Moras an Opinel - first impressions

[thombrogan]

My wife got me two Moras and an Opinel as an anniversary present.

I'm very spoiled rotten.

My fevered mind thought that the Scandi grind was only on one side of the blade and the other side was flat. Happily, I was wrong. It turns out that the hours-long reprofiling I used to do with my Edge-Pro was applying a Scandi grind to my production knives. Also, both moras, from KJ Eriksson and Frosts, had micro-bevels. I remember a guy here being attacked for his culturally insensitive gesture of applying microbevels, but our pals in the Northlands like their microbevels, too.

The first mora was made by KJ Eriksson:

[size=-1]image from Ragweed Forge[/size]

Blazing sharp NIB, it sliced paper with no problem and passed the RazorEdge Systems EdgeTester test. The handle feels very secure in a variety of grips and it has a guard for klutzes like me. The sheath is okay and its pleather belt loop makes it fit most belts.

The second mora was made by Frosts of Sweden:

[size=-1]image from Ragweed Forge[/size]

With a harder steel than the KJ Eriksson mora, this should have better edge retention when cutting soft materials. Blazing sharp NIB, too, it was a pleasure to eviscerate junk mail with this handy Scandi sharpy. No guard on the handle, the knife relies on the user not being an idiot, so it's a risky knife for me. The sheath is, well, if I were to EDC this high-test piece of cutting goodness, I'd be emailing Leatherman or Tom Krein about it right now.

The Opinel was model # 8 and looked much like the top knife in this photo:

[size=-1]image from Ragweed Forge[/size]

Lightly burred NIB, it still cut paper well, just with more force. Deburred quickly. A great, lightweight folding knife that locks closed or open, the Opinel sports a slightly convex grind from spine to edge and the edge is thin enough to quickly take a flat or convex edge without taking too much time (so if you only have flat stones or only have a strop, no worries).

My wife bought these for me from Ragweed Forge and they shipped these knives promptly with low cost.

It was very nice to receive three knives with very high cutting ability. The trend in knives is to make them too weak for hard use and too thick for efficient cutting. Glad to see that Frosts of Sweden, KJ Eriksson, and Opinel haven't conformed to that trend (and glad to see that some less traditional companies like Spyderco, Ranger Knives, Swamprat Knifeworks, and Busse Combat also buck that trend).

 

[Bob W]

Thanks for the notes. I've always been a fan of Opinel, but don't have a Mora (yet).

My first experience seeing an Opinel was on a 21-day desert survival course near Escalante, Utah - a "knife-and-blanket" sort of thing. Guess who had an Opinel as their only knife? The instructor of course.

Best Wishes,
Bob

 

[collecter]

Moras & Opinels are excellent knives and set the standard for cutting performance IMO. Very few other knives challenge them until you get to knives costing close to $100, and even at that price there is a lot of junk!

The #8 is my favorite Opinel.

Collecter

 

[knifetester]

Happy Anniversery!
Yes these knives offer a lot of cuttting performance for the price.

Ragnar at Ragweed has really good customer service, I have ordered from him several times and he has been consistently excellent.

Try the Mora 2000, it is the most well rounded mora for my uses. The front half of the balde has a full flat grind with distal taper, great slicer. The back half is scandi ground and peels off wood like crazy. Good comfortable handle too.

 

[Cliff Stamp]

My wife got me two Moras and an Opinel as an anniversary present.

Does she have a sister?

...but our pals in the Northlands like their microbevels, too.

They are probably used for touchups, I have two distinct methods of sharpening, the quick touchup and the full monty.

When I am cutting, and want to keep cutting, and need to keep the knife sharp it just gets a few passes to set a micro-bevel and it then keeps on cutting.

However once a month or so, I'll then reset the primary edge angles. I really can't see anyone in the field doing the second every time you sharpen the knife.

That is why I always carry a large bastard file when I take my axe into the woods, if I hit something and nick the edge I just apply a secondary bevel and take it off. I'll fix it up to true later when I am home.

The sheath is ....

I thought the loop would break off fairly quickly, but I wasn't that careful with it and it still is there. It isn't up to Chas Clements leather standards, but it does allow you to carry the knife and keep your hand free. It has the same perspective on functionality as the knife. Keep it to the bare essentials.

The Opinel was model # 8 and looked much like the top knife in this photo:

Can you still get the bottom style handle?

My wife bought these for me from Ragweed Forge and they shipped these knives promptly with low cost.

Excellent guy to deal with who actually has used a lot of the knives he sells.

-Cliff

 

[knifetester]

Can you still get the bottom style handle?

Sure, all you need is a package of assorted sand paper and some elbow grease.

There is a gentleman named Donavan Hall that does excellent work on Opinels, reshaping the blades and handles. I do the same type of things to mine, but they are not nearly as nice looking.

Here are some of Hall's knives:

His site:
http://home.earthlink.net/~donojhall/index.html

 

[thombrogan]

Bob W,

If you get the chance, the S-1 mora would be the one to sample, but make sure you're truly on board as the knife costs $14 plus shipping.

Over on some other forum, a survivalist person had a quote that I thought of when I read what your instructor carried:

"The more I have, the less I need to know - Wait, that's not right..."

Collector,

You're right that these knives set some high benchmarks. My first thoughts when they sailed through paper with downright ease was "these are like Spydercos!"

Knifetester,

Thanks and thanks for the suggestion. My next three knife purchases (next year) will be from Spyderco, Tom Krein, and Ranger Knives, but, if these moras continue to grow on me, I'll make the Mora 2000 my fourth. Also, thanks for the pics of the reshaped Opinels.

Cliff,

My wife is an only child, but I'd be happy to forward all of the email jokes her father sends us if you'd like.

Resetting the primary grind is important as the 'micro-bevel' will otherwise grow up and become disenchanted with low-force cutting. Micro-bevels should be heard, not seen.

 

[knifetester]

Thom,
The Mora 2000 would make an excellent companion peice to your S7 RD9. The big RD for chopping, splitting, limbing and over all tearing stuff up, and the Mora 2K for fine work, wood carving, utility and food prep.

M2K shown below an RD9

It is very light weight, inexpensive, easy to sharpen, really just an excellent knife. If you want to "try B4 you buy" shoot me an email and I can send you one out.
Also the Tri-flex and Clipper models are good. I prefer the handles (more secure and ergonomic) over the standard wood round handles. They indix *much* better, and with the small integral guard are much more secure. As well, the rubber and plastic of the M2K and Clipper provide a much better grip with wet and slimy hands than the wood or smooth plastic ones.

 

[Geode]

Thom,

A great thread. Those Moras are hard to beat for woodworking and general utility. Great post.

 

[Cliff Stamp]

TM2K shown below an RD9

Did the DR9 come that way from Justin, the grind looks wavy near the top or is that just the picture.

-Cliff

 

[knifetester]

While the grind does narrow as it approaches the tip, the picture magnifies this. The wavy is reflection more than anything.

The standard RD9 is black coated and saber hollow grind. Mine is satin finished flat grind.

I don't remember the exact measurements, but it is very thick behind the edge, very over built to accomplish the hardest of uses. It is after all made by an Army Ranger with extensive field time. The end user could thin the edge down dramtically if the scope of intended use was narrower.

The steel on mine is 5160, I think from Busse's shop. I was leaning towards S7, but ended up choosing the 5160 since he got it to be super quick. I also felt that 1/4" 5160 was more than enough impact resistance. While 5160 is more wear resistant than S7 this really was not a factor, as wear resistance is not a criteria for me in choosing a large chopping knife, I simply want the toughness of a good spring or shock steel.

Justin was very willing to work with other steels (notably S7) and grinds. I requested the full flat grind, but in retrospect I perhaps should have had the edge convex ground thinner. That is something I can readily do myself, so no big deal.

I would also get thicker handle scales with more radiusing. The stock are fine, but I have big hands and like them filled to absorb impact shock.

Aside from the slight variance in edge grind (no big deal for me since I will be reprofiling anyways), the fit and finish is very good.

Other changes I would make would be to remove the birds beak pommel, it really adds nothing functional for me and smashes my finger under the limited hard impacts I have used it in (new knife syndrome, gotta use it a little as soon as it gets out of the box).

I would also have the spine rounded along its entire length.

Ideally, when Justin gets back from Iraq I would love to have a custom bush knife made: 16" long 3/16" thick S7, full flat grind with a fairly thin convex edge, thick micarta scales with integral guard.



Thom,
Sorry to have hijacked the thread a bit. . . but I would love to ehar how you S7 RD9 performs. . .

I got the knife sometime ago, but have not used it very much at all. In contrast the M2K gets constant use.

 

[cerulean]

Great review, Thom!

Everyone needs to own at least one Mora and Opinel.

 

[Bob W]

If you get the chance, the S-1 mora would be the one to sample, but make sure you're truly on board as the knife costs $14 plus shipping.

Thanks for the heads up. I'll start a savings account, and maybe someday...

I like the Scandanavian style knives, particularly the materials and ergonomics. I do have a Helle Kvernstein (mill stone) and a Karesuando Wolf and recommend them both; the Helle seems the 'nicer' of the two. I'd actually like to have one of each brand sold at Ragweed... Also, AG Russell has a nice selection of Martiini knives from Finland.

Has anyone handled the EKA lockbacks, like those available at Ragweed Forge?

-Bob

 

[Cliff Stamp]

...user could thin the edge down

The vast majority can't though, considering the common sharpening issues. I would assume however Justin can customize the edges on request, even if he left all the stock grinds the same, he could simply overlay a 10 degree edge bevel and the form the final edge at the angle and thickness the user wanted.

16" long 3/16" thick S7, full flat grind with a fairly thin convex edge

I was leaning towards 3/16" for a long time until I used them. They are too floppy at that length, too much vibration on hardwoods, and bind excessively in soft woods. Good for Alders and light vegetation though. Plus after working with khukuris for so many years, my SHBM feels very light to me now so 1/4" is where I would get a similar knife, the weight isn't an issue and it has better stiffness, and makes a more powerful wood cutter.

On an ironic note, this is the same profile (or very similar) to native parangs I discussed with a maker like five years ago and he listed those exact reasons to me why they use thicker blades. They run them a lot longer than 16" though, but they are strictly brush knives, they don't use them for fine work and I want some ability to perform utility knife tasks.

The handle sounds like the old style SHBM, thin grip, bird's beak, etc., yeah there were similar complaints about that grip then which lead to the evolution of the Busse grip. That design from Justin is a solid starting point, what I would like to see is him take his vision as a knifemaker and start moving forward changing the design using his experience and knowledge and making it truely his own.

-Cliff

 

[Easyrider]

My wife got me two Moras and an Opinel as an anniversary present.

I'm very spoiled rotten.

Yes you are Mr. Thombrogan.



Your Wife is a real keeper and happy anniversary.

 

[thombrogan]

Thanks, Easyrider!

How'd finals go? How's your Salsa treating you?

 

[knifetester]

Re: end users thinning out edges

The vast majority can't though, considering the common sharpening issues.

Yes, I suppose this is true for many people. However, sharpening a knife, especially just hogging off metal to thin down an edge is really quite a simple task. Anyone able bodied in the least should be able to do it, the degree of precision required is not difficult to achieve (as you know), especially using a big piece of sandpaper or a grinding belt.

I am sure that Justin could thin down the edge if requested, he was excptionally open in our emails, and his customer servie was top notch.

hardwoods, and bind excessively in soft woods. Good for Alders and light vegetation though. Plus after working with khukuris for so many years, my SHBM feels very light to me now so 1/4" is where I would get a similar knife, the weight isn't an issue and it has better stiffness, and makes a more powerful wood cutter.

3/16" is really the limit I could go and have any blade width. 1/4" at that length would just be too heavy, I don't have nearly the wrist strength to safely handle that much mass at a good swing speed. As well I have a repetive motion disorder (akin to carpal tunnel) which can really put a damper on things.

I have used some Goloks (Imported from Perth, AU) that weere pretty good, great balance, narrow blade (like 1" or less wide) and 1/4- 5/16" thick, convex grind. I could swing it quite well, but the horn handle came apart, and the edge was quite scalloped and blew out.

Truth be told, I really have very little use for this style blade anymore, but they are fun toys.

 

[Easyrider]

Thanks, Easyrider!

How'd finals go? How's your Salsa treating you?

Finals went ok and now I'm waiting for the school to send me my A.S. degree.

I'm getting prepared for Differential Equations class this summer and the Salsa is great!

The blade doesn't hold an edge as long as the D-2 of my Queen slipjoint but the AUS 8 steel does a good job. The Salsa does take a great edge and REALLY easy to sharpen!

 

[Cliff Stamp]

...hogging off metal to thin down an edge is really quite a simple task.

The big problem is just be willing to forget cosmetics I think for many people, take a look around and you will see people not wanting to scratch a finish, or even use a marker on their knives.

My point was mainly for the knifemaker and selling knives. For the majority of consumers NIB sharpness is extremely important, a lot of people use this to judge both the ability of the maker and even the quality of the steel.

Then there are issues like balance. It is an interesting choice because many people want "lively" knives, even on styles which are not actually suited for them. So as a maker do you craft knives which work, or which sell?

Personally NIB sharpness and edge geometry, to a certain extent are not that critical to me. What I would look for most is consistency of behavior from the steel.

I would want a maker who was familar with the performance of his knives, actually used them himself, was open about what they do, and took steps to insure that his level of consistency was high.

As well wasn't too into fads, and would trade functionality just to hop on the newest fad. But again, as a maker, you often have to look at the broad picture, what will simply sell more knives.

I don't have nearly the wrist strength to safely handle that much mass at a good swing speed. As well I have a repetive motion disorder (akin to carpal tunnel) which can really put a damper on things.

I used to get carpat tunnel bad from typing with a really bad style, self taught mainly through years of numerical analysis, starting in the basement of course with data entry.

I started using heavy khukuris about 10 years back which changed both. I would simply bring the biggest one I could with me when I spent the summer limbing, and would work with it until I got tired and had to switch to lighter blades.

Gradually I progressed until I was working with my 22"+ Ang Khola for extended periods of time. It isn't overnight, it isn't even in a year. But hey, you have months in the woods, experimenting with different blades keeps it from getting boring.

...but the horn handle came apart, and the edge was quite scalloped and blew out.

I had the same problem with Valiants, great style, with a more consistent hardness they would be insane performers. If you get a good one they literally are many times over most on market blades for brush work. A machete easily handles the light works jsut as good of course.

-Cliff

 

[knifetester]

The big problem is just be willing to forget cosmetics I think for many people, take a look around and you will see people not wanting to scratch a finish, or even use a marker on their knives.

I had not even thought of that, but now that you mention it that is a factor, for some major.

I suppose people could mask off portions of their knives with tape when sharpening, as shown in the edgepro video. Personally, that is not even remotely a factor for me. I could not care less what a knife looks like cosmetically, in fact I think I prefer the looks of a heavily used knife. As far as looks go, the only thing I don't like are the fantasy and rambo looking knives and I prefer they look like utility tools rather than weapons for legal reasons, as well as not wanting to scare people.

For the majority of consumers NIB sharpness is extremely important, a lot of people use this to judge both the ability of the maker and even the quality of the steel.

While I can sharpen just about any knife if I need to, I do get annoyed with having to sharpen a new knife. Even if I know that I will be changing the edge geometery (and on some knives the primary grind), I still want the knife to be sharp out of the box.

I would want a maker who was familar with the performance of his knives, actually used them himself, was open about what they do, and took steps to insure that his level of consistency was high.

Yes, any good knifemaker will conduct extensive Research and development, including end user trials of their products. Perhaps user feedback is the most important in my mind.

It is hard to get some makers to make solid statements about the performance that can be expected of their knives. Others are quite open, both about their methods and observations and about receiving yours. This is the type of maker I enjoy working with the most.

Re: Carpal tunnel
Mine developed from keyboarding as well.

Working with brush knives and machetes really aggrevates it, because of my swing technique, using that type of blade I articulate my wrist during the swing as it really adds blade speed. In contrast, when chopping thicker, harder wood with either an axe or a big knife I use a locked wrist, driving more from the shoulder and hip and trying to use as much hip as I can (if that makes any sense at all). As well, I find I pace myself much more on heavy work.

So, even though there is more shock and vibration from chopping heavy wood, it is actually harder on me the next day when doing brush work. For example, after a day of brush work, I have heavy tingling in my finger tips, swelling, etc.

I actually don't like Khukuris very much, I bought several from Bill Martino, may he rest in peace, in the late 1990's, and while he was a wonderful man the knives did not work well for my uses. I had very bad glancing problems, and the rings in the handles really bothered my hand.

I had the same problem with Valiants, great style, with a more consistent hardness they would be insane performers. If you get a good one they literally are many times over most on market blades for brush work.

Yes, Valiant was the Goloks I was thinking of, could not remember the name at the time. I got interested in them from reading an article, very well written and the writer seems very knowledgable, he also has several other articles all off which were good.

http://www.outdoors-magazine.com/s_article.php?id_article=78

I just re-read the article, and I see your work was referenced in it in it.

There was another article on that site that compared the golok to machetes, Ontario, Tramontina, Martindale, etc (IIRC) but it does not seem to be in the index anymore.

My perspective is much the same as yours, great design and if quality Control could be improved (or if I could geta really great one), it would be ideal. I would prefer a wood handle, stabalized and secured with a high strength epoxy and perhaps pins, no finger grooves. I did really like swell on the end though.