My Hamon Process

I know this is an old thread but I always refer to it an now I have a ? When you say you dilute the ferric chloride 4:1 is that 4water and 1 ferric chloride or the other way around? Thank you in advance for any advice.
 
Ryan, Thanks so much for taking the time to do this. It's guys like you and many others that make this site what it is and the "goto site" for many of us who are just starting out. Very interesting read. I'm hoping at some point to get to this point in my knife making.

Jay
 
Richpoolboy said:
I know this is an old thread but I always refer to it an now I have a ? When you say you dilute the ferric chloride 4:1 is that 4water and 1 ferric chloride or the other way around? Thank you in advance for any advice.
Click to expand...


4 parts water. 1 part FeCl.
 
Hallo Guys,
i had a bad experience in etching with Fe3Cl... it literally ate into the hamon line to the extent i can feel the line with my fingernail.
It might have been my mistake, because in beetween the etching/polishing routine i left the oxides on for a week stop-pause in the works. I had neutralixed with windex before stopping, but when i went back to polishing and i removed the oxides yesterday i found the damned Grand Canyon!!! 1:4 Fe3Cl to water seems a good idea, and should prevent deep etching, which is not desired for this application, and i should have kept this in mind !!!
Before removing the oxides i couldn't feel any "canyon" (probably filled with oxides), so now i post this as a warning for the people who likes the oxyde finish on hamon blades...something bad may happen under that black layer!!! :thumbdn:
Now i have to get back to the 600x stone from the s.c. makeup pads & oil :(

Ryan, your knives are beautiful and Your results show a great deal for consistency and repeatibility, kudos!!!! :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:
 
Last edited:
Stezann,
The "oxides" you refer to are scale and decarb. They have to be removed on a hamon blade. They should be removed before any sanding of finishing work is done. You can remove the oxides with FC or vinegar. The decarb has to be sanded off. After they are gone, then sand the surfaces smooth and flat. 1:4 FC is OK for removing the scale, but an overnight soak in white vinegar seems to work better.

While sanding, a quick dip in 1:4FC to check the hamon would be OK, but for working on it to bring out the details, 1:10 is more suitable. Never give a hamon a long soak in any concentrated FC or the finer details may be removed. There also can be unwanted topographical effects between the hard and soft steel sections ( as you discovered).

Take it back to smooth and flush and go back up the grits to get the hamon back.
 
Last edited:
Hi Stacy,
the oxides i was referring were indeed the ones provided by the last cycle of etching/polishing when i was at the last stages of rouge/oil on makeup pads.
I would defintely follow Your advice on 1:10 ratio ;) Maybe i'll choose vinegar instead of Fe3Cl to start with.
By the way i prefer applying the etchant with a q-tip instead of soaking... in a pattern: etching-neutralizing-rubbing away the oxydes.... my error was to leave the oxides on (although neutralized) while suspending the work in progress, assuming (wrongly) that the acid action has been stopped by throughly spraying with windex :(
Stupid me also i didn't oiled the blade thinking the oxides should act as a protective barrier :( sometime i think i deserve what i get ;)
 
OK, I see what you were referring to, now. I was thinking you were leaving the forge finish on for looks. The advice was aimed at removing scale/decarb.

As you know, strong FC will take off the colors and finishes you spent hours on in shiagi togi.
Once in the final polishing and coloring, I use 1:15 FC. A very good agent for getting final details out is 1:100 diluted hydrochloric acid. Others like lemon juice or dilute white vinegar.
 
Thanks Stacy,
you are right, i must go back to my stones again!!!!
i'll try the hydrochloric. Is the nitric any good btw?
 
Ok :) i have available a mix used as the acid step in food industry for CIP: cleaning-in-place of stainless steel (316L and 304) tanks and pipelines.
The mixture is nitric30%/phosphoric21% and used as is acts on carbon steel like pitch black ink in no time :) It gives also a good passivation as protection from rust (that's the Phosphoric in it). That's from the testing on ht'ed broken scrap pieces.
I will experiment etching with VERY diluted solution to see how it behave on the hamon's details... the Fe3Cl seems to have a selective gluttony for the structure we want to enhance ;)
 
Great info I really appreciate all of you experienced knife makers taking the time to share the knowledge you have. It's invaluable
 
Beautiful work and the "how to do it" is a true gift of love for it as well as those who have helped you ! I may never use this but it is something I always admire and stop to look at.
Frank
 
Ryan,
Thanks for taking the time to post this tutorial! I'm looking to try out my first hamon in the next few weeks and this is extremely helpful!
You Rock!
 
Is there any way you could replicate this process using a gas forge instead of a h-t oven? A steel tube could possibly used to block the edge/point from the flame. I just don't know how consistent i could keep the temp. Maybe with a high temp thermocouple?
 
Old thread by it is a popular read.

You can use a forge for doing the HT on most basic carbon steel blades and get a hamon ( 1095, W2, 1070, 1080, 1084).
I use the forge more than the HT oven.
The traditional yaki-ire is done in a charcoal forge.
Many of the "pros", like Walter Sorrells, use a gas forge for their swords.
The forge doesn't need to be as long as the sword, either. You "pump" the blade in and out, getting an even color before quench ( it takes some practice).
 
If I coat all the blade in a thin coat of satanite then apply heavier coat on back of the blade all the blade is covered.so how do I check the temp of the blade?
Just magnet on blade with thin coat?
 
That is part of the practice and experience part.

It will be all be glowing even with the clay. Yes, the magnet tells you when you hit 1414F. You only want it a little hotter for yaki-ire, as the lower temps are better for attaining a hamon and give more activity. 1450F is a good target temp.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top