My first Sighting of Buck/Remington knives for sale.

they will sell thousands of them. Regardless of the knife inside the package.
 
Makael said:
POST FALLS—Bucking a familiar trend in the manufacturing sector, knife maker Buck Knives Inc. says it has been bringing back to its plant here some of the production that it had been contracting out to Chinese manufacturers in recent years.

The shift, made possible partly by plant efficiencies it has made here and triggered by a desire by both its owners and many of its customers for its knives to be U.S.-made, has been under way for months, says C. J. Buck, its president and CEO.

"The good news is manufacturing is absolutely viable in the United States," says Buck. "We're a good example of that."

As recently as three or four years ago, Buck Knives was importing from Chinese contract manufacturers about 50 percent of its knives, he says, adding that today, that percentage is 30 percent to 35 percent. The company's knives are sold all over the world.

Buck Knives plans to increase domestic production by 20 percent this year, and recently hired 10 people to work on its manufacturing floor in Post Falls.

Buck Knives moved to Post Falls in 2005 from El Cajon, Calif., near San Diego. Its 120,000-square-foot Post Falls plant is located at 660 S. Lochsa St., and currently employs 220 people, Buck says. He declines to say what its annual sales have been, not wanting competitors to have the information.

He says one of the reasons Buck Knives had to outsource so much of its production stemmed from the company's relocation from Southern California, which he describes as a massive undertaking that used the majority of its internal resources for almost two years. As part of the transition strategy, the company began to outsource to China manufacturing of its newest products because its engineering staff was so busy training new factory workers in Post Falls, Buck says.

"It's all based around the relocation," he says. "That's what prompted a surge in imports, and now that we're stable in our new factory, it's coming back to our more normal model."

Still, he says, some manufacturing will continue in China, because the price point on some of the knives the company offers doesn't allow it to make them here.

"Only China, right now, is still able to land (at the shipping dock) a product for 20 percent, sometimes 30 percent, less than we can build it," he says. "Oftentimes, China can land a product for less than our cost of our materials."

Because the knives the company imports from China are lower-priced models, only about 25 percent of Buck Knives' overall knife sales, in dollar volume, are of products imported from China, compared with about 40 percent just two to three years ago, Buck says.

Although the majority of the company's sales during the transition period continued to be from U.S.-made products, the importing of knives didn't sit well with the Buck-family tradition, nor did it go over well with some longtime customers.

"We have fielded many complaints about our decision to import products, even though we were clearly focused on offering the same high quality," says Buck. The company backs its imported products with the same lifetime warranty it offers on knives it makes here.

"It has become apparent that Buck Knives is held to a different standard" than other U.S. manufacturers, he says.

Buck Knives has long-term manufacturing partnerships with about seven Chinese companies that specialize in making different types of knives, Buck says.

Buck Knives began to look at implementing lean manufacturing principles even before it moved to Post Falls from Southern California. The company made that decision in late 2001, after it was stung by a big drop in sales following the terrorist attacks of September that year, Buck says.

Remaining a manufacturer

The company, like other cutlery businesses, brings in about 50 percent of its business in the last four months of each year, he says.

The company had to make a choice, he says. Either it could become just a marketing company that sold knives made in other countries, or it could change its manufacturing approach and continue to make knives itself.

To remain a manufacturing company, Buck says, the company needed to reduce its costs, and one significant way to do that was to get out of California, where high energy and labor costs were cutting into its margin. He adds that the political and government atmosphere in California wasn't business-friendly enough, either.

Idaho, the owners expected, would be different, and it was, he says.

"What I really like about Idaho is they keep it simple," Buck says. "They take care of businesses. The businesses are the horses pulling your wagon. Don't hobble the horses pulling your wagon. That's stupid. Help them pull your wagon even better."

At its new plant in Post Falls, Buck Knives continued with its vision for lean manufacturing. It first implemented lean manufacturing in California, and was able to reduce greatly the amount of manufacturing space needed.

"We have made a ton of changes," Buck says. "Now we are letting them be realized."

In the past, the company had made knives in large batches, using a traditional assembly-line process, and it took four to six weeks for the knives to completely travel the line. Now, it makes knives one at a time, in circular manufacturing cells that take up a fraction of the space the old assembly line did in California before the company began to adopt lean manufacturing. In fact, Buck Knives' Post Falls plant has 30 percent less manufacturing space than the one it operated in El Cajon, Buck says.

That change reduced the amount of time it takes to produce a knife, and also enabled Buck Knives to shift production from one product to another far more easily, says Phil Duckett, the company's chief operating officer.

"When the need arises, we can quickly switch our manufacturing cells from making one model to another," Duckett says. "Our ability to respond to customers' orders for products we do not have in inventory has resulted in consistently high marks for shipping our customers' orders on time and complete. You can see the great advantage it gives us over competition (that's) still processing products the way we used to do it."

He adds, "You strive for velocity. You need to convert the raw materials into a salable product as quickly and as efficiently as possible."

Says Buck, "Lean means fast, flexible, and responsive to our dealers."

He says the lean manufacturing efforts ultimately have made it possible for the company to make more knives here rather than having them made by Chinese contract manufacturers.

The changes, Buck says, have made for happy customers, too. He says he's had dealers tell him lately that Buck Knives "is the smoothest vendor to deal with."

Dealers have to maintain less inventory, because Buck Knives can resupply them faster, he says.

"We're responsive, we ship fast, and we ship complete," Buck says. "If I can be more responsive to customers, customers are going to start pushing more business my way, and away from the people that they have to work harder on. The key is to ship complete and on time."

Buck asserts that customers now will push business his way, even if they might pay a little more, because they like the company's flexibility and responsiveness. "Customers don't want to take a risk and get stuck with too much inventory or have back orders," he says.

Although the lean manufacturing efforts have been successful, Buck Knives still must do business in an economy that is weakened by recession and lower consumer spending.

The fourth quarter of last year was incredibly difficult, with sales down from the previous year by about 25 percent to 30 percent, Buck says.

He says the company is planning for a "similarly compressed" sales year this year.

"We're planning on it being worse, even though we expect it to be better," Buck says.

The recent hires, for instance, were added after a stronger than expected first quarter, he says
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When was this released?
 
DeSotoSky said:
Funny, I'm just the opposite, I have a significant sub collection of the ChinaBuck slip joints, probably the only person on this forum who does collect them. I have every model & handle variation I know of, just the 389 Canoes alone figures about 25 different handles over the years. Now for the tins, I find them a storage nuisance and wish Buck would do something smaller. Just can't get rid of the original packaging... it's a curse. Admittedy it is definately a value loss to my collection,they depreciated before I left the WalMart parking lot and who's going to buy 'Chinese' knives from my estate.... :D /Roger
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exactly the reason i dont collect or buy xmas tins. i have no love for boxes or packaging. gets tossed in the trash, recycled if possible or used for some other purpose. i dont collect boxes and packaging. i do understand why others do though.

so i stay away from the tins, but the chinese angle doesnt bother me so much. prefer buck used a decent entry level chinese common cutlery steel such as 8cr13mov or 9cr14mov, etc steel over 420j2. minor to non existent issue for collectibles not really being used much or at all.
 
bucksway said:
Did anyone else notice the Rockwell numbers were extremely low at 52 to 55 ..Is that the lowest number ever for Buck steel? Most models are 58 to 61..
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mykel m said:
Probably the best they can do that J2 crap at.
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420J2 while "similar" to 420HC has a lower carbon content so it is going come out lower on the Rockwell. I know I've said this before but lets be real, these are inexpensive pocket knives and a premium steel on this type of knife would just be wheel spin. 420J2 sharpens easily and is perfectly adequate, the edge does not have to hold up to skinning out an Elk.....
 
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I love the tins...just not the knives that come in them. I keep my most carried knives in a couple of them on my dresser. I think it's a good thing that Buck recognizes that guys like us, who love the brand, want American made knives and addresses the issue instead of turning a blind eye. Maybe one day they'll all be made in the States, but probably not. Obviously they sell enough from China to continue to outsource there. Hopefully they are taking notes and move more models over here for manufacturing. I'm thinking the Selkirk line, which I would like but don't have due to being made in China. All in all, I would rather them perfect the USA models more than anything. Give the 300 series a stronger back spring, get the Vantages centered, fix the blade play on Spitfires, etc. With all that said, I love Buck and I'm looking forward to the Remington knives. God bless America!!!
 
Thanks Mak for the good write up above. I would suggest that several of us should save that when someone new shows up complaining about Buck overseas production and bring it forth to explain things to them. Your write up talks about the world of 'business' and many of us don't own much of a company or a big enough operation to employee a bunch of American family income earners. Yes, board members make money too but I can "hope" my suggestions are heard but I usually make them known with my decision to purchase or not purchase. I am waiting for Mr. Hubbard to make factory comments or see a catalog of Remington models and what is stamped on the blades..... I like the wood on the knives and would not feel bad about giving them to non knife people as gifts till the better one show up. You know "non knife people", those you who use a 60 grit grinder to sharpen a pocket knife.........300
 
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The Buck line-up is transitioning to USA made over the next couple years. We will have Remington made overseas. There will be USA Remington also. We have made significant improvement to the models we are keeping from the old line up and added new models to the selection. I can tell you that we are driving the factories nuts with the new quality levels we are demanding.

Jeff
 
J Hubbard said:
<SNIP> I can tell you that we are driving the factories nuts with the new quality levels we are demanding.

Jeff
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In my 38 years in industry - Power Generation, Rail and Aviation - I've seen great parts sourced from offshore. You have to watch them. But you have to be vigilant with US production as well. The farther it gets from HQ the bigger the surprises, if you let them happen. Most workers are conscientious but they also hear, "Faster and cheaper!" almost every day, so they start to take shortcuts. Some shortcuts are OK, others lead to problems. When your name is on the product you have to protect it.

I've used one Chinese Buck and my daughter has another. Both seem like good knives to me.
 
J Hubbard said:
We will have Remington made overseas. There will be USA Remington also. We have made significant improvement to the models we are keeping from the old line up and added new models to the selection
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Please please tell me this means we’re going to get an American made trapper pattern added to the 300 series. A new 311 and 312 would be awesome.

I’d also put in order for a couple of “beer scout” style... hint hint....
 
If we are voting (and I know that we are not) I like traditional slip joints a lot. Made in America. But it is Remington and Buck who make them in hopes that we buy them. They get to decide.
 
I'm going to hope that the Remington section of the Buck plant isn't up and running yet. Remington needed something to sell so Buck had them imported. Just a guess.
 
Jeff O said:
I'm going to hope that the Remington section of the Buck plant isn't up and running yet. Remington needed something to sell so Buck had them imported. Just a guess.
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All is lost huh. It doesn't bother me if Buck and Remington ha e Xmas tins from Tim buck two. They are just light on the wallet gifts that are easy to grab for consumers. Shot show should provide all the answers and I'm sure we won't be dissapointed.
 
Mak, I hope your right. I'll wait for the those knives as my kinfolks look for the made in USA on the blade. Then I'll buy. DM
 
CJ said in his statement the knives would be made in Post Falls. Remington said they will reveal the knives at shot show. Jeff Hubbard commented about quality control and the old models plus new ones built in house. I sure don't see how else this will play out but there is always skepticism. With large commitments on both sides my money is on what Buck says they are doing. Not some random tin can set of knives at cabelas.

I've only been on here roughly 2 years and haven't been disappointed yet. Maybe Buck did something in the past that has disappointed their customers.

Even the 300 series being discontinued rumor from a couple weeks ago. Turns out they can't keep them in stock.
 
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