Looking for cheap fighting/survival knife.

rachet197 said:
I've kind of forgot about the glock field knife, it's far from full tang, now I don't only like full tang knives but, given the intended purpose it's a major con.

thx for the reply
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Please explain. Men have been using rat tail tang and stick tang knives for hundreds of years. Your usage will be tougher than theirs?
 
the use of the "rat tail/stick" tangs can be for many reasons, like lack of material, price of steel or just good looks (tell me a hidden tang stag isn't beautiful??) but nobody would ever disagree, that it's not the strongest handle configuration... yes, men have used it for hundreds of years, but we've also done a lot of other not so bright stuff, for the simple fact that it was all we had at the time.
 
For beater knives I like full (width) tangs with removable scales. Easy to inspect. Easy to clean, dry, oil, etc.

But it's really just a personal preference. There's no right or wrong preference.
 
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I'm 40 years old, been woodsrunning all my life and have not once ever needed to baton firewood.

If I needed a smaller chunk of wood, I'll just, you know, gather up a smaller chunk of wood. That's how I've always done it.

Seems so much more simple to me than trying to force a knife through a log.
 
rustyrazor said:
much like the marines themselves... infantry at least, poke, poke. The Ka-bars are tough as hell. the blade will put up with anything you can throw at it, and soldiers throw as much shit at a knife as anyone you can imagine, not so much because of necessity like you would imagine, but more out of sheer boredom. I've seen it all, and every 4th guy has a ka-bar... in 12 years of this foolishness, I've never seen one fail under some really stupid conditions. I have seen a handle bend after being thrown at a wall somewhere in the neighbourhood of 100 times, but it was still usable and hardly the worse for wear after we bent it back with a vice... it's not my favorite knife, but I love them, and I would bet my life on one if that's all I had.
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+1 :thumbup: There are plenty of other and even better options out there these days but the USMC Ka-Bar is a tried and true design and still one of the best fixed blade knives around for the price imho.
 
rachet197 said:
I've kind of forgot about the glock field knife, it's far from full tang, now I don't only like full tang knives but, given the intended purpose it's a major con.
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Oh, the Glock can handle more than just some "light" batonning... have you not seen the "test" videos? Here. There are 8 nearly uncut videos, I wouldn't recommend watching them in their entirety as they are quite long (to preserve integrity) but skip to sections you find informative.


As a point of fact, the majority of well-made knives (full tang or stub tang, tapered/stick/exposed/etc.) fail in the BLADE, not in the tang. I'd say to worry about the blade first - edge-geometry, heat-treatment, steel choice, stock thickness - and then worry about the handle's ergonomics and retention and comfort in a variety of conditions (e.g. exposed tangs get hot/cold/slippery/corroded along the metal).


One question I would put to you is what you look for in a pommel. The old KaBar pommel has a tendency to pop off when hammered wrong, a Cattaraugus 225Q would serve you better there (and in all ways over a KaBar). Obviously the Glock's pommel isn't meant for pounding, but it seems that it can work. Extended and exposed tangs (SOG, Fallkniven, Gerber) can be pounded on... Which reminds me, what about the Gerber Prodigy?

Just another attribute to think about.
 
rustyrazor said:
the use of the "rat tail/stick" tangs can be for many reasons, like lack of material, price of steel or just good looks (tell me a hidden tang stag isn't beautiful??) but nobody would ever disagree, that it's not the strongest handle configuration... yes, men have used it for hundreds of years, but we've also done a lot of other not so bright stuff, for the simple fact that it was all we had at the time.
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No, it was done for the simple fact that the tang wasn't the usual place for a bladed tool to fail. Failure most often occurs (now as then) in the blade. When looking into bladed tools, the blade should always be the area of greatest importance.
 
Wolf_1989 said:
I'm 40 years old, been woodsrunning all my life and have not once ever needed to baton firewood.

If I needed a smaller chunk of wood, I'll just, you know, gather up a smaller chunk of wood. That's how I've always done it.

Seems so much more simple to me than trying to force a knife through a log.
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+1. I have no idea why so much emphasis is placed on an activity which is an energy waster. Not only that, but most batoning examples and reviews are clearly performed using logs cut with a saw. My conclusion, buy a packable bow saw, and carry a hatchet or machete along with a smaller knife for dressing game.
 
rachet197 said:
I'm looking for a cheap (under $40) fighting/survival knife.
The cold steel gi tanto caught my eye as well, as the glock field knife.
Any ideas for knives or, thoughts on these knives, ideas on modification of the gi tanto belt loop.


THX in advance
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as others have stated, take a look at condor knives and buck.
 
chiral.grolim said:
No, it was done for the simple fact that the tang wasn't the usual place for a bladed tool to fail. Failure most often occurs (now as then) in the blade. When looking into bladed tools, the blade should always be the area of greatest importance.
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not entirely true my friend. any properly designed knife usually has the weakest point somewhere around the blade guard area, and then the tang most likely follows shortly after as these areas are mostly where the thinner material begins and as such is a major stress riser for the blade. this is especially the case when a blade has been ground squarely to accomodate the guard... if a blade is going to break by lateral pressure, it's probably going to occur at this point, or the tang. if it doesn't stand to reason as to why a stick tang is the weakest possible area of a knife, go online and look up some of the destruction videos. should clear a couple questions up for most.
 
marcinek said:
And without getting into a knife fight. :D
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I've never been in a knife fight either...I can insult it, throw it on the ground, punch it and throw things at it, but that damn knife just won't fight back!:D
 
rachet197 said:
I've kind of forgot about the glock field knife, it's far from full tang, now I don't only like full tang knives but, given the intended purpose it's a major con.

thx for the reply
Click to expand...

Hey rachet, the Schrade schf9 extreme survival is very good size I think the blade is 6-1/2 and o.a.l. around 11+", also the Condor Varan is an 8" blade and the Hudson Bay is 8.25" and both sell for about $25-40, and the SOG jungle warrior/jungle canopy are still on the top of my list for what you want, if you really mean 'big', they have 9 and 10 inch blades and are around $45-55. Finally the Cold Steel Bushman is supposed to be okay but I don't personally like the design much. And like a few have said Ontario Spec Plus has a few reat ones to offer. Here's a few piscs so you can at least see what I'm suggesting
These are the SOG Jungle Canopy/Warrior
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Here's the Schrade and proof of how strong yet flexible the 1095 is that they used for it
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This is the Condor Hudson Bay Camp Knife and the Varan. I have the Hudson and its a beast! Screw batoning, I was splitting 4-5" logs in 2-3 whacks.
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and should you want to go even bigger, Condor has the Speed bowie(10" blade) for about $50 and the Boomslang(11"blade) for about $70-both are hardcore workers
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and finally, here are a few of the Spec Plus models-I like the bottom one the best myself, but the 2nd one down would work better for fighting
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Hope these visual aids are of some assistance-happy hunting both for and with your knew knife.:)
 
Wolf_1989 said:
I'm 40 years old, been woodsrunning all my life and have not once ever needed to baton firewood.

If I needed a smaller chunk of wood, I'll just, you know, gather up a smaller chunk of wood. That's how I've always done it.

Seems so much more simple to me than trying to force a knife through a log.
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Batonning is only really supposed to be for getting to dry wood, and that's just to get the fire started.
So, it's only needed when the wood is quite wet (like after a big rain storm), and you don't need thick wood either. Relatively small sticks can be split to expose dry wood with no undue strain on the knife.:)

Batonning isn't supposed to be the log splitting which gets passed off as a woodsy skill.
That said, I still bash the Junglas through 5-6" thick logs, but that's just for the hell of it, not because I think in any way whatsoever that it's a skill.;)
 
rachet197 said:
I'm looking for a cheap (under $40) fighting/survival knife.
The cold steel gi tanto caught my eye as well, as the glock field knife.
Any ideas for knives or, thoughts on these knives, ideas on modification of the gi tanto belt loop.


THX in advance
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http://shop.scrapyardknives.com/pro...AD5448.qscstrfrnt03?productId=60&categoryId=4

Forget cheap, at just three times you budget you can have the best there is. If I were you and I didn't get a Scrapyard 711 I would kick myself repeatedly.

If you don't mind a cordura sheath I love the one currently offered.
http://shop.scrapyardknives.com/pro...AD5448.qscstrfrnt03?productId=49&categoryId=5
 
Also there is the often overlooked Old Hickory Butcher knife they are sub 10 dollars and 1095 carbon steel with a full tang, however they do lack a sheath.
 
knarfeng said:
Please explain. Men have been using rat tail tang and stick tang knives for hundreds of years. Your usage will be tougher than theirs?
Click to expand...

rustyrazor said:
much like the marines themselves... infantry at least, poke, poke. The Ka-bars are tough as hell. the blade will put up with anything you can throw at it, and soldiers throw as much shit at a knife as anyone you can imagine, not so much because of necessity like you would imagine, but more out of sheer boredom. I've seen it all, and every 4th guy has a ka-bar... in 12 years of this foolishness, I've never seen one fail under some really stupid conditions. I have seen a handle bend after being thrown at a wall somewhere in the neighbourhood of 100 times, but it was still usable and hardly the worse for wear after we bent it back with a vice... it's not my favorite knife, but I love them, and I would bet my life on one if that's all I had.
Click to expand...

rustyrazor said:
the use of the "rat tail/stick" tangs can be for many reasons, like lack of material, price of steel or just good looks (tell me a hidden tang stag isn't beautiful??) but nobody would ever disagree, that it's not the strongest handle configuration... yes, men have used it for hundreds of years, but we've also done a lot of other not so bright stuff, for the simple fact that it was all we had at the time.
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I am confused. Your posts seem at odds with one another. You like KaBars and think that they are tough as nails (with this, I obviously agree). But you don't like stick tangs. The KaBar has a stick tang.

And I still have not heard from the OP why a stick tang is unacceptable for his use.
 
If the material is right (good steel and good heat treat), and the tang is at least 1/3 the width of the blade at the guard/bolster, it will hold up just fine, so long as it's a full length tang.

All tangs are not created equal. But a hidden tang/stick tang, done right, is stronger than you might think.



Again, I have a Camillus version of the USMC KaBar, which I bought for about $20 in 1989 and I've put that knife through a lot of use, some of which was pushing it, and it has held up perfectly.
 
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