Made in Taiwan

LUW, I think I understand where you're coming from. I'm pretty much the same way myself. It probably is just the time period we grew up in. When I was growing up most products made in Asia was junk that was bought when someone couldn't afford to buy a first line product or just didn't feel the need to buy the best.

Times have changed for sure. There are good products to be found both foreign made and US made but I still typically see the Made in So and So mark thinking junk. Now I just try to buy the best product I can buy regardless of country of origin but I do notice I always check to see where it's made at.
 
stanleyfirst said:
now chinese people lived in a stage of high price level, low salary.

we cannot marry, because to be a man, we need purchase a house before marriage, around 200,000USD in Shanghai for a small house not luxury at all.

we cannot have a bady, another 20,000USD come out.

we cannot get sick, incredible medicine price and low medical insurance.

we cannot die, the crematorium would take another huge charge from the dead peron's families.

the most important is you cannot tell truth in the public, or you will be "HARMONYLIZED" (CHINESE INVENTED WORD MEANS ERASED SILENTLY)
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Sounds like you were just telling the same truth right here in the good old U.S.A... We rent cause we couldn't afford a house, even you can buy one but you will be broke in no time paying its outrageous taxes. Do you know people over the other side of the pond do not have to pay property tax? We have only one child cause we couldn't afford another. I am exercising whenever I can to keep myself in good shape cause I couldn't afford to get sick. You couldn't die either since your family may depends on you to survive. What's the use of you can tell truth? No one really care about you anyway...maybe feel better after much ranting...:yawn:
 
BWSkipper said:
LUW, I think I understand where you're coming from. I'm pretty much the same way myself. It probably is just the time period we grew up in. When I was growing up most products made in Asia was junk that was bought when someone couldn't afford to buy a first line product or just didn't feel the need to buy the best.

Times have changed for sure. There are good products to be found both foreign made and US made but I still typically see the Made in So and So mark thinking junk. Now I just try to buy the best product I can buy regardless of country of origin but I do notice I always check to see where it's made at.
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Pretty much my case too. I grew up in the US in the 70's, and my dad still has Craftsman and Stanley tools that he uses to this day (and that I'll use when I inherit them). Those things were made to last! At the time, anything from the Far East was a "cheap knock-off", so I grew up hearing and seeing that if you wanted quality you had to buy American or European products. It's hard to shake off that kind of education and just embrace the whole world-globalization thing :rolleyes:.

Guess it's like buying a Sebenza: you can find a cheaper blade for less money but just as good, but it ain't a Sebenza. Bragging rights is something we have to pay for :cool:.
 
I am a child of the 50's, so my perspective is obviously influenced by such. I can remember a time when one person's income would permit a comfortable living for a family; I can remember a time when an American/Canadian made appliance was both made to last and made to be repaired if necessary; I can remember a time when workers took pride in their work and I can remember a time when if a person worked harder, they could advance rather than be laid off. Most of all, I remember a time when we didn't export our jobs to other countries and realized that sometimes the cheapest product ended up being the most expensive in the long run.

I don't have all the answers, but I do know how to vote with my dollars and whenever possible, I'll vote 'home grown'.
 
You are not alone in you looking upon made in Taiwan or China (and yes, I DO know the difference!) as being "less than" the U.S.

The U.S. is somewhat insulated from the rest of the world. We are not a worldly people for the most part. (of course there are exceptions) Therefore we will have our predjudices against things made in foreign lands.

Think about it this way: China is a world superpower and is the factory of the world. Everything from cars to computer chips are made there. Taiwan has a thriving electronics industry, which means that sophisticated machining technology exists there. These are not "third world" countries, they are at the top of the world when it comes to high-tech industries.

Any more, it all comes down to which country has both the capacity AND low relative labor costs to compete. And then you have to find that exact factory with the personal the "see the difference" as Sal Glesser has said.

So, it would be a mistake to think that an Asian-made knife is of any less quality than its American-made counterparts.

Now the whole "Buy American" debate is another matter. I believe that many people may say they follow this rule, but in reality it would be very time-consuming to figure out what it means to say "American" made. Does it mean buying a GM car made in Canada? Or a Toyota made in Kentucky by Americans?

In practice we're a pragmatic society. We buy things that we perceive to be the best values, regardless of where they're made.

The consumer market covers all levels from the Wal-Mart crowd to Saks Fifth Avenue. American labor can still compete with the worldwide market, but it's usually for upscale goods. Knives fall into this category. You see the lower-end knives being made exclusively overseas. However at the mid and high-end, U.S. makers are in the mix. What has been happening in the last few years is that the Asian factories are starting to be big players here: i.e. Seki City, and now some Taiwan factories.

Maybe that's the reason for your sentiments. In time, I'm sure the perception of "Made in Taiwan" will change, just like "Made in Japan" over several decades.
 
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well i guss my broken logic need to go see tht head doc. i try to by only made in tx. if i can if i cant i make it myself in tx. but im old and out of date
 
00max00 said:
Sounds like you were just telling the same truth right here in the good old U.S.A... We rent cause we couldn't afford a house, even you can buy one but you will be broke in no time paying its outrageous taxes. Do you know people over the other side of the pond do not have to pay property tax? We have only one child cause we couldn't afford another. I am exercising whenever I can to keep myself in good shape cause I couldn't afford to get sick. You couldn't die either since your family may depends on you to survive. What's the use of you can tell truth? No one really care about you anyway...maybe feel better after much ranting...:yawn:
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yes, just complaining, today China's premier said a government's achievement should judge by the people, i really donot know what channel should i judge..

Back to the topic, now maybe products made in china is bad, but it won't always like that..
 
Zigosity said:
:| Alarmist much?

I don't care where something is made, so long as that something is of acceptable quality. I don't live in the USA either, though, so I guess I don't have any sort of patriotic duty to boost the American economy, nor any sort of prejudice towards buying things from other countries. I'll be importing it regardless of if it's Chinese or American manufacture, so it doesn't really matter to me :).
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What did he say that was false?
 
For me it really depends on quality, if the quality control standards are held to a very high level then the products will be great. :)

I own Busses, Striders, ZT, Case, Buck, and older Cold Steels that are made in the USA. :thumbup:

I also own knives made in Japan, China, Taiwan, and the Himalayas. :)
 
winbag338 said:
What did he say that was false?
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What did Zigosity say that was false?

The idea that we shouldn't trade with China because they have nukes pointed at us is as silly as China not trading with the US because the US has nukes pointed at them. It's presupposed that all trading partners must be subject to American power.

Would you not do business with someone who is armed? Someone who open carries? Why should I not? Same goes with international business. Being armed is often thought to be a wise thing. Interesting how huffy Americans can get about Chinese leveling the playing field when the US has a significantly stronger history of flexing it's military might around the globe at the drop of a hat.

Saying that Chinese are not cosmopolitan and democratic is not only a weak rationalization, it's increasingly false. American trade (and Western trade in general) has been the biggest boon to the prosperity of actual Chinese people in history. With that prosperity comes power, worldliness and mobility. And it has been accomplished in a way that has not destroyed prosperity in the US or elsewhere. Quite the opposite, in fact.

And how many folks on this forum pride themselves as being cosmopolitan, anyhow? Seriously?!?! After hanging around these forums for a few years, I size up most folks here as largely provincial. Anything but cosmopolitan. Yet, I'm supposed to think China is bad because it supposedly has a trait that it shares with so many knife nuts?

Furthermore, the other trading partners around the globe are not all that free to begin with. Europe is pretty much a continent of socialist nations with nowhere near the kinds of freedoms Americans enjoy. Yet, for some reason, they are preferable to the much more capitalism-embracing Chinese.
 
China's human rights and trading practices speak for themselves. If I have the choice I will try to avoid supporting a goverment like that.
 
shecky said:
What did Zigosity say that was false?

The idea that we shouldn't trade with China because they have nukes pointed at us is as silly as China not trading with the US because the US has nukes pointed at them. It's presupposed that all trading partners must be subject to American power.

Would you not do business with someone who is armed? Someone who open carries? Why should I not? Same goes with international business. Being armed is often thought to be a wise thing. Interesting how huffy Americans can get about Chinese leveling the playing field when the US has a significantly stronger history of flexing it's military might around the globe at the drop of a hat.

Saying that Chinese are not cosmopolitan and democratic is not only a weak rationalization, it's increasingly false. American trade (and Western trade in general) has been the biggest boon to the prosperity of actual Chinese people in history. With that prosperity comes power, worldliness and mobility. And it has been accomplished in a way that has not destroyed prosperity in the US or elsewhere. Quite the opposite, in fact.

And how many folks on this forum pride themselves as being cosmopolitan, anyhow? Seriously?!?! After hanging around these forums for a few years, I size up most folks here as largely provincial. Anything but cosmopolitan. Yet, I'm supposed to think China is bad because it supposedly has a trait that it shares with so many knife nuts?

Furthermore, the other trading partners around the globe are not all that free to begin with. Europe is pretty much a continent of socialist nations with nowhere near the kinds of freedoms Americans enjoy. Yet, for some reason, they are preferable to the much more capitalism-embracing Chinese.
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I didnt claim there was a false statement being made, and its obvious your perception of historical events is based on the ignorant 3rd world model of ingrate indoctrination.
 
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Taiwan is a strong U.S ally I have no problem buying from them as long as it is quality, if I find that the U.S makes the same item and of quality I will be U.S before all others if possible
 
The thing I want the most is good value for money - what does that mean as far as the country of manufacture is concerned?

I think it is probably France for the Opinels and Sweden for the Moras.
 
winbag338 said:
Trying to separate politics from the world market in this climate is a form of intellectual dishonesty.
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Explain to me the geopolitical, macroeconomic or any other significant implications of buying a knife made in Taiwan please?
 
I prefer US-made knives, but I own many knives from all over the world.
My Spydercos come from America, Japan, Taiwan, and china.
My Kershaws come from America and China (don't own any Japanese ones).
My Opinels come from France and my Mercator is from Germany.
My Okapis and Cold Steel machetes are from South Africa.
My Tramontinas are from Brazil, and I love my El Salvador Condors.

I guess what I'm saying is, it's not where it's made that I care about, but what the company is. If the product is good, then I don't care so much where it's made.
 
Amaranth said:
You are not alone in you looking upon made in Taiwan or China (and yes, I DO know the difference!) as being "less than" the U.S.

The U.S. is somewhat insulated from the rest of the world. We are not a worldly people for the most part. (of course there are exceptions) Therefore we will have our predjudices against things made in foreign lands.

Think about it this way: China is a world superpower and is the factory of the world. Everything from cars to computer chips are made there. Taiwan has a thriving electronics industry, which means that sophisticated machining technology exists there. These are not "third world" countries, they are at the top of the world when it comes to high-tech industries.

Any more, it all comes down to which country has both the capacity AND low relative labor costs to compete. And then you have to find that exact factory with the personal the "see the difference" as Sal Glesser has said.

So, it would be a mistake to think that an Asian-made knife is of any less quality than its American-made counterparts.

Now the whole "Buy American" debate is another matter. I believe that many people may say they follow this rule, but in reality it would be very time-consuming to figure out what it means to say "American" made. Does it mean buying a GM car made in Canada? Or a Toyota made in Kentucky by Americans?

In practice we're a pragmatic society. We buy things that we perceive to be the best values, regardless of where they're made.

The consumer market covers all levels from the Wal-Mart crowd to Saks Fifth Avenue. American labor can still compete with the worldwide market, but it's usually for upscale goods. Knives fall into this category. You see the lower-end knives being made exclusively overseas. However at the mid and high-end, U.S. makers are in the mix. What has been happening in the last few years is that the Asian factories are starting to be big players here: i.e. Seki City, and now some Taiwan factories.

Maybe that's the reason for your sentiments. In time, I'm sure the perception of "Made in Taiwan" will change, just like "Made in Japan" over several decades.
Click to expand...

:thumbup:
 
China has serious human rights issues that need to be addressed.

I can probably find equal and/or better substitutes for almost every knife I collect and use at a fraction of the prices I paid if I primarily focused on buying from China, but I don't. I still vote with my dollars and no one is going tell me otherwise unless they want to waste their breath/words.

I predominantly buy from US, Japan, and others. I do occasionally buy Taiwanese and lastly Chinese knives, but not much. I actively try to avoid Chinese products most of the time, although I do want to purchase their high quality well made products if only I can sleep well at night knowing what goes on in that country.

I am not an idiotic blinded race horse. I do know the whole country of China is a victim despite their impressive resourcefulness. They are over populated and poor and as such they are easy prey to corruption. I also know a country needs revenue to feed it's people so I do buy Chinese products from time to time. If they seriously did their best to resolve the human rights issues I would vote by opening my wallet up a lot more to them. Would you ?

As far as some American companies are concerned I will not name them but the people that run them are well fed greedy thieves who will jump at the first opportunity to screw their own country over, fire their employees, rush over to poor broken countries and squeeze every drop of blood and sweat out of it's impoverished population to make more money than they will ever need. When they are done they will throw them away just like they did to their american employees.
 
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Unfortunately as much as I hate to I have to add the American public to that list for being greedy dumb ass cannibals for not rolling with the punches and flooding these crooks with their hard earned money. They would not be in business without the public willingness to be pound foolish penny pinchers. Something to think about if you have a fetish for pinching pennies.
 
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