Looking For "Sharp out of Box" slip joint.

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Jan 25, 2013
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The last 4 slipjoint knives I bought (case cv and bear and son carbon) came dull as a banana! Few of them even kept an edge after sharpening with a lansky!? I've been told on other forums that these knives are meant for collecting not using. I looked into GEC but I'm getting similar reviews.

My question is this: are there any factory slippies that come sharp, easy to sharpen, retain a decent edge???
Or is that a thing of the past?
 
kind of sad ,but I have acouple of Buck's offshore products that were sharper out of the box ,than their north American made stuff .Afriend is abig Rough Rider fan and while I am not abig fan ,they do come sharp out of the box .They seem to hang on pretty darn good as well .
 
kind of sad ,but I have acouple of Buck's offshore products that were sharper out of the box ,than their north American made stuff .Afriend is abig Rough Rider fan and while I am not abig fan ,they do come sharp out of the box .They seem to hang on pretty darn good as well .
I've owned numerous RR knives and , sad to say, they always out perform my us slippies?! I especially like there canoe pattern but I'd rather own US made knives. Here lately I've reverted to a US Schrade 34ot and love it.
 
Well, whoever gave that advise on another forum is nuts. Case is a great using knife. But it is true that many knives don't come as shape as they could be from the factory. The one notable exceptions the Swiss Victorinox. I've yet to find a new out of the box Victorinox that wasn't ready to be dropped in a pocket and used.
 
The last 4 slipjoint knives I bought (case cv and bear and son carbon) came dull as a banana! Few of them even kept an edge after sharpening with a lansky!? I've been told on other forums that these knives are meant for collecting not using. I looked into GEC but I'm getting similar reviews.

My question is this: are there any factory slippies that come sharp, easy to sharpen, retain a decent edge???
Or is that a thing of the past?

I think most of the posters in the Traditional Forum use at least some of their knives. A lot of us are primarily "users", not "collectors". Personally, I use all of mine. And I am a steel junky at heart, so I fuss about edge retention.

I sharpen every knife I buy, whether it be modern or Traditional. I find that Buck does about the best job of providing an out-of-the-box sharp blade.

As for maintaining an edge, I'll get flack for saying this, but the brands you list are known for running their steel soft.

Best brands for edge retention are:
Queen D2 blades.
Schatt & Morgan (Queen) "File and Wire" Series ATS-34
Canal Street 14-4 Cr-Mo (same composition as 154CM and ATS-34)
GEC 440C blades
GEC O1
GEC 1095
Opinel stainless

I put O1 and 1095 at the bottom because those alloys do not contain carbides and therefore inherently do not have the edge retention of a carbide containing alloy. But all these brands run their steel harder than the brands you list and have superior edge retention to those knives.
 
Case? Not for using? Hilarious. Get yourself a Peanut and put your own bevel on it, never tried Bear and Son. But seriously, look at threads regarding the Case Peanut in case you haven't done so yet.
 
Best brands for edge retention are:
Queen D2 blades.
Schatt & Morgan (Queen) "File and Wire" Series ATS-34
Canal Street 14-4 Cr-Mo (same composition as 154CM and ATS-34)
GEC 440C blades
GEC O1
GEC 1095
I second that completely, but i'm still a Peanut junkie ;)
 
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Yes Jacknife Sac's are always good to go ,and you dont have to spend the kids milk money to own one.
 
Get yourself a made in USA 300 series Buck slipjoint and you can almost guarantee it will be sharp out the box.
 
Well, whoever gave that advise on another forum is nuts. Case is a great using knife. But it is true that many knives don't come as shape as they could be from the factory. The one notable exceptions the Swiss Victorinox. I've yet to find a new out of the box Victorinox that wasn't ready to be dropped in a pocket and used.
yes and Victorinox makes a few million a year & their QC is second to none- Case is not far behind considering how many they produce each year, good points Carl
 
I had even a Buck Cadet once that came extremely dull. Most of my Bucks have had good edges, though.

Some of my Case knives from the '90s were dull OOB. I bought some others since 2007 or so, and they have good edges. The Peanut I got recently had excellent OOB sharpness.

As mentioned, Victorinox is never dull OOB. Vic is the most consistent and precise; they set the edge angles at 15 degrees per side with a laser for each blade at the factory. Amazing, considering Vic is by far the largest knife manufacturer on the planet.

I have a combination traditional/modern pattern from Kershaw, with wood handles, clip and wharney blades, bolsters, etc., made in Japan that has outstanding fit/finish and very sharp edges.

I can definitely sharpen my knives. And I know some people say OOB sharpness isn't that important. I disagree. If the product is a knife, its purpose is to cut. IMO, a knife should come with good edges. When I sharpen it, it should be a REsharpening after some use, not having to give it its initial bevels. Boxing a new knife with dull edges is like selling a new car with the tires nearly flat. Especially knives that cost more.

The fact that Vic always delivers positively in that regard, they're great quality AND inexpensive, speaks volumes.

Jim
 
There are some things that make it easier for a factory edge to be sharp out-of-the-box. A THINLY-ground blade is the likely the easiest, because a minimum of steel needs to come off to leave a clean, fresh & sharp edge. This is where Victorinox has a built-in advantage, as their blades are very thin as compared to similarly-sized blades in similar profiles (spear & pen blades, primarily) from other makers. The flipside to Vic's blades is, they're probably 'softer' than most of the others (Case, Buck, GEC, Queen at least). So, though Vic's blades are very easy to make sharp in the first place, the thin grind and softish steel will mean touch-ups will have to come more frequently. Again, good news is, it's easy to do with just a few feather-light passes on most any Fine or finer hone, because the grind and softish steel make it very easy.

Case's blades are typically thicker (somewhat) than Victorinox, but thinner than Buck and Queen (maybe GEC, but I don't have any of these to directly compare similar blade profiles side-by-side). Case's steel is a tad 'softer' than Buck and others, but still a tad harder than Victorinox's blades. Again, both of Case's steels are easy to deal with and make sharp, even if they aren't, so much, out-of-the-box.

Knowing what I know now, my focus would be to select a brand that's easiest to make sharp and maintain on the simplest and most widely-available of tools, and otherwise essentially worry-free. This doesn't always mean 'harder steel is better than softer steel', as sometimes the 'softer' ones make life easier in the first place. Start by looking for blade profiles with thinner grinds in steels that are easy to deal with for sharpening (which, in this context, usually includes most everything mentioned except possibly D2 and some renditions of 440C). The other attributes of RC hardness and high wear resistance (440C, D2) become less important for typical traditional-knife EDC uses, if the steel is fundamentally easy to sharpen and maintain in the first place. On this scale, I'd put Victorinox (stainless) and Schrade USA (1095) first, Case 2nd (either CV or Tru-Sharp/420HC), Buck 3rd ('harder' 420HC and usually thicker grinds than Vic or Case), with others likely coming after those, and Queen's D2 likely last, in terms of making a bad factory edge truly sharp in the first place; maintenance is easier when that's out of the way.

And to re-emphasize, THINNER blade grinds will always, always cut better than THICKER grinds, assuming each is given a clean & crisp apex to start with. That'll make the bigger difference than most anything else, in the long run.

Also keep in mind, what's described as 'soft' steel these days is likely right smack in the wheelhouse of virtually all of the 'great' traditional knives of yesterday, with the notable exception of Schrade USA, who ran their steels harder than most, to near-60 at times. Otherwise, RC hardness in the mid-to-high 50s (think Case's blades today) is what was considered 'normal' in traditional blades about 20 or more years ago. Many older knives in simple carbon steels were sometimes down in the '40s in HRC hardness, and yet they still can cut like demons because their makeup was pure and fine-grained, and effortlessly simple to maintain.


David
 
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I once bought a knife only to find out it wasn't very sharp out of the box.

I sharpened it. :rolleyes:

-- Mark
 
That come sharp? Yes, rough rider.

Easy to sharpen? Yes, Great Eastern, Case, Victorinox, and Buck.

Retain a decent edge? Queen, Great Eastern.



One that does it all?

Not in my experience. If you find it, please let me know.
 
That come sharp? Yes, rough rider.

Easy to sharpen? Yes, Great Eastern, Case, Victorinox, and Buck.

Retain a decent edge? Queen, Great Eastern.



One that does it all?

Not in my experience. If you find it, please let me know.

True

Best brands for edge retention are:
Queen D2 blades.
Schatt & Morgan (Queen) "File and Wire" Series ATS-34
Canal Street 14-4 Cr-Mo (same composition as 154CM and ATS-34)
GEC 440C blades
GEC O1
GEC 1095
Opinel stainless

I put O1 and 1095 at the bottom because those alloys do not contain carbides and therefore inherently do not have the edge retention of a carbide containing alloy. But all these brands run their steel harder than the brands you list and have superior edge retention to those knives.

Love stuff like this. I want a longer list.
 
I use all my Case knives and have no problem with dull blades out of the box or edge retention. I usually sharpen all the machine marks off my blades as soon as I get them, just follow the edge bevel and you should be good to go. Try using a good stone and hold your work at a level where you can watch your angles. Case knives are very usable and do hold a good edge if you do your part.
God Bless
Tracy
 
I once bought a knife only to find out it wasn't very sharp out of the box.

I sharpened it. :rolleyes:

-- Mark

I've had both traditional and modern knives that came butterknife dull OOB, and sharpened them up myself. The point is, I don't think it's unreasonable to expect brand new knives to have decent edges on them, especially premium knives. I can expect a cheap machete to come dull, but IMO a pocket knife should come sharp. I'm aware that in the past it was common and often expected for a knife to come dull OOB so the owner can put his own edge on.

Jim
 
For the quality of the build I think Queen knives, with their premium handle covers and D2 steel, are still underpriced. If I wanted a single user, I'd buy a Queen #9 stockman in the covers of my choice, send it to a sharpening specialist to thin, even out and sharpen the edge bevels to their maximum, and I'd still have less invested than in a GEC #81 or #82. You would then have a slicing machine that would only require light stropping to keep hair popping sharp all the time.
 
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