m390 tough enough ?

bodog said:
For a job that requires toughness and strength, there are many choices. M390 is not one of them.
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[video=youtube;gFzI9U64bjg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFzI9U64bjg[/video]
 
I really enjoy working with M390 and I am VERY happy with the way it performs. The Heat treat is very sensitive and must be done in a very precise environment, I always aim between 60.5 and 61.5 and it comes out very nice. Great edge retention, easy to maintain a very nice edge. But like others have mentioned, I would not recommend it for its "toughness". I agree that 3V is the undisputed champion in this arena :)
With that said, we just finished a batch of Guardian4's in M390 and in the early testing, I am BEYOND impressed with this run!
This is a pic of the G4 in hand with the "Nimbus" finish and Red G10 scales.

View attachment 562954

Thanks for all the support you guys!
-Bradford
 
You might want to get a softer heat treat. I've dug out boar tusks with my ESEE 3 with no damage to the tip.
 
I live in the South and I sweat like a pig!That being said I prize stainlessness.Good edge holding is good too but to be truthful 154CM holds an edge well enough to meet my needs.
That being said M390 seems like an ideal EDC steel to me.I really like my Knifeworks 710-1401.I think I will have it for a very long time...and for what I do the M390 will be perfect.

The combination of edge holding and stainlessness is wonderful.Carbon steel will rust very fast in pocket here.M390...not so much!

Again, to be forthright...I have not had 154CM rust on me or S30V either.But I abandoned carbon steels long ago...pitting makes for a great deal of damage.And possible crack origination sites.

I know serious tool steels are very strong.But rust is stronger...and it is sneaky.I oil my stainless knives.I hate corrosion that much!!!
 
cistercian said:
I live in the South and I sweat like a pig!That being said I prize stainlessness.Good edge holding is good too but to be truthful 154CM holds an edge well enough to meet my needs.
That being said M390 seems like an ideal EDC steel to me.I really like my Knifeworks 710-1401.I think I will have it for a very long time...and for what I do the M390 will be perfect.

The combination of edge holding and stainlessness is wonderful.Carbon steel will rust very fast in pocket here.M390...not so much!

Again, to be forthright...I have not had 154CM rust on me or S30V either.But I abandoned carbon steels long ago...pitting makes for a great deal of damage.And possible crack origination sites.

I know serious tool steels are very strong.But rust is stronger...and it is sneaky.I oil my stainless knives.I hate corrosion that much!!!
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Nothing wrong with that. I do believe a lot of people value corrosion resistance too much but yeah, if you have a legitimate need for a stainless steel, M390 is a top performer in most respects.
 
Ankerson said:
[video=youtube;gFzI9U64bjg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gFzI9U64bjg[/video]
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S30V - 38J @ 58-60
M390 - 41J @ 58
A2 - 56J @ 60

CPM M4 - 38J @ 63.5
S30V - 38J @ 58-60?
M390 - 41J @ 58?
O1 - 41J @ 62
3V - 113 @ 58
A2 - 56J @ 60
L6 - 93J @ 57
S7 - 169J @ 57

It is just a hair tougher than S30V at similar Rc. So again, not a tough steel. Maybe a tough stainless though.
 
For a EDC blade it is sufficient for me.Now if we are talking heavy use as a camp/trail blade I think L6 would rock.I have used a L6 blade before and it's edge retention was first class to me.
I think it is tough enough for most heavy use as well.The one I played with was a custom a friend had.It had a patina as well.It was obvious it rusted readily...so oily rags in a bag were required.
That knife was easy to sharpen crazy sharp as well.Aside from corrosion resistance I thought it was epic!
 
cistercian said:
For a EDC blade it is sufficient for me.Now if we are talking heavy use as a camp/trail blade I think L6 would rock.I have used a L6 blade before and it's edge retention was first class to me.
I think it is tough enough for most heavy use as well.The one I played with was a custom a friend had.It had a patina as well.It was obvious it rusted readily...so oily rags in a bag were required.
That knife was easy to sharpen crazy sharp as well.Aside from corrosion resistance I thought it was epic!
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Define EDC blade. You mean cutting soft things? Then yeah.
 
bodog said:
Define EDC blade. You mean cutting soft things? Then yeah.
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Truthfully...pretty much.The use is really pretty light as far as cutting stuff goes.But the use is severe in terms of the sweaty pocket time.

Carbon steels in pocket rust on me.The pivot getting rough really sucks.So stainless it is...as far as cutting goes it is barely dilettante level!
Opening barbie doll and other blister packs is as rough as it gets...so no serious use at all!

No feathersticks etc.If I go camping I use a 1945 TRU-Temper machete for serious chores.I have not broken it yet!
 
Sonnydaze said:
Note Jim Ankerson's post...it's VERY likely that he had tested a GSO M390 sample knife for hardness...

I have owned four of Guy Seiferd's GSO series knives...one was a 4.1 in M390 which I gifted to one of my sons.
His knives and his steels are excellent... I've had them in M390, CPM-3V and CPM-20CP.

This is from Guy's web-page. Note that CPM-20CV and M390 are chemically identical. From one web-source...
M390 / CPM 20CV is a PM stainless steel that offers good wear resistance with excellent corrosion resistance through the use of high chromium and vanadium content. The PM process combined with the high chromium content imparts M390 / CPM 20CV with good grindability and excellent polishability. Its high austenizing temperature imparts M390 with a high attainable hardness of RC 58-62.

from Guy Seiferd's site... (in bold print)
About CPM-20CV: CPM-20CV is a very high quality martensitic stainless steel, with outstanding corrosion resistance and excellent edge holding. CPM-20CV does lack the impact toughness of CPM-3V but being made with the CPM process, this steel is still very resistant to lateral stress (flex) breakage. Consider CPM-20CV for a very low maintenance, all weather cutting tool.

What is the Rockwell hardness of your knives?
All of our blades made with CPM steels are expertly heat treated to 58-59 Rc. Our S7 blades are expertly heat treated to 57-58Rc. All of our blades undergo multiple tempers and a cryo treatment, to maximize toughness and longevity.
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I have one of the 1st run GSO 4.1's that was in M390. :thumbup:

I tested it fully and it's one tough/strong SOB.
 
It should be tough enough.
I've beaten the hell out of S30V blades with no issues.

Of course, I'm not stabbing through tanks. ;)
If you are gamma irradiated, huge, green, and people don't like you when you're angry, perhaps you should chose a tougher steel. :D
 
stabman said:
It should be tough enough.
I've beaten the hell out of S30V blades with no issues.

Of course, I'm not stabbing through tanks. ;)
If you are gamma irradiated, huge, green, and people don't like you when you're angry, perhaps you should chose a tougher steel. :D
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Same here, they are all tool steels in the end so as long as the HT and geometry is correct they can take quite a lot if they have to.
 
My general rule of thumb is stainless steels for folders, tool steels for fixed blades that I may abuse a bit. I think this is a pretty good way to roll, generally speaking.

That said I do have a fixed blade in S90V but I understand its limitations. All stainless steels will be more brittle than tool steels. I would recommend 3V or 52100 for what you want.
 
Buffalohump said:
My general rule of thumb is stainless steels for folders, tool steels for fixed blades that I may abuse a bit. I think this is a pretty good way to roll, generally speaking.

That said I do have a fixed blade in S90V but I understand its limitations. All stainless steels will be more brittle than tool steels. I would recommend 3V or 52100 for what you want.
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Speaking of some tough 52100:
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/1309186-Chopping-nail-(size-16d)-test

It's more about taking it as thin as possible while still retaining enough toughness to handle dings and bangs against random materials while still having good to great wear resistance rather than being thick as hell and sacrificing cutting efficiency. This doesn't get tested very often but I believe it's more in line with what people actually need in an EDC (or most knives for that matter) rather than super high wear resistance and low toughness in an inefficiently thick blade. Unless you want to hang from your knife, then by all means get something thick.
 
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bodog said:
Unless you want to hang from your knife, then by all means get something thick.
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That ZT 0180 is thick at .200" thick, pretty beefy for a 4" fixed blade.

The GSO 4.1 is .155" (My M390).
 
bodog said:
Yeah, quite a bit thicker than necessary but does that surprise you coming from ZT?
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These days, no.... And not just ZT either. ;)

Typical of most of what I saw when I was at Blade this year, that's both folders and fixed blades.
 
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