Also I'm glad you tested the RAO II. I regret now not picking up a clone of that model instead. That tip would no doubt be better in all function. There is a video I posted back a few pages of the RAO's tantoish tip pretty much failing to do what it was designed for. I think they overbuilt that tip and nearly all effectiveness was lost as a result.

---------------------

The CS Mod guy is just an employee, who knows if his word carries weight. I think hes only here to bring news or something. Though some input on this topic would be nice.

And about your position, Mod, you can correct me if I'm wrong, I just wanna hear from ya. :D
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Oh yeah have to say that the drop point tip of the RAOII is much improved IMHO but remember the original tango was designed for a specific purpose. The Tanto (or any for that matter) can be very easily sharpened even by the least experienced as there are no funky curves, just straight edges and some might say from a military standpoint, simple is less likely to cause problems, be effective and fast to maintain.
 
Jonslaught said:
RAO owners would you have the same disturbing lack of faith if you lost your screw?
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I'd say no unless I was going to button with it as I have and you must use the pin, otherwise with a vertical roller lock the whacking of the spine causes (of course) vibrations that can cause the spring to compress- after all we are applying great forces by batoning- the result being the roller can disengage ending up with a partial fold. From a safety standpoint the blade is still going to be in the wood (as in my tests). Extrema Ratio state categorically that you must use the pin if you are going to baton.

As the RAOII is currently supplied the pin is attached via 3mm shock cord to the lanyard hole. Shock cord tied with an overhand knot will work it's way undone unless a double fishermans knot is used. I replaced this setup by simply tying the pin with flour orange paracord, with an overhand knot but double fishermans will never accidentally come undone.
 
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